Boom or Bust

[GenoT]

In the wake of a disappointing first round experience for yours truly, I feel it is important now that I clarify my position on Leighton Vander Esch.

Stopped reading after the above...hope I didn’t miss anything of real value?

 

[jday]

Stopped reading after the above...hope I didn’t miss anything of real value?

Not at all...keep it moving

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Carpenter only demonstrates that the FO is capable of getting it wrong.

Ireland and Parcells are gone.

 

[gimmesix]

That's not exactly accurate. The league took a step back last year in passing...if I'm not mistaken, I'm pretty sure I read somewhere the league passed less last year. But I get the gist of what your saying. Again, how a player hits is simply a matter of preference.

You misread my post. It wasn't about more passing it was about more rules — "passing more and more rules."

I can see how you would read it that way so I should have been more clear.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You should reread because it didn't do that at all.

You wrap it up in notions of sure things as opposed to potential but yeah you do.

 

[jday]

You wrap it up in notions of sure things as opposed to potential but yeah you do.

Read into it what you will

 

[GORICO]

You compared the comparison of Urlacher and the comparison of Carpenter. That is what I was discussing. The combine results make the Urlacher comparison valid on their own. There is no such similarity to Carpenter.

fuzzy---when you said there is no comparson to Barbie....here are the combine results of Barbie and LVE....barbie 6 foot 2 1/2 nches...LVE 6 foot 4...barbie 40 yd dash..4.65...LVE 4.65...barbie bench press..20..LVE..20...barbie weight 256...LVE...256....Barbie 3-cone...6.88...LVE...6.88...actually in measurables there were indenticals and similarities....i am not saying LVE is barbie 2.0 at all....but i am saying i can see why some may make that comparison at the forefront....now instincts...they say LVE is lightyears ahead of Barbie....and instincts and football IQ are so important...Hitchens was neither big nor fast but he balled out....back a few years Zach Thomas...slow but balled out...i want players with instincts more than measurables....our first round pick in 2015...JOnes...measurables through the roof...instincts not so much and still trying to find where to play him in his 4th year.....amazes me how much the draft is a crap shoot....no one in the world thought Dak would have a rookie year that he did...and hopefully it was not a flash in the pan....we will find out?.....this year is huge for several players and coaches...unless Jerry just loves him some Garrett and it dont matter if we go 8-8 or worse or get put out first round of playoffs?...Jerry did say he would have fired a GM of his track record a few years back...but Jerry loves him some Jerry so his job is safe...jerry owns all the toys in the sandbox so no one kicking him out...and as fans our job is still secure...man i spend so much time in my short life discussing and analyzing dallas cowboys...some may say GORICO needs a life...that may not be wrong...it has crossed my mind

 

[GORICO]

LVE has skills and upside that nobody ever even remotely gave Bobby Carpenter. Carpenter was a Bill Parcells miscalculation because he coached his father. Carpenter should have been a nice fourth or fifth round pick; not a first rounder.

I just watched a few LVE highlight videos and it's clear this kid has "it". Made so many plays against the run and pass it's no accident. He will need time to adjust to the speed of the NFL, like all rookies, but with Sean Lee at his side we should all be excited about this pick.

CT..wow that is right..Barbie was on Parcells watch....Parcells had trouble at times pickin' em too...he love Spears way ahead of DWare...the draft is a crap shoot...if McClay has another banner year picking em....I might say its not a crap shoot for him...but to most of us it is

 

[GORICO]

I'm not the one that brought it up. Nor am I the one getting feelings involved. You need not feel the need to protect LVE; he's a Cowboy now and therefore I am a fan. Calm yourself.

Jday---you know the truth is..its not about LVE or barbie or who we say we like and who we dont...these are just things we can hide behind to vent the anger from unresolved conflict in our lives...we all do it

 

[jday]

The OP is strong on rhetoric and weak on argument. You can blame that on others’ lack of reading comprehension but the evidence is there for all to see.

You’ve established nothing beyond a personal preference for thumpers.

What argument was I attempting and failed to make?

If you think this was intended to convince you LVE is a bust, my reading comprehension comment was on point.

 

[jday]

Jday---you know the truth is..its not about LVE or barbie or who we say we like and who we dont...these are just things we can hide behind to vent the anger from unresolved conflict in our lives...we all do it

Actually, I think it's about people being unable to deal with opinions that differ from that of their own.

 

[jday]

You misread my post. It wasn't about more passing it was about more rules — "passing more and more rules."

I can see how you would read it that way so I should have been more clear.

Be that as it may, I did say the way person tackles is a matter of preference. In the op, I gave LBE credt for bring a tackling machine...but, I prefer players that consistently explode into the ball carrier. But again...that is just me.

 

[Beaker42]

There are players that I'd say are more of a sure-thing than LVE.

Maybe - we won too many games to be in on them.

 

[Diehardblues]

That isn't the way the draft works.

There is no sure thing.

Right !!

And why there’s so many 1st round bust or disappointments.

 

[jterrell]

That was really long which I can relate to, lol.

Issue is the thesis revolves around production versus potential and you ignore that the kid had 141 tackles and the conference player of the year.
He had more "production" than TJ Watt last year.
LVE wasn't productive over a long period of time but he doubled up Evans in tackles last year and arguably had the best game of his career in his final game the bowl game versus Oregon.

The only real issue he has is technique and if those 7 games he missed as sophomore were anything that could be repeated.

 

[jday]

That was really long which I can relate to, lol.

Issue is the thesis revolves around production versus potential and you ignore that the kid had 141 tackles and the conference player of the year.
He had more "production" than TJ Watt last year.
LVE wasn't productive over a long period of time but he doubled up Evans in tackles last year and arguably had the best game of his career in his final game the bowl game versus Oregon.

The only real issue he has is technique and if those 7 games he missed as sophomore were anything that could be repeated.

I literally put the stats he accrued in the op and I ignored it?

 

[jterrell]

I literally put the stats he accrued in the op and I ignored it?

Actually that gif applies quite well to yourself, lol.

Point is you IGNORE the production by claiming he didn't have PRODUCTION.
Hard to be better than the conferences player of the year.
The word you were looking for is consistency.
He didn't consistently produce at a high level.
But he produced at a very high level in 2017.

 

[Ranching]

There are players that I'd say are more of a sure-thing than LVE.

It's Garrett's fault!!!

 

[GORICO]

The NBA has a real problem with players skipping college and not fully embracing their D League widely. There are many teams that don't have their own development team. As it stands the bust rate in the lottery is pretty similar to the NFL first round but after that the bust rate sky rockets. The curve falls off a cliff whereas the NFL is a more gradual slope through 7 rounds.

MLB is a completely different animal. It is the norm to draft out of HS and they go through several stages of farm clubs before getting to the majors. Development is much much more significant for baseball organizations. Throw into that how foreign players play a huge role and are not drafted and player acquisition becomes much more muddled. Specifically with the draft their is a lot more volatility in outcomes because of all the raw prospects that are drafted and the ability of various clubs to develop talent.

ya man makes sense

 

[GORICO]

Actually, I think it's about people being unable to deal with opinions that differ from that of their own.

yes...if i am not careful i think i am right...i have to ojectively ponder the evidence at hand without bringing my presuppostions