Don’t let the big names guide your thinking

[Diehardblues]

High upside? Gotta differ with you there brother. If he’s such a high value player, why hasn’t any NFL team signed him?

Probably concerns over injury. Wasn’t it his Achilles with Saints? That’s often a career ending situation at his age.

 

[kskboys]

I’m just saying he’s overvalued at this point in his career. He’s 42...almost 43.

I agree. Most are grossly overvaluing Brady at this point. This will soon play out in TB.

 

[Diehardblues]

Dez? Upside? Eeeek.

Sounds like your basing that on his personal distractions not his potential ability and production.

 

[Diehardblues]

I agree. Most are grossly overvaluing Brady at this point. This will soon play out in TB.

He’s two years removed from going to a Super Bowl and last year 12-4 season with worst supporting receivers in his career.

Tampa is much more loaded on offense. If Brady can stay upright even with declining skills could have a big season. What does Tampa have to lose. Haven’t made playoffs in 13 years and one of worst attendance in the league.

 

[kskboys]

Sounds like your basing that on his personal distractions not his potential ability and production.

Absolutely not, and you know me better than that. Thing is, the Dez crapp has been repeated so much, I simply saw no need to reiterate.

 

[kskboys]

He’s two years removed from going to a Super Bowl and last year 12-4 season with worst supporting receivers in his career.

Tampa is much more loaded on offense. If Brady can stay upright even with declining skills could have a big season. What does Tampa have to lose. Haven’t made playoffs in 13 years and one of worst attendance in the league.

And has been steadily regressing due to age.

 

[Diehardblues]

Absolutely not, and you know me better than that. Thing is, the Dez crapp has been repeated so much, I simply saw no need to reiterate.

I understand but for someone who’d usually place talent above all else seems like we’d at least like to see what he has left before totally dismissing him.

 

[big dog cowboy]

Dez

high upside.

Did you seriously just say Dez has high upside?

Did he suddenly grow a brain?
Did he suddenly become the athlete he used to be several years ago?
Did he suddenly learn how to run route and learn the route tree?
Did he suddenly not become a distraction and sideshow?

Sorry I just don't see it. The Cowboys can draft a WR on day 2 that would have a ton of upside, cost less than Dez, and not be the distraction Dez would be.

 

[Diehardblues]

And has been steadily regressing due to age.

I agree but regressing for him could still mean a decent year and playoffs potential for Tampa.

I’m not sure why a guy is looked down on so much if he still isn’t performing at an All World pace. His regressing level might still be enough in the right situation to at least produce more than Tampa has been in recent years. That might be worth his price tag to Bucs.

 

[kskboys]

I understand but for someone who’d usually place talent above all else seems like we’d at least like to see what he has left before totally dismissing him.

Sigh.......

Dez got by on athleticism. His injuries and refusal to rehab robbed him of that spring. No, I wouldn't care if we brought him in on a vet min contract to compete, but I think it's a waste of time and energy due to his performance the last time he played.

Did you get it this time or must I repeat it yet again?!!!!!!!

 

[kskboys]

I agree but regressing for him could still mean a decent year and playoffs potential for Tampa.

I’m not sure why a guy is looked down on so much if he still isn’t performing at an All World pace. His regressing level might still be enough in the right situation to at least produce more than Tampa has been in recent years. That might be worth his price tag to Bucs.

Sure. Could be.

Is Arians going to completely change his O? That long passing game causes a ton of QB sacks, and will get Brady injured. Won't last til midseason if they don't change the O.

 

[Diehardblues]

Sure. Could be.

Is Arians going to completely change his O? That long passing game causes a ton of QB sacks, and will get Brady injured. Won't last til midseason if they don't change the O.

Yes, Arians will have to adjust.

I get the argument. But I also see Tampa’s angle.

 

[kskboys]

Yes, Arians will have to adjust.

I get the argument. But I also see Tampa’s angle.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I don't blame TB a bit. Even at his age, he's a huge upgrade over Winston if he can stay upright. However, this topic is about him being overrated because he's a big name. Most fans are overrating him at this point, which is in synch w/ the topic.

 

[johneric8]

One of the habits I see many fans here, and even many sports writers that cover the NFL fall into is this bad habit: Thinking a “big name” player- even just a player that they have heard of is a good acquisition.

We see it here all the time. Recommending we sign some “has been” guy who was good 5 years ago in their mid to late 20s but are a shadow of what they used to be. And they are often more expensive because of their prior fame and performance, yet past their ability to deliver the performance that justifies their pay.

Here are some recent examples of formerly good/great players that many overvalue because of their name recognition:

• Dez Bryant- Having a 32 year old recent injury prone player is just a bad idea. If he were from another team, the calls to bring him back would be less. Emotional connection to a former player are strong. But you can still love Dez and what he did here without signing him.

• Ndamukong Suh- He was once a dominant force who was worth the price tag. Now at 33, while still good, he’s no longer near dominant. But too many fans see his name and assume it would be nice to get a big name like that.

