Cowherd’s interesting take on Dalton

[Doomsday101]

Oh common. ......... you want to be in a "foxhole" with a guy who sucked against every good team we played and choked badly with a division title on the line? He got outplayed by Wentz who was working with far less talent.

any day of the week. Dak probably should not have played in the philly game after sustaining an injury to his shoulder during the Rams game the week before where Dallas had destroyed the Rams 44 to 21.

 

[PAPPYDOG]

They hate this video even more @PAPPYDOG @leeblair

Let me guess without even watching this video that most of the highlights are against DOG TEAMS like the Giants and Skins?
Man tremble in your boots as your Dak days at the Star are almost over!!!

P.S. Wonder where those highlights are of Dak gutting out Playoff teams without it being GARBAGE TIME?

 

[ondaedg]

Dak is above average but below elite in my opinion. But you think whatever you want. The video is still just a cherry picked item no matter how you slice it.

Dak has the 5th best all-time TD:INT ratio and 5th best all-time rating. Not exactly screaming above average.

Is he elite? He has been performing at an elite level but generally elite players do it for many years. So Dak can easily be considered knocking at elite's door especially if he puts up back to back big seasons.

 

[Canada180]

The thing is. Dak’s accuracy really isn’t worse than any other top 10 QB’s. There are a few QB’s who have even better accuracy than he does. But Dak’s accuracy really isn’t a weakness that holds him back. All the metrics actually point this out.

You mention that you see throws that he misses and throws high or behind. The thing is. You see all of Dak’s throws because as a cowboys fan you probably see every cowboys game. Other QB’s maybe you watch a handful of times a year but not all 16 games.

as a cowboys fan you probably pay closer attention to Cowboys games than other games too.

So now since you watch every cowboys game, and pay close attention to every cowboys game, Every time you see Dak miss a throw, you think about it and use it to conform your bias against his accuracy that is already built into your mind.

other fans on this board do the same thing.

my guess is, when you watch some other QB’s play 3-4 times a year. You don’t sit there and confirm a bias against their accuracy everytime they miss a throw. Even though they are also missing throws.

If you actually pull up subjective statistical analysis of Dak’a accuracy. His accuracy is top 10 in the league in most metrics.

I understand it’s frustrating when Dak does miss a throw and it costs the team and negatively impacts the teams chance to win.

But that happens with basically every QB in the league. And it doesn’t happen more often with Dak than it does basically every other QB in the league other than a hand full of them.

Well my friend I hope you are right. I can be objective and give Dak the eyeball test a little more gently. But if you're wrong you owe me a beer!

 

[DallasEast]

Sure. Whatever. I don't care.
It's gotten supremely boring around here with peeps just saying the same thing over and over.
The same people say the same things to each other to no avail.
The same arguments strike both sides to no avail.

And then it's repeated. And then it's repeated.

"It's gotten?" "It has gotten?" My friend, I could argue 'it has gotten' began in 2008.

Daily football discussion could be gameday scenarios. Opponents' strengths and weaknesses. Effective/ineffective offensive/defensive formations. Critical breakdown and debate why this play worked and why that play did not. What did he see before throwing that pass? Who lost containment? Where did the pass rush come from? How good is his leg really from 35 yards out? Why was he out of position? Is he a liability tackling within five yards of the line of scrimmage? Was the ball catchable? Is this guy an asset on special teams coverage?

There's tons more conversation points. Literally. Of course there is. Football is a team game filled with many moving parts but this is CowboysZone. For well over a decade, one or two players are isolated, head coach too (mainly), and the bulk of active conversation from just a dozen or so members goes essentially like this:

Member A: "He's bad. He does this this and this poorly."
Member B: "He's good because he does this this and this well."

Member C: "Actually both of you make some good points in what you are saying."

Members A & B: "Shaddup! I'm right! They're wrong! And I will CRUSH them into saying I am right by posting my position practically every day, multiple times per day, for years to come!"



lol. CowboysZone did develop a silver lining though. A handful of revolutionaries, who used to create marathon threads and posts, for recruiting countless thousands of people through the internet, with the sole intention of coercing billionaire Jerry Jones into bowing down with weakly-conceived strategies, have basically vanished. Those were the good old days of CowboysZone. Fun times...

 

[HungryLion]

Well my friend I hope you are right. I can be objective and give Dak the eyeball test a little more gently. But if you're wrong you owe me a beer!

It’s all good man.

