Cap ramifications of tagging and trading Dak?

[TheMarathonContinues]

Dallas has shown they can’t build a team even when they paid him $465k a year. Signing Dak or not will lead to the same disappointing results.

I mean yeah that's a way to look at it lol...I'm gonna play the role of blind homer though and hope things change somehow lol.

 

[Aviano90]

I mean yeah that's a way to look at it lol...I'm gonna play the role of blind homer though and hope things change somehow lol.

Understand

 

[jterrell]

First a player on non-exclusive franchise tag that has signed the offer sheet and then agrees to a long term contract from another team, that exact contract has to be presented to the team who assigned the tag and if they decline to match it the player then is required to sign that contract from the other team without any changes to the contract and the original team then automatically get 2 first round picks from the team that sign the player to a long term contract. Both teams have to submit the contracts to the league and it the signed contract is different in anyway the contract is voided and the player is sent back to the team that offered the tag. That has happened only once. It was later cleared up with the player signing the exact contract originally submitted for matching.
.
.

Not sure what language that is but it is meaningless.

The Dallas Cowboys can tag Dak as exclusive or non-exclusive but it only reduces THEIR control to do so.

No team can "sign an offer sheet". They can extend an offer sheet to Dak to sign.
The non-exclusive tag cedes control to Dak's agent who then negotiates around the league for the best possible deal.
At that time then the team Dak chose as the winner of his proverbial free agency would contact Dallas about compensation.
They can agree to the two R1 picks but that hasn't happened in the last 20 years. --hello Joey Galloway
And if the team can get Dallas to agree to a lesser amount and now knowing Dak will sign they make the offer.
Dallas agrees and takes the compensation offered and a deal is struck.

 

[jterrell]

I was repeating what has been in many articles about this.
.
.

Then, respectfully, you are reading the wrong articles.

Dak has total control here.
Dallas can offer him 37.7M tag and that's really all they decide upon.
The rest is up to Dak.

 

[jterrell]

Again you guys have to come to grips with basic reality here.

The ONLY control the Dallas Cowboys have is to maintain Dak's rights for 37.7M
They can NOT trade him until he signs that franchise tag.
Once they do tag him AND he signs said tag, they can only trade him under terms he either agrees to and signs for or under a year deal that offers no future path to a tag for the team receiving him.

You have heard Stephen and Jerry state many times they are keeping Dak and this is why.
There is no reasonable path out of this without either setting him free or partnering with his team to find the new home and reducing their trade leverage to mininal.

 

[CouchCoach]

There are no cap ramifications to the Cowboys but Prescott has to agree to the terms of the trade, including the new long term contract his new club would be offering or he just refuses to sign the tag and the Cowboys have no course to follow at that point but to draft a QB with that 10th or higher pick.

They can choose to rescind the tag and Prescott is free to sign with any team just like Brady and Manning were.

Tagging him and the ensuing tug of war would be interesting. He could hold out and basically paralyze them going forward with 37M sitting there.

I don't think any of that happens, both sides are motivated toward a long term solution.

 

[gjkoeppen]

Not sure what language that is but it is meaningless.

The Dallas Cowboys can tag Dak as exclusive or non-exclusive but it only reduces THEIR control to do so.

No team can "sign an offer sheet". They can extend an offer sheet to Dak to sign.
The non-exclusive tag cedes control to Dak's agent who then negotiates around the league for the best possible deal.
At that time then the team Dak chose as the winner of his proverbial free agency would contact Dallas about compensation.
They can agree to the two R1 picks but that hasn't happened in the last 20 years. --hello Joey Galloway
And if the team can get Dallas to agree to a lesser amount and now knowing Dak will sign they make the offer.
Dallas agrees and takes the compensation offered and a deal is struck.

Besides having a reading problem you also have a lot to learn about exclusive and non-exclusive tags and then get your facts right on Galloway. At not time did I say the team can or does sign an offer sheet. I'll quote what I said and maybe this time you'll read it correctly. "First a player on non-exclusive franchise tag that has signed the offer sheet". If you have to reread it 2 or 3 times if that's what it takes for you to get it. Next once the Player, not the team, signs the tag offer sheet, the only choices he and the teams have is if another team makes an offer of a long tern contract that the player likes, that contract and only that contract can be submitted to the original team to match or reject. If rejected the only choice the player has is to sign the contract submitted. FOUR players have gone on to new teams when they were tagged with the nonexclusive franchise tag in which those teams had to give up those 2 1st round picks.

