Don’t let the big names guide your thinking

[Kaiser]

Good point OP. I would put Snacks Harrison at the top of the list, everyone remembers him as the dominant player he was for the Giants but he is a shell of that now.

Also the thing with Clowney is more about motivation, its a hard call because he is so physically talented that he can coast at times and still dominate in others. Randy Moss was like that but with more talent and at a skill position.

 

[Diehardblues]

Clowney will prob realize he’s asking for too much and end up signing with Hawks.

I’d prob sign him for a 1 or 2 year deal for what he’ll end up settling for.

 

[Diehardblues]

And Dez will be a walk-on FA bargain. Who could you sign for the min wage with as much talent?

If he doesn’t still have it , cut him in camp.

 

[quickccc]

I agree. Pats will be making a move in 1st round. They don’t expect to get lucky in later rounds again.

And they would have let Brady go before if he hadn’t signed team friendly deals.

Can't say i agree with that.

i think they were lucky that Brady didn't press the issue vs what Dak camp is doing now because he of all people could have hldl Pats hostage
with whatever he would have demanded ..and got it.

i'd give up 30 million if i know it stand a chance to get us winning yet another SB, but this time there had to be some dissention in the ranks, and
the Pats are usually pretty good keeping matters tight lipped.

but i think something big went down with Jimmy G trade that may have jump started it..and awhile back there was a rumor on draft day that the Pats were considering drafting QB Lamar Jackson.

 

[john van brocklin]

One of the habits I see many fans here, and even many sports writers that cover the NFL fall into is this bad habit: Thinking a “big name” player- even just a player that they have heard of is a good acquisition.

We see it here all the time. Recommending we sign some “has been” guy who was good 5 years ago in their mid to late 20s but are a shadow of what they used to be. And they are often more expensive because of their prior fame and performance, yet past their ability to deliver the performance that justifies their pay.

Here are some recent examples of formerly good/great players that many overvalue because of their name recognition:

• Dez Bryant- Having a 32 year old recent injury prone player is just a bad idea. If he were from another team, the calls to bring him back would be less. Emotional connection to a former player are strong. But you can still love Dez and what he did here without signing him.

• Ndamukong Suh- He was once a dominant force who was worth the price tag. Now at 33, while still good, he’s no longer near dominant. But too many fans see his name and assume it would be nice to get a big name like that.

• Tom Brady- he’s probably the GOAT. But he’s not what he used to be, and at 42, physical abilities can disappear almost instantly. Believing that Brady would be a good signing here was crazy to me because he’s a shadow of what he was and thinking he could “carry” a team now was shown to be not so evident in last year’s stretch run and playoffs. The bucs signed him for two years. I doubt he makes it that long.

• Jadaveon Clowney- JC is actually still in his prime, but he’s not dominant enough IMO to match his price tag. His talent remains, but he’s never been consistent enough to match the pub he got from being the #1 pick in the draft in 2015. He’s a big name who still has game, but he’s not worth what he’s asking. Otherwise he would’ve already been signed.

• Clay Matthews- once great. Too many miles on the treads. He turns 34 in May. Wouldn’t be surprised if he’s played his last NFL game.

This list could go on and on...every year.

Here’s the encouraging thing though- there are tons of talented young players (mostly in the draft) that most of us have never heard of that will be future All Pros or maybe even a HOFer or two. The future is NOT in the past. Our future stars will most likely not be former stars from somewhere else. They will be NEW stars here! Don’t let the big names fool you. Most big names that are still available right now are not signed for a reason.

Good stuff Bob!
Keep posting, it keeps our morale up!

 

[Diehardblues]

Can't say i agree with that.

i think they were lucky that Brady didn't press the issue vs what Dak camp is doing now because he of all people could have hldl Pats hostage
with whatever he would have demanded ..and got it.

i'd give up 30 million if i know it stand a chance to get us winning yet another SB, but this time there had to be some dissention in the ranks, and
the Pats are usually pretty good keeping matters tight lipped.

but i think something big went down with Jimmy G trade that may have jump started it..and awhile back there was a rumor on draft day that the Pats were considering drafting QB Lamar Jackson.

Bill has proven he’s not over paying anyone . And they know Toms best days are up. Time to move on.