I get it. I get the concerns over the contract too. It’s fair to be worried about the cap implications and how it will affect the overall team.

(though I do think some people are obsessing over it far too much).

 

[OmerV]

you just sound pathetic. You think Dak liked being embarrassed by Carr if front of the whole country so he didn’t try ? The only difference here is he couldn’t hide his deficiencies by handing off to Zeke.

Aren't you an angry little man.

Now, tell me this … why would a game with a couple of guys horsing around be a more important judge of a QB than actually playing the position, in pads, in actual games, with pass rusher's bearing down and decisions to be made?

You see, Dak has been much more accurate in those situations than either David Carr or Jason Garrett ever were. But that doesn't matter right?

 

[NotForLong]

the post doesn't rip it apart, if an idiot can't read it and understand his accuracy in fine when it needs to be, then keep being illiterate

The whole post is Jerry being honest about Dak's Crappy Accuracy.

Then goes into Jerry speak about how mind blowing it is that Dak has any kind of Success in a game.

 

[OmerV]

Dak for sure had games where he dropped dimes up and down the field like against Minnesota. The problem is he doesn’t do that consistently. Especially against the better teams. It is not unusual for him to get shut out of the end-zone! You will argue for sure but to deny that is pure emotion driving your opinion on his demands being paid #1 QB money.

Minnesota actually was one of the better teams they played. Besides, while it's true there were some struggles last year, but not just with Dak, but with the entire team (it's always ridiculous to blame all things on the QB), over his career Dak as been one of the more accurate passers in the NFL, and picking and choosing Dak in his worst moments is not a fair or accurate measure.

But even looking at last year, he was 78% the first time against Philly, 65% against Buffalo and 65% against the Rams. He was only 57% against NE, but in that same game in the same bad weather, Brady was 46%.

I know, completion % doesn't tell all things, and I agree with that, but we don't really have another impartial way to judge accuracy. Some will refer to the "eye test", but that is incredibly unreliable. Just one or two notably bad throws can plant a perception in the mind of a human, who, because those throws stick in his brain, then imagines that happening much more than it really does. Personal biases come into play as well.

What I will agree on is that Dak needs to improve on crossing patterns. It's a timing thing, and he throws behind a little too often. Usually the ball is catchable, though not always, but even when catchable, it still impacts the momentum of the receiver and his opportunity to gain yards after the catch.

 

[Corso]

"It's gotten?" "It has gotten?" My friend, I could argue 'it has gotten' began in 2008.

Daily football discussion could be gameday scenarios. Opponents' strengths and weaknesses. Effective/ineffective offensive/defensive formations. Critical breakdown and debate why this play worked and why that play did not. What did he see before throwing that pass? Who lost containment? Where did the pass rush come from? How good is his leg really from 35 yards out? Why was he out of position? Is he a liability tackling within five yards of the line of scrimmage? Was the ball catchable? Is this guy an asset on special teams coverage?

There's tons more conversation points. Literally. Of course there is. Football is a team game filled with many moving parts but this is CowboysZone. For well over a decade, one or two players are isolated, head coach too (mainly), and the bulk of active conversation from just a dozen or so members goes essentially like this:

Member A: "He's bad. He does this this and this poorly."
Member B: "He's good because he does this this and this well."

Member C: "Actually both of you make some good points in what you are saying."

Members A & B: "Shaddup! I'm right! They're wrong! And I will CRUSH them into saying I am right by posting my position practically every day, multiple times per day, for years to come!"



lol. CowboysZone did develop a silver lining though. A handful of revolutionaries, who used to create marathon threads and posts, for recruiting countless thousands of people through the internet, with the sole intention of coercing billionaire Jerry Jones into bowing down with weakly-conceived strategies, have basically vanished. Those were the good old days of CowboysZone. Fun times...

Wait- there are other discussions to be had? Lol... you're losing it.

 

[NotForLong]

The thing is. Dak’s accuracy really isn’t worse than any other top 10 QB’s. There are a few QB’s who have even better accuracy than he does. But Dak’s accuracy really isn’t a weakness that holds him back. All the metrics actually point this out.

You mention that you see throws that he misses and throws high or behind. The thing is. You see all of Dak’s throws because as a cowboys fan you probably see every cowboys game. Other QB’s maybe you watch a handful of times a year but not all 16 games.

as a cowboys fan you probably pay closer attention to Cowboys games than other games too.

