Quality Wins- a look at the contenders

[Bobhaze]

So far in the 2018 NFL season, there are clearly 18 teams that can be considered “contenders” based on records after 10 games. Of those teams,11 have winning records, 7 have an even .500 record going into the final stretch of the season.

What I want to do with this thread is look at the number wins each “contender” has against an opponent with a winning record. Call these quality wins.

Here are the teams with winning records ranked by how many wins they have against teams with winning records.

1. Saints (9-1 record) 3 wins against winning teams
2. Rams (9-1) 3 wins against winning teams
3. Patriots (7-3) 3 wins against winning teams
4. Chiefs (8-2) 2 wins against winning teams
5. Steelers (7-2-1) 1 win against winning teams
6. Bears (7-3) 1 win against winning teams
7. Texans (7-3) 1 win against winning teams
8. Commanders (6-4) 1 win against winning teams
9. Chargers (7-3) 0 wins against winning teams
10. Panthers (6-4) 0 wins against winning teams
11. Vikings (5-4-1) 0 wins against winning teams

It’s clear the Saints, Rams, and Pats have shown they can beat good teams. The teams that have 0 wins against winning teams may be silent “pretenders”.

Here are the teams at .500 that could be contenders, and how many wins against winning teams they have-

1. Ravens (5-5) 2 wins against winning teams
2. Titans (5-5) 2 wins against winning teams
3. Colts (5-5) 1 win against winning teams
4. Dolphins (5-5) 1 win against winning teams
5. Cowboys (5-5) 0 wins against winning teams
6. Seahawks (5-5) 0 wins against winning teams
7. Bengals (5-5) 0 wins against winning teams

Of these teams, the Ravens and Titans have 2 wins against winners.

What does all this mean? Well that can be debated, but it’s pretty clear that teams like the Saints, Rams and Pats are clearly a cut above. It’s also clear in the coming weeks, more teams will be eliminated from the contender list. The Cowboys have a chance to beat a “winning team” in the skins on Thursday. They have a chance oclimb this ladder.

 

[jazzcat22]

And this shows what I as others been saying.
Most teams do not win the most of their games against teams with winning reocords.
When the seasons are done, I bet you will be hard to find a team that wins more than half it’s game against teams with winning records.

That is yet another mythical idea some use to try to make their agenda work.
1st place schedule is another one, though sometimes,though those 2 games difference does make a difference in marginal teams. Like the Eagles this year.
Get beat by the Saints, and probably will against the Rams.

And one also needs to look at the time when a team beats another team.
We were 3-5 and neat the 4-4 Eagles. But yet look at it now, and one can say as we are 5-5 and Eagles are 4-6, jey they suck, we beat a sucky team.

A team can beat a losing team, but then that team starts winning, and then now one can say they beat a winning team. Bit they weren’t when they played them.
Like the teams that played the Texans. We lost to them at a losing record, but since they are winning now does not justify our loss. We still lost when we had the game in hand.

 

[G2]

Part of the reason the teams that are losing teams is because we beat them.

Lots of ball to play.

 

[Bobhaze]

Part of the reason the teams that are losing teams is because we beat them.

Lots of ball to play.

Six games left. These six will separate the contenders from the pretenders.

 

[nate dizzle]

So far in the 2018 NFL season, there are clearly 18 teams that can be considered “contenders” based on records after 10 games. Of those teams,11 have winning records, 7 have an even .500 record going into the final stretch of the season.

What I want to do with this thread is look at the number wins each “contender” has against an opponent with a winning record. Call these quality wins.

Here are the teams with winning records ranked by how many wins they have against teams with winning records.

1. Saints (9-1 record) 3 wins against winning teams
2. Rams (9-1) 3 wins against winning teams
3. Patriots (7-3) 3 wins against winning teams
4. Chiefs (8-2) 2 wins against winning teams
5. Steelers (7-2-1) 1 win against winning teams
6. Bears (7-3) 1 win against winning teams
7. Texans (7-3) 1 win against winning teams
8. Commanders (6-4) 1 win against winning teams
9. Chargers (7-3) 0 wins against winning teams
10. Panthers (6-4) 0 wins against winning teams
11. Vikings (5-4-1) 0 wins against winning teams

It’s clear the Saints, Rams, and Pats have shown they can beat good teams. The teams that have 0 wins against winning teams may be silent “pretenders”.

Here are the teams at .500 that could be contenders, and how many wins against winning teams they have-

1. Ravens (5-5) 2 wins against winning teams
2. Titans (5-5) 2 wins against winning teams
3. Colts (5-5) 1 win against winning teams
4. Dolphins (5-5) 1 win against winning teams
5. Cowboys (5-5) 0 wins against winning teams
6. Seahawks (5-5) 0 wins against winning teams
7. Bengals (5-5) 0 wins against winning teams

Of these teams, the Ravens and Titans have 2 wins against winners.

What does all this mean? Well that can be debated, but it’s pretty clear that teams like the Saints, Rams and Pats are clearly a cut above. It’s also clear in the coming weeks, more teams will be eliminated from the contender list. The Cowboys have a chance to beat a “winning team” in the skins on Thursday. They have a chance oclimb this ladder.

Good stuff Bob. Now we get a team with a winning record in Washington coming in without their starting QB and devastating injuries across the entire team. Getting a W here is obviously important for our chances at getting into the playoffs but unless we absolutely wreck them, I don't think it's a statement type of game.

Now, if we lose to this team having cited all their issues, then that is something you have to step back and say, yeah, we really aren't ready for primetime.

 

[Bobhaze]

It’s interesting that only 2 of our remaining 6 games are against winning team. (Skins and saints) But we also have the colts on Dec 16, and by then they may have a winning record.