 

[Knotamus]

I agree with the OP..

my only caveat is Dez. And yes, I realize he’s a shell of himself and dosent run great routes, but I wouldn’t be asking him to be the starting 3. I’d simply want him doing what he’s always been good at... In the Redzone, I’d want him to be physical and out jump his man. Situational I could see him attracting attention and at the very least.. the secondary wouldn’t be able to cover Gallup, Cooper, Zeke, Dez, and (plug in rookie Wr). Not to mention he’s always been an emotional lightning rod that fires up the offense. I seriously could see him with 30+ catches and 6-8TDs playing this role.
The catch is.. how much would Dez want and would he be willing to play such a role. At his age and injury history.. I can’t see how he could demand much more. The plus for him is.. he’d be able to capture a lil of his glory days playing in Dallas after every TD and contribute to winning. One thing I know ab Dez.. Dallas fans loved him and he loved the attention just as much. Even at a reduced role, I believed he would be satisfied. Atleast I would.

side note: he could contribute to ST’s also.. as a return man w/punts and kickoffs

 

[Bobhaze]

Then why is he in the discussion?

And he makes the Bucs an instant playoff contender.

Greggo, it says in second paragraph: “Here are some recent examples of formerly good/great players that many overvalue because of their name recognition:” Doesn’t say they were signed or unsigned. The topic is about overvaluing name talent regardless of their current contract status.

 

[Diehardblues]

Greggo, it says in second paragraph: “Here are some recent examples of formerly good/great players that many overvalue because of their name recognition:” Doesn’t say they were signed or unsigned. The topic is about overvaluing name talent regardless of their current contract status.

Oh sorry. I thought it was meant for players we might be considering who are over valued and why I was puzzled why Brady would be in that group.

Furthermore he’s already been contracted so it kind of disproves this notion.

 

[Diehardblues]

I agree with the OP..

my only caveat is Dez. And yes, I realize he’s a shell of himself and dosent run great routes, but I wouldn’t be asking him to be the starting 3. I’d simply want him doing what he’s always been good at... In the Redzone, I’d want him to be physical and out jump his man. Situational I could see him attracting attention and at the very least.. the secondary wouldn’t be able to cover Gallup, Cooper, Zeke, Dez, and (plug in rookie Wr). Not to mention he’s always been an emotional lightning rod that fires up the offense. I seriously could see him with 30+ catches and 6-8TDs playing this role.
The catch is.. how much would Dez want and would he be willing to play such a role. At his age and injury history.. I can’t see how he could demand much more. The plus for him is.. he’d be able to capture a lil of his glory days playing in Dallas after every TD and contribute to winning. One thing I know ab Dez.. Dallas fans loved him and he loved the attention just as much. Even at a reduced role, I believed he would be satisfied. Atleast I would.

side note: he could contribute to ST’s also.. as a return man w/punts and kickoffs

Yea, Dez doesn’t seem to fit in this group cause you won’t have to over pay for him. He’ll be a bargain. Just a matter can he still play.

 

[buybuydandavis]

Here are some recent examples of formerly good/great players that many overvalue because of their name recognition:

• Dez Bryant- Having a 32 year old recent injury prone player is just a bad idea. If he were from another team, the calls to bring him back would be less. Emotional connection to a former player are strong. But you can still love Dez and what he did here without signing him.

The only downside of Dez is that he *has* played here before. If not, he'd have Cowboys written all over him.

A guy who missed last season, so doesn't count against comp picks. A guy largely rejected by much of the league, and who wants to be here first. He'd cost nothing if he stayed, and we wouldn't have to risk much bonus either.

Low cost, high upside. We might even get a comp pick on the back end if he looks good this year. And he fulfills our clear needs as a veteran WR to back up our starters, and an in traffic, large catch radius, tough to bring down WR for the redzone and possession downs.

Cheap, fulfills particular needs, low cost, high upside, veteran backup. If it weren't Dez, we'd have already signed him.

 

[buybuydandavis]

Yea, Dez doesn’t seem to fit in this group cause you won’t have to over pay for him. He’ll be a bargain. Just a matter can he still play.

Similarly, if those guys came as cheap as Dez is likely to, the entire risk/reward ratio changes, and we should jump at them.

 

[Bobhaze]

The only downside of Dez is that he *has* played here before. If not, he'd have Cowboys written all over him.

A guy who missed last season, so doesn't count against comp picks. A guy largely rejected by much of the league, and who wants to be here first. He'd cost nothing if he stayed, and we wouldn't have to risk much bonus either.

Low cost, high upside. We might even get a comp pick on the back end if he looks good this year. And he fulfills our clear needs as a veteran WR to back up our starters, and an in traffic, large catch radius, tough to bring down WR for the redzone and possession downs.

Cheap, fulfills particular needs, low cost, high upside, veteran backup. If it weren't Dez, we'd have already signed him.

High upside? Gotta differ with you there brother. If he’s such a high value player, why hasn’t any NFL team signed him?

 

[Bobhaze]

Oh sorry. I thought it was meant for players we might be considering who are over valued and why I was puzzled why Brady would be in that group.

Furthermore he’s already been contracted so it kind of disproves this notion.

I’m just saying he’s overvalued at this point in his career. He’s 42...almost 43.