Now Galloway. He was on the last year of his rookie contract and was not on a non-exclusive franchise tag. He was holding out for a new contract and the Cowboys worked out a trade for 2 number 1 picks for Galloway who was the 8th pick in the 1st round originally.

Lastly teams that tag players with the exclusive tags have all the control because no other team can negotiate with the player and if the player wants to get paid anything that season and play that season he has to sign it. Tagging a player is the way teams have to extend the time they have to exclusively negotiate with that player. The Cowboys tagged Lawrence TWICE and about a week after the 2nd tag Lawrence sign a long term contract..
.
.

 

[fivetwos]

Which Smith?: I just checked and Zack Martin did not have his contract restructured last season. he signed a new contract because his existing contract was going expire after the 2019 season. He signed that during the 2019 season. Want to make some more guesses?
.
.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...-space-for-future-dak-prescott-extension/amp/

Emmitt Smith. Which Smith did you think could have possibly done a restructure for cap room?

And I didn't "guess" on any of it. I recall it happening.

Maybe at least try to have a normal conversation without insults.

Either way with Martin....it was done for cap space, which was the point...but I realize certain people are uncomfortable unless they are completely right all the time.

Read through this thread and decide if you think you belong on that list. Be honest. Ill wait

 

[gjkoeppen]

Then, respectfully, you are reading the wrong articles.

Dak has total control here.
Dallas can offer him 37.7M tag and that's really all they decide upon.
The rest is up to Dak.

By your insistence of getting Prescott traded I'm betting you're not a Prescott fan. So it would make sense that you have completely overlooked or ignored the reports that in the final hour or so on July 15th Prescott was doing his own negotiating and they agreed on a 35 mil a year salary. They couldn't get the length and guaranteed money done before the deadline. Dallas won't offer a tag until the day before free agency starts or if they get a contract worked out so right now your 37.7 mil isn't the only offer.
.
.

 

[jterrell]

Besides having a reading problem you also have a lot to learn about exclusive and non-exclusive tags and then get your facts right on Galloway. At not time did I say the team can or does sign an offer sheet. I'll quote what I said and maybe this time you'll read it correctly. "First a player on non-exclusive franchise tag that has signed the offer sheet". If you have to reread it 2 or 3 times if that's what it takes for you to get it. Next once the Player, not the team, signs the tag offer sheet, the only choices he and the teams have is if another team makes an offer of a long tern contract that the player likes, that contract and only that contract can be submitted to the original team to match or reject. If rejected the only choice the player has is to sign the contract submitted. FOUR players have gone on to new teams when they were tagged with the nonexclusive franchise tag in which those teams had to give up those 2 1st round picks.

Now Galloway. He was on the last year of his rookie contract and was not on a non-exclusive franchise tag. He was holding out for a new contract and the Cowboys worked out a trade for 2 number 1 picks for Galloway who was the 8th pick in the 1st round originally.

Lastly teams that tag players with the exclusive tags have all the control because no other team can negotiate with the player and if the player wants to get paid anything that season and play that season he has to sign it. Tagging a player is the away teams have to extend the time they have to exclusively negotiate with that player. The Cowboys tagged Lawrence TWICE and about a week after the 2nd tag Lawrence sign a long term contract..
.
.

L O L
Nothing you stated means anything.

Dallas can do absolutely zero with Dak but tag him.Those are the hard irrefutable facts.
After that all control reverts to Dak.
Exclusive versus non-exclusive means jack spit. Except to goofballs and Dak's agent.
No team can do anything regardless of the "type" of tag and the cost is EXACTLY the same 37.7M
Dak decides the rest, period. He is under ZERO obligation to negotiate with anyone or sign anything.

As to Galloway, again you are wrong here. He was the last player signed on a franchise tag to the two first round picks. Subsequent deals have been for less compensation.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.c...ded-two-no-1-picks-one-of-whom-became-an-mvp/

The trade ended a saga that saw Galloway hold out for half of the 1999 season, his final under contract to Seattle. He returned for the final eight regular-season games, and ultimately, an arbitrator ruled that he had earned an accrued year, thus making an unrestricted free agent. The Seahawks responded by giving him the franchise tag, then allowing Dallas to work out a deal

 

[jterrell]

By your insistence of getting Prescott traded I'm betting you're not a Prescott fan. So it would make sense that you have completely overlooked or ignored the reports that in the final hour or so on July 15th Prescott was doing his own negotiating and they agreed on a 35 mil a year salary. They couldn't get the length and guaranteed money done before the deadline. Dallas won't offer a tag until the day before free agency starts or if they get a contract worked out so right now your 37.7 mil isn't the only offer.
.
.

