Fire Jason Garrett? Then You Would Have Fired Tom Landry

[Dre11]

8 years......................Single Wildcard Win.....................Me proven right

NOT.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

8 years......................Single Wildcard Win.....................Me proven right

Yup! This season, it's time to put up or shut up from Garrett. He needs to either get us to an NFC Championship this season, or step aside, because his record is average at best.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Linehan did not come from the Walsh tree. He came into the nfl under Mike Tice, then to Miami under Saban where Garrett was also at the time. Then got HC job with Rams and Detroit.

I believe that I said via Tice, but that may have been in other threads. Nonetheless, this is a team in which the WCO should thrive. The problem is, we haven't been creative with it. Our coaches did a disaster of a job last year in shielding Dak's weaknesses and playing to his strengths. Before you respond with the fact that Zeke was wrongfully suspended, my issues were NOT because of that (though, I did have a problem with the way they coached the Falcons game). Let's look at the Packers game from last year, shall we? I saw some eerie similarities to the Packers game in 2013. Lead at halftime. Seemingly in control. Decimating the Packers on the ground. Eviscerating them in the air as a result offensively. Then, the unthinkable happens. We pass 3 times just as we get back from the 2nd half when the Packers couldn't stop Zeke. At that moment, I began to feel as though I had seen that before in 2013. Sure enough, history repeated itself. I had wanted Garrett gone in 2013, but relented with it between 2014-2016 (including 2015 for the most part). I felt that maybe he had been improving. But then I saw that. I was infuriated with how ridiculously we played that game in the second half as if Garrett had learned nothing from 2013.

 

[Beast_from_East]

NOT.

NOT

Did we win some magical playoff games in the world you live in?

I see..................wait for it..............wait for it.....................One playoff win.................Eight Years Later.........Just like I said

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

See, if Garrett was improving, then I could overlook the records and still support him. I could even overlook the fact that this team regressed (which is typical for having a second year QB). But, the fact that he did NOTHING to help Dak (which is an EXCELLENT way to ruin a young QB's confidence and ruin him period) in games. He did NOT adjust well to protect Dak. Our offense did NOT switch to the quick passes. The loss to the Packers this season was when I became adamant about wanting a new coach. It's shameful the way that the Packers game was coached.

 

[Beast_from_East]

See, if Garrett was improving, then I could overlook the records and still support him. I could even overlook the fact that this team regressed (which is typical for having a second year QB). But, the fact that he did NOTHING to help Dak (which is an EXCELLENT way to ruin a young QB's confidence and ruin him period) in games. He did NOT adjust well to protect Dak. Our offense did NOT switch to the quick passes. The loss to the Packers this season was when I became adamant about wanting a new coach. It's shameful the way that the Packers game was coached.

Exactly

He coaches scared..................or more correctly stated, he plays not to lose the game instead of playing to win the game..........there is difference

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Exactly

He coaches scared..................or more correctly stated, he plays not to lose the game instead of playing to win the game..........there is difference

Exactly, and btw, to those who say that Garrett is "the best we can get" with Jerry, that's rather defeatist isn't it? I don't believe that for a minute! I think there are plenty of HCs in college who would love an opportunity to coach in the NFL like David Shaw and Chris Peterson (U Washington) who would be better than Garrett. They'd be more creative, and they wouldn't coach scared. When was the last time that you could directly attribute a win to Garrett?

 

[Idgit]

Even if I agreed with you that we didn't lose playoff games due to coaching, that begs the question "what about the other 5 seasons under Garrett where we didn't even make the playoffs?"

Missing the playoffs 5 times in 7 years typically gets a head coach fired in today's NFL, a point you acknowledged already when you said you could not think of another coach like Garrett that started out poor and then had significant postseason success with the same team, mainly because most teams don't stay with a coach with a track record like Garrett.

We’ve been over this ground. Going 8-8 with a .500 team isn’t bad coaching.

 

[Captain-Crash]

the eagles should have stayed with the "chip process" nobody wins with changing the coaches ever 2 to 3 years.... lmao...

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

the eagles should have stayed with the "chip process" nobody wins with changing the coaches ever 2 to 3 years.... lmao...