 

[JoeKing]

The "big name" player that Cowboys fans need to get past is Jason Witten. Mike McCarthy did the right thing by letting him walk and allowing Jarwin a bigger role. The other "big name" is Dez Bryant, what a hype job the media is doing for this has been. No thank you.

 

[Verdict]

One of the habits I see many fans here, and even many sports writers that cover the NFL fall into is this bad habit: Thinking a “big name” player- even just a player that they have heard of is a good acquisition.

We see it here all the time. Recommending we sign some “has been” guy who was good 5 years ago in their mid to late 20s but are a shadow of what they used to be. And they are often more expensive because of their prior fame and performance, yet past their ability to deliver the performance that justifies their pay.

Here are some recent examples of formerly good/great players that many overvalue because of their name recognition:

• Dez Bryant- Having a 32 year old recent injury prone player is just a bad idea. If he were from another team, the calls to bring him back would be less. Emotional connection to a former player are strong. But you can still love Dez and what he did here without signing him.

• Ndamukong Suh- He was once a dominant force who was worth the price tag. Now at 33, while still good, he’s no longer near dominant. But too many fans see his name and assume it would be nice to get a big name like that.

• Tom Brady- he’s probably the GOAT. But he’s not what he used to be, and at 42, physical abilities can disappear almost instantly. Believing that Brady would be a good signing here was crazy to me because he’s a shadow of what he was and thinking he could “carry” a team now was shown to be not so evident in last year’s stretch run and playoffs. The bucs signed him for two years. I doubt he makes it that long.

• Jadaveon Clowney- JC is actually still in his prime, but he’s not dominant enough IMO to match his price tag. His talent remains, but he’s never been consistent enough to match the pub he got from being the #1 pick in the draft in 2015. He’s a big name who still has game, but he’s not worth what he’s asking. Otherwise he would’ve already been signed.

• Clay Matthews- once great. Too many miles on the treads. He turns 34 in May. Wouldn’t be surprised if he’s played his last NFL game.

This list could go on and on...every year.

Here’s the encouraging thing though- there are tons of talented young players (mostly in the draft) that most of us have never heard of that will be future All Pros or maybe even a HOFer or two. The future is NOT in the past. Our future stars will most likely not be former stars from somewhere else. They will be NEW stars here! Don’t let the big names fool you. Most big names that are still available right now are not signed for a reason.

More good stuff. I’m a little bit worried McCoy may be just a name at this point, but the price was right. Hopefully he can still bring it.

 

[buybuydandavis]

High upside? Gotta differ with you there brother. If he’s such a high value player, why hasn’t any NFL team signed him?

High upside relative to cost, which I would expect around 2 mil.

Why haven't others signed him? Interesting question to ask them. I'd sign him.

To be fair, I don't know what money he's asking for or who has or hasn't contacted him or made offers. I don't know if he's even considered the rest of the league. The only teams he has mentioned are the Cowboys, the Saints, and the Ravens. Teams that have actually made offers to him. Maybe other teams have made offers and he has rejected them.

Let's assume no team is interested at 2mil. I'd speculate it could be because they think negatively of him as a team presence. "Locker room cancer." He got a lot of bad press in the last couple of years. Some of it deserved, some not so much. There's also that given he's a downroster player at this point, teams likely want to see what the draft turns up before evaluating if they have a need for him.

 

[Bobhaze]

High upside relative to cost, which I would expect around 2 mil.

Why haven't others signed him? Interesting question to ask them. I'd sign him.

To be fair, I don't know what money he's asking for or who has or hasn't contacted him or made offers. I don't know if he's even considered the rest of the league. The only teams he has mentioned are the Cowboys, the Saints, and the Ravens. Teams that have actually made offers to him. Maybe other teams have made offers and he has rejected them.

Let's assume no team is interested at 2mil. I'd speculate it could be because they think negatively of him as a team presence. "Locker room cancer." He got a lot of bad press in the last couple of years. Some of it deserved, some not so much. There's also that given he's a downroster player at this point, teams likely want to see what the draft turns up before evaluating if they have a need for him.

Honestly brother, I think teams aren’t interested in him because....he’s just not NFL quality talent any more.

 

[kskboys]

High upside? Gotta differ with you there brother. If he’s such a high value player, why hasn’t any NFL team signed him?

Dez? Upside? Eeeek.

 

[Diehardblues]

I’m just saying he’s overvalued at this point in his career. He’s 42...almost 43.

IDK. Bucs has one of the lowest attendance in NFL and haven’t made the playoffs in 13 years. Only the Browns have a longer streak.

I’d argue Brady even in declining mode at this point in his career ( probably more than anyone on your list) provides the Bucs a reasonable shot at playoffs this year and potentially presents a good return on Tampa’s investment.