I am a fan of the truth first and foremost but also Dak.

I am fairly certain he'll be back here.
I am also fairly certain the terms will nauseate most Dallas Cowboys fans because Dak's agent has ALL the leverage.

The "reports" were largely overblown. Dak discussed this with Jane Slater. A lot of the leaks coming out of the Cowboys camp were inaccurate.
Dak said he'd challenge many of those reported details.
But yes they agreed on a basic dollar amount of ~34.5M AAV though not how that dollar amount was paid, how many years or how much was guaranteed.
Dak was willing to budge on ONLY the 5 years of that discussion.
And Dallas by not getting a deal done saw the market rise significantly after Pat and Watson signed massive deals at 45M AAV and 40M respectively.

The new suggested market value for Dal is 39.5M. A 5M per year increase from Dallas' best offer.
And that is still over 4 years not the 5 Dallas says they consider a must.

I am just aware at no point will Dak be traded this year without his express consent. His chances of being traded for a 2021 draft haul is basically 0.
Dallas can tag him and eat the cap space of 37.7M while they wait out Dak's next steps.
Common sense says Dak would hold off signing while his team negotiates with Dallas on a long term deal.
The pressure being on the Cowboys because they are eating 37.7M of cap space in one of the final seasons of Jerry's reign.

The Cowboys only real option at this point is to go to Dak as a partner in the business of the Cowboys and make him a strong offer then beg he take it.
Right now they are totally hamstrung until his situation is resolved and they can kick the can with another fully priced tag year but with costs only rising to do so.

 

[gjkoeppen]

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...-space-for-future-dak-prescott-extension/amp/

Emmitt Smith. Which Smith did you think could have possibly done a restructure for cap room?

And I didn't "guess" on any of it. I recall it happening.

Maybe at least try to have a normal conversation without insults.

Either way with Martin....it was done for cap space, which was the point...but I realize certain people are uncomfortable unless they are completely right all the time.

Read through this thread and decide if you think you belong on that list. Be honest. Ill wait

You're wrong on Emmitt. He signed a 4 year rookie deal, then 4 years later he signed another 4 year contract after holding out for 2 games. Then 3 years later he signed a 7 year contract that started after that season. After taht contract was up the Cowboys released Emmitt and he signed with the cardinals. At no time did the Cowboys restructure any of Emmitt's contracts. Your memory is faulty.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/dallas-cowboys/emmitt-smith-13657/



Also you said a Smith? and Martin restructured their contracts before the 2020 season and we both know Martin didn't so how can Emmitt's contract have anything to do with your statement?


You're just throw spaghetti on the ceiling to see what sticks.
.
.

 

[OmerV]

This is not going to happen but isn’t it 2 1st round picks.

I suspect you are thinking of compensation for losing a free agent who was given the non-exclusive franchise tag, but that's not the scenario the OP discussed.

 

[gjkoeppen]

I am a fan of the truth first and foremost but also Dak.

I am fairly certain he'll be back here.
I am also fairly certain the terms will nauseate most Dallas Cowboys fans because Dak's agent has ALL the leverage.

The "reports" were largely overblown. Dak discussed this with Jane Slater. A lot of the leaks coming out of the Cowboys camp were inaccurate.
Dak said he'd challenge many of those reported details.
But yes they agreed on a basic dollar amount of ~34.5M AAV though not how that dollar amount was paid, how many years or how much was guaranteed.
Dak was willing to budge on ONLY the 5 years of that discussion.
And Dallas by not getting a deal done saw the market rise significantly after Pat and Watson signed massive deals at 45M AAV and 40M respectively.

The new suggested market value for Dal is 39.5M. A 5M per year increase from Dallas' best offer.
And that is still over 4 years not the 5 Dallas says they consider a must.