The Broncos did this as well and won the Super Bowl as a result.

 

[Dre11]

I believe that I said via Tice, but that may have been in other threads. Nonetheless, this is a team in which the WCO should thrive. The problem is, we haven't been creative with it. Our coaches did a disaster of a job last year in shielding Dak's weaknesses and playing to his strengths. Before you respond with the fact that Zeke was wrongfully suspended, my issues were NOT because of that (though, I did have a problem with the way they coached the Falcons game). Let's look at the Packers game from last year, shall we? I saw some eerie similarities to the Packers game in 2013. Lead at halftime. Seemingly in control. Decimating the Packers on the ground. Eviscerating them in the air as a result offensively. Then, the unthinkable happens. We pass 3 times just as we get back from the 2nd half when the Packers couldn't stop Zeke. At that moment, I began to feel as though I had seen that before in 2013. Sure enough, history repeated itself. I had wanted Garrett gone in 2013, but relented with it between 2014-2016 (including 2015 for the most part). I felt that maybe he had been improving. But then I saw that. I was infuriated with how ridiculously we played that game in the second half as if Garrett had learned nothing from 2013.

See, if Garrett was improving, then I could overlook the records and still support him. I could even overlook the fact that this team regressed (which is typical for having a second year QB). But, the fact that he did NOTHING to help Dak (which is an EXCELLENT way to ruin a young QB's confidence and ruin him period) in games. He did NOT adjust well to protect Dak. Our offense did NOT switch to the quick passes. The loss to the Packers this season was when I became adamant about wanting a new coach. It's shameful the way that the Packers game was coached.

Tice didn't come from the Walsh tree either, he became TE coach for Vikings right after retirement. Linehan came from the same timing based offense that Garrett did.
Now for what you expected, first you can't disqualify Zeke from the argument, any argument that does is over when the Offense is built around an effective ground game. Anybody discrediting how Dak's struggles impacted last season, and how Dez struggled kills the argument. Dak struggles were more than I expected mainly from an accuracy standpoint, he didn't have the luxury of make slow reads because the line struggled and wasn't the same from the last season ,which caused him to miss some reads. There are a couple examples out there where he missed a wide open Beasley in the end zone and I think Witten too. Those 3 issues were a huge factor. I won't even use the injuries and suspension. So from there I will here you go. I knew Dak would struggle, if you don't believe it, go look at my post history at the ranch from the end off last season. Now, could they have done more in Atlanta? Probably, but that was Zeke's first missed game, and at what point do you just compromise your entire game plan or offense in the middle of a game for 1 player, that actually played well in his other starts filling in for Tyron, hiding Dak's weaknesses (a second year qb) became even harder with Zeke out. Teams knew Rollouts ,screens, read option, Beasly, Ol, and Zeke was what hid his weakness, I don't know what more adjustments you wanted with a second year qb struggling with accuracy and without an effective run game for 6 weeks . Coaches aren't going to tell you that, they've been conditioned not, but don't act like it isn't a reason. The Greenbay game I was at that game, have pictures to prove it, when is the defense ever going to make a stop vs a good qb. But also, every coach could use hindsight and go back and find something that could've been done differently in every win and every loss.
When did teams start the crazy concept of being scared to score to fast? The Cowboys balled vs Greenbay and tha Dak run in the end zone to take the league sent the crowd in a frenzy, you score when there's the opportunity. Any other time fans are crying coaches are playing scared.

 

[diefree666]

We’ve been over this ground. Going 8-8 with a .500 team isn’t bad coaching.

and that is your standard. "isn't bad coaching"
pathetic

 

[diefree666]

how anyone can still defend Red Ball is amazing.

 

[Diehardblues]

how anyone can still defend Red Ball is amazing.

You can support Garrett without defending him for his efforts within the parameters Jerry allows, the experience and ability he brings while applauding the assets he delivers .

Much like we’d support a QB who only has average to possibly above average passing ability . We hope we can develop and surround him with more support.

They are our owner, HC and QB, etc until they’re not so while we might critique their ability we’re still rooting them on.

 

[Diehardblues]

Jerry Ball presents handicaps most teams arent confronted with that creates challenges we must overcome .