• Tom Brady- he’s probably the GOAT. But he’s not what he used to be, and at 42, physical abilities can disappear almost instantly. Believing that Brady would be a good signing here was crazy to me because he’s a shadow of what he was and thinking he could “carry” a team now was shown to be not so evident in last year’s stretch run and playoffs. The bucs signed him for two years. I doubt he makes it that long.

• Jadaveon Clowney- JC is actually still in his prime, but he’s not dominant enough IMO to match his price tag. His talent remains, but he’s never been consistent enough to match the pub he got from being the #1 pick in the draft in 2015. He’s a big name who still has game, but he’s not worth what he’s asking. Otherwise he would’ve already been signed.

• Clay Matthews- once great. Too many miles on the treads. He turns 34 in May. Wouldn’t be surprised if he’s played his last NFL game.

This list could go on and on...every year.

Here’s the encouraging thing though- there are tons of talented young players (mostly in the draft) that most of us have never heard of that will be future All Pros or maybe even a HOFer or two. The future is NOT in the past. Our future stars will most likely not be former stars from somewhere else. They will be NEW stars here! Don’t let the big names fool you. Most big names that are still available right now are not signed for a reason.

I love how you put out opinions eloquently bob, but it doesn't change that fact that your wrong and a nut roller.. For one thing, when you say we have a "habit" of gravitating toward big players because of their past performance I find this insulting in the sense that you know better in which you don't....

Lets look at some past big names whom killed it, and if it wasn't for someone whom optimistically took a chance greatness may of never been achieved or allowed to exist. You can't say that Clowney won't be worth a high price tag, you are only guessing based off of a some injuries and a down year. It sounds to me like you would never be a successful business man because of your unwillingness to gamble.

Let me give you some examples of players whom excelled after some down time...

Ben Rothehlisberger
been accused by two women of sexual assault. While his indiscretions never led to legal troubles, Goodell suspended him for the first four games of the 2010 season.
The suspension hardly hurt Big Ben. He led the Pittsburgh Steelers to the Super Bowl following his suspension, and has worked hard to improve his image over the past year.

Peyton Manning
Perhaps no one in recent memory has enjoyed his second chance as much as Denver Broncos quarterback Peyton Manning.
Manning's 14 years with the Indianapolis Colts were historic. He led the franchise to a Super Bowl win, all while molding himself into the league's best quarterback. Dating back to the moment he was drafted, it was hard to picture Manning wearing anything else but his No. 18 blue and white jersey.

That sentiment changed after he underwent a series of neck surgeries. Without their leader, the Colts plummeted to the bottom of the AFC South that season and landed the No. 1 pick in the 2012 NFL draft.
You could sense a changing of the guard was in the air. A few months later, Peyton was out and a young kid out of Stanford named Andrew Luck was in. Manning said goodbye to his former team and made his way over to the Broncos.
All he's done since putting on a Broncos uniform is shatter all sorts of passing records and lead the Broncos to back-to-back 13-3 seasons—including one Super Bowl appearance.
We won't ever see another quarterback like Peyton Manning again. Even after neck surgery and his departure from the only place he called home, he's still out there heaving touchdown passes.

Bottom line, let the coaches figure this stuff out man, quit telling us what we should or shouldn't want.

 

[kskboys]

I love how you put out opinions eloquently bob, but it doesn't change that fact that your wrong and a nut roller.. For one thing, when you say we have a "habit" of gravitating toward big players because of their past performance I find this insulting in the sense that you know better in which you don't....

Lets look at some past big names whom killed it, and if it wasn't for someone whom optimistically took a chance greatness may of never been achieved or allowed to exist. You can't say that Clowney won't be worth a high price tag, you are only guessing based off of a some injuries and a down year. It sounds to me like you would never be a successful business man because of your unwillingness to gamble.

Let me give you some examples of players whom excelled after some down time...

Ben Rothehlisberger
been accused by two women of sexual assault. While his indiscretions never led to legal troubles, Goodell suspended him for the first four games of the 2010 season.
The suspension hardly hurt Big Ben. He led the Pittsburgh Steelers to the Super Bowl following his suspension, and has worked hard to improve his image over the past year.

Peyton Manning
Perhaps no one in recent memory has enjoyed his second chance as much as Denver Broncos quarterback Peyton Manning.
Manning's 14 years with the Indianapolis Colts were historic. He led the franchise to a Super Bowl win, all while molding himself into the league's best quarterback. Dating back to the moment he was drafted, it was hard to picture Manning wearing anything else but his No. 18 blue and white jersey.