So now since you watch every cowboys game, and pay close attention to every cowboys game, Every time you see Dak miss a throw, you think about it and use it to conform your bias against his accuracy that is already built into your mind.

other fans on this board do the same thing.

my guess is, when you watch some other QB’s play 3-4 times a year. You don’t sit there and confirm a bias against their accuracy everytime they miss a throw. Even though they are also missing throws.

If you actually pull up subjective statistical analysis of Dak’a accuracy. His accuracy is top 10 in the league in most metrics.

I understand it’s frustrating when Dak does miss a throw and it costs the team and negatively impacts the teams chance to win.

But that happens with basically every QB in the league. And it doesn’t happen more often with Dak than it does basically every other QB in the league other than a hand full of them.

Problem is people who criticize Dak, do it based on thier eyes. People who defend him do it with stats.

In todays Bubble Gum/ Bubble Wrap NFL completion percentage is over rated. Dink & Dunk Dak should have a high percentage rate, but that stat is in no way a factor in determining accuracy

 

[iceberg]

Eh... same discussions by the same people that have been saying the things for months/years about old boy.
Boring actually.

nope. just another tool used to support either sides argument and no one is still budging. either on the contract itself or the typical "fan stance" of it.

 

[OmerV]

Problem is people who criticize Dak, do it based on thier eyes. People who defend him do it with stats.

In todays Bubble Gum/ Bubble Wrap NFL completion percentage is over rated. Dink & Dunk Dak should have a high percentage rate, but that stat is in no way a factor in determining accuracy

Eyes are also overrated. Biases come into play, and even one really bad throw can stick in a person's mind and cause him to imagine that kind of throw is more common than it is. So, while I agree using completion % has flaws, it is at least isn't a subjective standard

 

[csirl]

Daks mechanics are stiff and forced. Should be a lot more fluid after 4 years starting.

 

[xwalker]

Wow! That was bad.

Go to 1:25 in the video. Dak wins on the longer throws...

 

[Swagger]

This was actually my first time seeing this clip. I like Dak as a person but even he looked slightly embarrassed and I kinda felt bad.

I agree. I felt embarrassed for him.

 

[NotForLong]

Eyes are also overrated. Biases come into play, and even one really bad throw can stick in a person's mind and cause him to imagine that kind of throw is more common than it is. So, while I agree using completion % has flaws, it is at least isn't a subjective standard

Stop it.
You are implying its Psychological "deep seeded". It's not 1 pass. You are using this as your straw man. Those who criticize Dak are doing it subjectively.

Completion percentage is not subjective at all. There are too many variables to Factor in.
(Coaching, WR talent, offensive scheames, weather conditions, Strength of schedule, opposing defensive rankings, O Line Talent, Backfield talent, if QB takes 6 seconds to survey the field just to check down . . . etc. . . etc.

I never look at the stat line I watch the games. Ever since all the rule changes the Stats are worthless indicators.

Hence the Enigma that is Dak

 

[HungryLion]

Problem is people who criticize Dak, do it based on thier eyes. People who defend him do it with stats.

In todays Bubble Gum/ Bubble Wrap NFL completion percentage is over rated. Dink & Dunk Dak should have a high percentage rate, but that stat is in no way a factor in determining accuracy

Re read my post. It explains what “seeing it with your eyes” means.

Also, Dak doesn’t dink and dunk. He doesn’t at all. So you saying that just proves you have no clue what you’re talking about.

There are also a lot more advanced metrics than just completion percentage that shows Dak’a
Accuracy overall is well above average for NFL starting QB’s.

 

[Polkton31]

Stop it.
You are implying its Psychological "deep seeded". It's not 1 pass. You are using this as your straw man. Those who criticize Dak are doing it SELECTIVELY.

Completion percentage is not subjective at all. There are too many variables to Factor in.
(Coaching, WR talent, offensive scheames, weather conditions, Strength of schedule, opposing defensive rankings, O Line Talent, Backfield talent, if QB takes 6 seconds to survey the field just to check down . . . etc. . . etc.

I never look at the stat line I watch the games. Ever since all the rule changes the Stats are worthless indicators.

Hence the Enigma that is Dak

Fixed it for you.

 

[morat1959]

Problem is people who criticize Dak, do it based on thier eyes. People who defend him do it with stats.

In todays Bubble Gum/ Bubble Wrap NFL completion percentage is over rated. Dink & Dunk Dak should have a high percentage rate, but that stat is in no way a factor in determining accuracy

THIS!