The Cowboys are at a disandvantage with our mom and pop front office and less than an elite ego driven experienced and proven HC in order to provide our owner the credit he’s pursuing in the event of more success.

Cowboys Football is like the Special Olympics. We’re in a class of our own . Very special

 

[LACowboysFan1]

Let me start off with saying I'm not a Garrett fan, and while I didn't call for his firing a year or two ago, I did say I would have him on a short rope, and things (winning) has to improve. So don't take this post as a heartfelt defense of Garrett sticking around for several years regardless of the way the team performs. But let's try to look at this situation objectively.

Garrett speaks often of the "process", which lots of folks here deride and quote after every playoff or other critical loss. Just what is the "process"?

We aren't told that in great detail, so we're taking shots in the dark mostly when criticizing it. However, I think we can see parts of it, and the question is, "Is the process working/workable/proper?

A couple of posts ago somebody was complaining that "they did nothing to help Dak". Wasn't it just two years ago people were griping that "defense wins championships", why did we draft a running back at no. 4, we need to draft a Ramsey/Apple, or we need to pick up J. Peppers or some other veteran to provide more defense, because the defense sucks, the offense is fine as is.

So last year the Cowboys draft 3 dbs, Taco, etc., and now it's "we need better receivers, etc. because we have to outscore teams like the Packers and New Orleans and the Rams?

Point is, it may be that the team is alternating offensive and defensive drafts, has a plan to develop Dak that doesn't include making him All Pro and throwing for 6,000 yds and 60 tds in one year, or is willing to draft lots of defensive players that aren't necessarily top notch, but can work together, etc. We don't know their long-term or even short term plans other than what Jerry or Garrett says in interviews and news conferences, and does anyone seriously believe they will give out the ACTUAL plan in any detail? Even JJ isn't that stupid, if he's stupid at all.

Yes we've seen the team fall apart in crucial situations and the coaching hasn't been sparkling. But it may be that the "process" isn't one of quick success that we impatient, nothing-but-championships-will-do fans desire...

 

[Diehardblues]

I really can’t understand why any fans outside our local area would have any interest in the Dallas Cowboys? What a horribly ran football franchise with very limited potential and success this era.

 

[LACowboysFan1]

"with our a proven HC...

Was Jimmy a "proven" HC? In college, yes, but ZERO NFL "proven" performance. He was the first, in over 75 years of the NFL, to win an NFL title and a college title. Remember the comment some coach or gm made about Jimmy? "He doesn't get to play East Carolina"? But 2 SB titles in 5 years and another with the basic team he helped put together and set up with his coaching.

Yes it USUALLY is better to have a HC who has years of experience as an OC or DC or such with other teams, working under the Walshs, Belichicks, etc.

But that's not to say you can't hire a smart guy such as Garrett supposedly is and let him learn on the job and have as a result multiple SB wins or a constant SB contending team.

His time is, or should be, running short, without better playoff success eventually you have to realize the "process" isn't working or Garrett simply isn't capable of being a SB winning coach. How much longer does he, or should he, have? We all have our opinions as to that time frame, but just because some of us think that time has already run out doesn't mean we are correct in that view. Those who think Garrett should be given one, two or more years may also be correct...

 

[LACowboysFan1]

I really can’t understand why any fans outside our local area would have any interest in the Dallas Cowboys? What a horribly ran football franchise with very limited potential and success this era.

Well there are many fans like myself, for one, older and who have been rooting for the team for decades.

And JJ is very good at marketing the team, they're the national game on tv more than most teams. And who knows why somebody becomes a fan of a team not in their area? It's not something you can pinpoint, if only local people were fans probably the Jaguars, Lions and others in "small" markets were fans of the home town team, there probably wouldn't be a team, the advertisers aren't going to pay the NFL if nobody watches the games.

I imagine that without the huge television contracts we'd not have teams in Jacksonville, Tampa Bay, or Carolina, just not enough population in those areas to support a team with only local fans...

 

[cowboyblue22]

the only hope we as cowboys fans have is if the nfl forces a sale of the cowboys from the jones family and we get another owner who hires football people to run the show and a real hc and staff