I am just aware at no point will Dak be traded this year without his express consent. His chances of being traded for a 2021 draft haul is basically 0.
Dallas can tag him and eat the cap space of 37.7M while they wait out Dak's next steps.
Common sense says Dak would hold off signing while his team negotiates with Dallas on a long term deal.
The pressure being on the Cowboys because they are eating 37.7M of cap space in one of the final seasons of Jerry's reign.

The Cowboys only real option at this point is to go to Dak as a partner in the business of the Cowboys and make him a strong offer then beg he take it.
Right now they are totally hamstrung until his situation is resolved and they can kick the can with another fully priced tag year but with costs only rising to do so.

I don't know where or how you think Prescott has the power to consent to any trade. The only way he could do that is if he had an actual contract with a no trade clause in it which he doesn't have. Right now until free agency starts he is under the 2020 franchise tag and that does not give him the power of consent or not to consent. If no long term contract is worked out and he gets tagged again, he still won't have any power for not consenting to any trade. I just don't get where you've come up with this change in the rules for exclusive franchise tags.

As I've said many times now that on July 15th they did not get the length and guaranteed amount agreed on before time ran out. You just repeated what I've been saying.

Now this is just my opinion but I think t6hose that have set Prescott's market value may not have considered that Prescott grew up a Cowboys fan and his dream job was always playing for the Cowboys. I don't think Prescott is going to be like last season and run the risk of only playing 1 more year in his dream job because of playing on a tag again. I also believe for that reason it will be less than the 39.5 a year salary. Again this is just my opinion.
.
.

 

[Scotman]

So...if it all works out...you tag him and he signs right away...the new team negotiates a contract...we get a first and cap relief...AND THEN WE HAVE NO QUARTERBACK.

That's a huge ramification if you ask me. You going to roll into the next year with Dalton? Trubiski? One of the QB's from Tecmo Bowl?

 

[Bigdog]

I suspect you are thinking of compensation for losing a free agent who was given the non-exclusive franchise tag, but that's not the scenario the OP discussed.

I think I was. My bad.

 

[Loso86]

Does anyone know what they would be?

Simply put we save millions more by signing him than tagging him this year

 

[jterrell]

A couple of of reasons
1) the new team might be a very desirable destination (contender, etc...say Indy)
2) the new team might offer him a contract that far exceeds what Dallas is offering

In a normal situation sure.
But:
1. Dak is coming off major injury meaning Dallas knows far more about his health than any new teams.
1a. He can't pass a physical today.
2. DeShaun Watson is available, healthy and already signed long term.

Again it takes a completely illogical leap of faith to find a way Dak moves on early in the off-season at all and definitely with any real return to the Dallas Cowboys.

Dallas is not in a position to get any of the other coveted QBs nor can they trade Dak before he signs a tender which he can't even do if he wanted to until the new league year opens.
If Indy wanted Dak I'm sure they could start those discussions to check on his health and gather data and such but why would a team trying to go win it all want to give up draft capital this year?? Of course they wouldn't.
They have no reason to do a deal before April's draft either.

 

[jterrell]

So...if it all works out...you tag him and he signs right away...the new team negotiates a contract...we get a first and cap relief...AND THEN WE HAVE NO QUARTERBACK.

That's a huge ramification if you ask me. You going to roll into the next year with Dalton? Trubiski? One of the QB's from Tecmo Bowl?

Yes.
All you need is
a new team willing to sign him now while injured and give up draft pick comp BEFORE April.
Dak being willing to move from the Prosper ranch he just built with a football field.
New team and Dak agreeing to a long-term deal that also compensates Dallas.

IF all that happens you have the cap space back in full and can chase a QB on the open market or draft one at 10.

Basically better odds of winning the lotto.

 

[Adreme]

What you and others don't get is when an exclusive franchise tag is offered but not signed yet the Cowboys can not initiaite any type of trade talks to trade that player nor can any other team try to interfere with or contact that team about a possible trade. No other team can make any offers for a trade until the player signs the tag offer. A player given an exclusive franchise tag off GUARANTEES that team EXCLUSIVE negotiating rights that no other team can interfere with in any way. So what you're trying wrongly to explain CAN'T HAPPEN.
.
.

You are being very naïve here. Remember the NFL technically has a legal tampering period where other teams can negotiate with players but NOT using specific contract numbers and yet somehow the moment that players can sign the specific contracts are somehow already worked out with the agents with no objections. The point bein that just because you technically cannot be talking does not mean you are not actually talking and everyone will kind of just look the other way as they have been for years.