Demarcus Lawrence wants a 5 year extension

Nightman

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Up until recent years the Cowboys had serious salary cap problems. Teams that can afford to spend are ones that manage the cap well. Managing the cap doesn't mean they never spend big money, it just means they are smart about it, and they consider not only the immediate impact of every signing, but the effect it will have in the future. Teams that are able to stay in decent shape under the salary cap can't and don't just throw caution to the wind and say "we'll worry about it later".

I think what you have to remember is the Cowboys are one team, whereas when you talk about other teams spending ridiculously you are talking about an overview of the entire NFL - the remaining 31 teams. Some of the signings get a lot of attention for the player involved and the price tag, but that's not every team doing that every year.
The cap has also gone up 55m in the last 5 years and wages haven't caught up

There is over 515m in unused cap space league wide right now and that will only grow when it is rolled over to 2019
 

DiResta

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Price is only going to go up. Sign the man long term and get it over with.
when Dez held out this is exactly what people were saying
that, and PAY THE MAN

a true franchise end will easily have double digit sacks again this year
then we talk
 

Aviano90

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when Dez held out this is exactly what people were saying
that, and PAY THE MAN
Yeah and some were saying it about Tony, and Tyron, and Fred Beard, and Martin. Some were even disagreeing. Somebody has to get paid on the team, right or should the offensive line be the only unit we invest in long term?
 

TheMarathonContinues

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Up until recent years the Cowboys had serious salary cap problems. Teams that can afford to spend are ones that manage the cap well. Managing the cap doesn't mean they never spend big money, it just means they are smart about it, and they consider not only the immediate impact of every signing, but the effect it will have in the future. Teams that are able to stay in decent shape under the salary cap can't and don't just throw caution to the wind and say "we'll worry about it later".

I think what you have to remember is the Cowboys are one team, whereas when you talk about other teams spending ridiculously you are talking about an overview of the entire NFL - the remaining 31 teams. Some of the signings get a lot of attention for the player involved and the price tag, but that's not every team doing that every year.
Even the Cowboys...what did their cap problems stop them from doing? From signing anyone? Or their own guys? Because Cowboys have always been able to bring their own guys back. I just think cap problems are a myth.
 

DiResta

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Yeah and some were saying it about Tony, and Tyron, and Fred Beard, and Martin. Some were even disagreeing. Somebody has to get paid on the team, right or should the offensive line be the only unit we invest in long term?
but Tank has injury history (back of all things) and only 1 season albeit at a high level
hes already being paid top money, if he wants to continue getting paid that way i need assurance he wont fade
if he is the beast that we think he is then negotiating through this season should work out for both sides
 

Aviano90

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but Tank has injury history (back of all things) and only 1 season albeit at a high level
hes already being paid top money, if he wants to continue getting paid that way i need assurance he wont fade
if he is the beast that we think he is then negotiating through this season should work out for both sides
Then advocate for the team waiting. I am good with them signing long term. It's alright if we disagree. No right or wrong answer. :thumbup:
 

OmerV

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Even the Cowboys...what did their cap problems stop them from doing? From signing anyone? Or their own guys? Because Cowboys have always been able to bring their own guys back. I just think cap problems are a myth.

Yes, it stopped them from signing their own guys and other guys. If not for the money the team would have kept Demarcus Ware, Ron Leary and Demarco Murray for example. And for years fans voiced displeasure over the team not signing free agents from other teams. Hell, if you spent any time on this site at the beginning of free agency you would have seen a slew of fans complaining that the team was going to go through yet another year of being inactive in free agency except for back ups and has beens.

The reason the Cowboys are out of the salary cap hell they were in is because the team is leaning mostly on guys that were drafted, or guys picked up as low cost free agents rather than spending big money chasing other team's free agents. Think about it - probably every offensive and defensive starter this season will be an internally grown product except for a WR. That's why the team is doing better with the salary cap.
 
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OmerV

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The cap has also gone up 55m in the last 5 years and wages haven't caught up

There is over 515m in unused cap space league wide right now and that will only grow when it is rolled over to 2019

True there has been some relief with the cap going up, and I think some of the unused space is teams being smarter than they used to be, but that doesn't mean teams can take the attitude Royce has suggested where they just spend whatever it takes on who they want and decide to worry about it later. Just like you or I or any business, we have to be aware of our budget in light of both immediate needs, and future needs and wants, and plan accordingly.
 

TheMarathonContinues

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Yes, it stopped them from signing their own guys and other guys. If not for the money the team would have kept Demarcus Ware, Ron Leary and Demarco Murray for example. And for years fans voiced displeasure over the team not signing free agents from other teams. Hell, if you spent any time on this site at the beginning of free agency you would have seen a slew of fans complaining that the team was going to go through yet another year of being inactive in free agency except for back ups and has beens.

The reason the Cowboys are out of the salary cap hell they were in is because the team is leaning mostly on guys that were drafted, or guys picked up as low cost free agents rather than spending big money chasing other team's free agents. Think about it - probably every offensive and defensive starter this season will be an internally grown product except for a WR. That's why the team is doing better with the salary cap.
They had more than enough money to keep Leary, Ware and Demarco. When it came time to pay Ware they did it. When it came time to pay Tyron they did it. When it came time to paying Romo and Dez they did it. If they let anyone walk it wasn't because they couldn't afford them.
 

Alexander

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when Dez held out this is exactly what people were saying
that, and PAY THE MAN

a true franchise end will easily have double digit sacks again this year
then we talk
Should he replicate last year, all bets are off.