That sentiment changed after he underwent a series of neck surgeries. Without their leader, the Colts plummeted to the bottom of the AFC South that season and landed the No. 1 pick in the 2012 NFL draft.
You could sense a changing of the guard was in the air. A few months later, Peyton was out and a young kid out of Stanford named Andrew Luck was in. Manning said goodbye to his former team and made his way over to the Broncos.
All he's done since putting on a Broncos uniform is shatter all sorts of passing records and lead the Broncos to back-to-back 13-3 seasons—including one Super Bowl appearance.
We won't ever see another quarterback like Peyton Manning again. Even after neck surgery and his departure from the only place he called home, he's still out there heaving touchdown passes.

Bottom line, let the coaches figure this stuff out man, quit telling us what we should or shouldn't want.

RE your last sentence. You're on a fan forum, dude. We talk about what we think incessantly. Very strange to tell people to stop analyzing and evaluating what we think.

 

[johneric8]

RE your last sentence. You're on a fan forum, dude. We talk about what we think incessantly. Very strange to tell people to stop analyzing and evaluating what we think.

Wrong, I'm asking him to stop telling other how to think.. I feel like he opens up good discussions, but I also feel like he has made up his mind and is forgetful of the past.

 

[Bobhaze]

I love how you put out opinions eloquently bob, but it doesn't change that fact that your wrong and a nut roller.. For one thing, when you say we have a "habit" of gravitating toward big players because of their past performance I find this insulting in the sense that you know better in which you don't....

Lets look at some past big names whom killed it, and if it wasn't for someone whom optimistically took a chance greatness may of never been achieved or allowed to exist. You can't say that Clowney won't be worth a high price tag, you are only guessing based off of a some injuries and a down year. It sounds to me like you would never be a successful business man because of your unwillingness to gamble.

Let me give you some examples of players whom excelled after some down time...

Ben Rothehlisberger
been accused by two women of sexual assault. While his indiscretions never led to legal troubles, Goodell suspended him for the first four games of the 2010 season.
The suspension hardly hurt Big Ben. He led the Pittsburgh Steelers to the Super Bowl following his suspension, and has worked hard to improve his image over the past year.

Peyton Manning
Perhaps no one in recent memory has enjoyed his second chance as much as Denver Broncos quarterback Peyton Manning.
Manning's 14 years with the Indianapolis Colts were historic. He led the franchise to a Super Bowl win, all while molding himself into the league's best quarterback. Dating back to the moment he was drafted, it was hard to picture Manning wearing anything else but his No. 18 blue and white jersey.

That sentiment changed after he underwent a series of neck surgeries. Without their leader, the Colts plummeted to the bottom of the AFC South that season and landed the No. 1 pick in the 2012 NFL draft.
You could sense a changing of the guard was in the air. A few months later, Peyton was out and a young kid out of Stanford named Andrew Luck was in. Manning said goodbye to his former team and made his way over to the Broncos.
All he's done since putting on a Broncos uniform is shatter all sorts of passing records and lead the Broncos to back-to-back 13-3 seasons—including one Super Bowl appearance.
We won't ever see another quarterback like Peyton Manning again. Even after neck surgery and his departure from the only place he called home, he's still out there heaving touchdown passes.

Bottom line, let the coaches figure this stuff out man, quit telling us what we should or shouldn't want.

You can believe what ever you choose to Johneric. I’m just throwing out my opinions like everyone else here. Just like your passionate opinion above. It’s all good man.

 

[johneric8]

You can believe what ever you choose to Johneric. I’m just throwing out my opinions like everyone else here. Just like your passionate opinion above. It’s all good man.

Like I said man, I like your post, they're well written and thought out, but sometimes it seems like your content seems a little one sided in the sense that you've made your mind up about things. I don't feel like your post was set up for debate as much as it was to dictate. I'm normally pretty easy going about post of all kinds, but I think sometimes I see ones that get my goat a bit, not so much because it disagrees with my line of thinking, but more or less how it approaches it's conclusions. For every example you can give, I can give another. I believe you should be more trusting of coaches and fans when they feel like there might be some "Meat on the Bone" left

I get it though, lets don't get caught up in big names, lets look at where that player's head, body and mind is at TODAY. But what you purpose is to forget about these great talents and put your money on the rookies whom have yet to prove a thing in the nfl. Sure they're cheaper, but a risk is a risk. You pay a rookie the min and they suck no harm no foul, but on the flip side if you pass over on a talented vet whom kills it for another team (AKA Randy Moss) that was a risk you didn't take that could of costed you a super bowl. I still disagree with many in regards to Dez, instead of writing him off, lets see how it shakes out.

 

[RoboQB]

Brady got eliminated by the Titans

Eliminated by the hottest team during the last 6 weeks
leading into the playoffs. Oh, the shame... lol/smh

We lost to Sam Darnold and the Jets.

 

[buybuydandavis]

Honestly brother, I think teams aren’t interested in him because....he’s just not NFL quality talent any more.

How would they know, without bringing him in? He's not a thousand years old. He's always been an athletic freak. He had a meh year as chronically injured #1 in his last year, but that's with meh WRs around him, and that's *as a #1*, not a #3.

I don't know how they could claim to know that 2 years later, but healthy, he couldn't be a good #3.