If so, he will walk if he hits free agency as he will have his pick of teams with even more cap space willing to pay him. Dallas cannot and probably won't even want to compete with teams at the upper end of the cap spectrum.

Comes with the territory.

That said, I am not all that excited at the idea of simply paying him based off one good year. Tough tough situation to be in.
 

DiResta

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Should he replicate last year, all bets are off.

If so, he will walk if he hits free agency as he will have his pick of teams with even more cap space willing to pay him. Dallas cannot and probably won't even want to compete with teams at the upper end of the cap spectrum.

Comes with the territory.

That said, I am not all that excited at the idea of simply paying him based off one good year. Tough tough situation to be in.
i would bet that if he stays healthy he will be great
hes coming into his prime, hes got his body right and the technique down
but if he should end up like Tyron and have that nagging back injury thing he would hamstring the Cowboys
its worth waiting imo
having said that Tank looks far better than the rest of the guys on the roster
 

Nightman

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Yes, it stopped them from signing their own guys and other guys. If not for the money the team would have kept Demarcus Ware, Ron Leary and Demarco Murray for example
They spent more cutting DWare than keeping him

DMurray and RLeary flat out weren't worth what they got....5/42m for Murray and 5/35m for Leary was a joke

Just like 5/45m for Hitchens

And I think we did just fine with their replacements.....Zeke, Connor Williams and LVE
 

skinsscalper

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Nope. I’d franchise him 1 more year and let him walk.
Solid strategy for a team that's been looking for a consistent pass rusher since Demarcus Ware. Let's make sure we put all the work into his development, let him walk, and start the entire process all over again.
 

skinsscalper

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but Tank has injury history (back of all things) and only 1 season albeit at a high level
hes already being paid top money, if he wants to continue getting paid that way i need assurance he wont fade
if he is the beast that we think he is then negotiating through this season should work out for both sides
You can't negotiate through the season with a Franchised tagged player. That's why there's a July 16th deadline to get a long term deal done or play it out until the beginning of the new league year.
 

CyberB0b

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Solid strategy for a team that's been looking for a consistent pass rusher since Demarcus Ware. Let's make sure we put all the work into his development, let him walk, and start the entire process all over again.
A guy who has a back issue who has only produced for one season. He wants top of the market money.
 

exciter

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Nope, Irving gets the franchise tag next year, not Lawrence. D-Law gets paid. And if it comes down to paying one or the other, D-Law is a much better football player than Quack.
All evidence points to them letting Irving walk after this season. As well they should!
 

skinsscalper

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A guy who has a back issue who has only produced for one season. He wants top of the market money.
I understand your concerns. I really do. But, honestly, Lawrence's trajectory has actually been straight up since his rookie season. The injury riddled season certainly is a legitimate reason to give pause. I don't give much credence to the 4 game suspension as the NFL would suspend you for drinking the wrong brand of tea.

Despite those concerns, his actual play on the field has gotten better every season. He's actually becoming the player that we hoped he would be when we drafted him. It's harder and harder to develop these kids and the CBA rules aren't helping.

Quick diversion: I heard a stat on Sirius XM NFL Radio a couple of weeks back that the new CBA has created a situation that it now takes 3 years worth of practice to get the same number of reps now that a player could have gotten in one year under the previous CBA. That's A LOT of invested time in a player (regardless of position). It was also posited that it's the sole reason for such poor play along both sides of the trenches and why it takes so long, now, to develop these players (and consequently why guys like Martin, Fredrick, Bosa, etc. are truly great players because they've transcended that situation and were dominant from the word go but, they are ABSOLUTELY exceptions to the rule in a league starving for competent play from both sides of the trenches and QB positions).

Is it a gamble to sign Lawrence to a long term deal? Of course it is. Just like it's a gamble to sign Hitchens to his deal or Sammy Watkins to his. At some point you've got to piss or get off the pot. As was mentioned earlier in this thread: there are no trophies for saved cap space. Teams that horde their cap space are rarely in the hunt at the end of the season either. This is a talent acquisition league. The plus side to signing Lawrence now is how good this deal is going to look 3 years down the road. It doesn't get any cheaper to sign this guy regardless of the "prove it" bravado that's being bantered about, here.

For years everyone around here wanted Jerry to start getting smart about contracts and build more through the draft. Well, he's done that and, in part, completely avoided the bloated FA market where you pay a good player like a great player (see: Hitchens, Watkins) and he's put us in position to actually re-sign some of our own great players before they hit the streets and we end up competing with teams with, literally, 60 million more in cap space than we do.

Waiting another year for Lawrence is playing it safe and playing it expensive. We won't win any championships with that mindset or philosophy, IMHO. I could be completely wrong and I'm 100% comfortable with that. I'll admit it if it breaks that way without reservation. I see it this way: If I'm going to blow $1000.00 at the craps table, I'm throwing it all down, right now. I'm not going to die a slow 6 hour death playing it safe while I watch my pile slowly diminish. That's a strategy for wasting your current talent hoping something breaks your way (See: Romo, Ware, Witten). Again, IMHO.

Good talking with ya, cb.
 

Cowboy Brian

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Depends on the terms.

If he performs like he did last year, he'll get 5yr/~85-100mn on the open market.

I'd lock him up right now for 4 yrs with a player option for a 5th with a total package of 60-65mn.
 

Az Lurker

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The reason I'm more bullish than most on Tank is he's winning with technique instead of pure athleticism. To me that means he's more likely to be able to recover from injuries and continue to be productive as he ages. I'd try to give him a deal like Sean Lee's, top 3 money but only if he hits availability and performance goals. I think it'll be difficult to get him on a real bargain though because of the 17m he's already getting from the tag.
 
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