Obviously winning against any team is most important. But winning agains5 a possible playoff team I would think helps with confidence and preparedness. I can’t wait to see how the Cowboys do against the skins and saints. It will certainly go a long ways in defining who this team is.

 

[Idgit]

Wins aren’t a granular enough statistic for the purpose of telling how good teams are. A lot of these games are separated by fgs or dumb penalties. Mediocre teams can get good players back and make a run. That ATL team we just beat us a pretty good example of how that might work out. They have a good team with a rash of injuries to good players.

 

[aria]

Very interesting list, thanks for putting it together. I will say it can be a bit deceiving based on injuries and what not. For example, I thought we would beat Warshington with or without Smith but now I definitely think we win. So that would give us a win against a team with a winning record...for a week or so because I think the Skins will continue to fall with McCoy, time will tell.

It can go both ways but at the end of the seaosn I could also easily see Atlanta ending up below .500, Philthy below .500, Jacksonville has lost 7 of the past 8 and will be lucky to get to .500, the Gnats aren’t getting to .500, and I’ll be shocked if Detroit has a winning record.

In other words, at the end of the season I think we will have had one of the easiest schedules in the league and outside of the Saints, the only other team we will face or will have faced and beat, that has a winning record is possibly the Colts or Saints. Hell, forget beat, I bet only 1/3 of the teams we will have faced are above .500 at the end of the season.

I’m not sure how that works out for the other “better” teams, I just glanced at our schedule and opponents schedule. We also haven’t really had one convincing win outside of the Giants and Jacksonville, two of the worst teams in the league although the Giants may have, may have, improved slightly from dumpster fire to a 4 alarm trash can fire.

 

[aria]

It’s interesting that only 2 of our remaining 6 games are against winning team. (Skins and saints) But we also have the colts on Dec 16, and by then they may have a winning record.

Obviously winning against any team is most important. But winning agains5 a possible playoff team I would think helps with confidence and preparedness. I can’t wait to see how the Cowboys do against the skins and saints. It will certainly go a long ways in defining who this team is.

I agree with the Saints but not Washington. I think people are reading into this too much. We aren’t the same team McCoy played last time and our defense is much improved. There’s a reason he’s not a starter. Of course anything is possible, the Browns whooped Atlanta, but I think this team will be ready and Washington is on their way downward.

 

[Point-of-the-Star]

So far in the 2018 NFL season, there are clearly 18 teams that can be considered “contenders” based on records after 10 games. Of those teams,11 have winning records, 7 have an even .500 record going into the final stretch of the season.

What I want to do with this thread is look at the number wins each “contender” has against an opponent with a winning record. Call these quality wins.

Here are the teams with winning records ranked by how many wins they have against teams with winning records.

1. Saints (9-1 record) 3 wins against winning teams
2. Rams (9-1) 3 wins against winning teams
3. Patriots (7-3) 3 wins against winning teams
4. Chiefs (8-2) 2 wins against winning teams
5. Steelers (7-2-1) 1 win against winning teams
6. Bears (7-3) 1 win against winning teams
7. Texans (7-3) 1 win against winning teams
8. Commanders (6-4) 1 win against winning teams
9. Chargers (7-3) 0 wins against winning teams
10. Panthers (6-4) 0 wins against winning teams
11. Vikings (5-4-1) 0 wins against winning teams

It’s clear the Saints, Rams, and Pats have shown they can beat good teams. The teams that have 0 wins against winning teams may be silent “pretenders”.

Here are the teams at .500 that could be contenders, and how many wins against winning teams they have-

1. Ravens (5-5) 2 wins against winning teams
2. Titans (5-5) 2 wins against winning teams
3. Colts (5-5) 1 win against winning teams
4. Dolphins (5-5) 1 win against winning teams
5. Cowboys (5-5) 0 wins against winning teams
6. Seahawks (5-5) 0 wins against winning teams
7. Bengals (5-5) 0 wins against winning teams

Of these teams, the Ravens and Titans have 2 wins against winners.

What does all this mean? Well that can be debated, but it’s pretty clear that teams like the Saints, Rams and Pats are clearly a cut above. It’s also clear in the coming weeks, more teams will be eliminated from the contender list. The Cowboys have a chance to beat a “winning team” in the skins on Thursday. They have a chance oclimb this ladder.

As you know BH I think you are posting well thought out threads and especially well thought out thread starters. Now to complete this what about those losses . A loss to a quality team should carry some weight. How about completing this??? Cowboy losses have come from some good teams ... at least teams with winning records.

 

[aria]

As you know BH I think you are posting well thought out threads and especially well thought out thread starters. Now to complete this what about those losses . A loss to a quality team should carry some weight. How about completing this??? Cowboy losses have come from some good teams ... at least teams with winning records.

2 teams with winning records, the Texans 7-3 (who have one win against a team with a winning record; Washington) and Carolina (6-4). Seattle and TN are 5-5.

The more I look at it, I wonder if there is a greater disparity, for whatever reason, in W/L’s in the entire league this year compared to most other recent years. Maybe it’s I just haven’t paid attention as much, why don’t you get on that Bob. I’ll expect a new chart with some percentages detailing the overall W/L’s between teams broken down by conference and divisions over the past decade. Please have it posted by tomorrow morning, stat

 

[Jipper]

Funny thing is if we beat the Commanders then they will technically not be a winnning team and we will still not have beaten a winning team...

 

[Bobhaze]

As you know BH I think you are posting well thought out threads and especially well thought out thread starters. Now to complete this what about those losses . A loss to a quality team should carry some weight. How about completing this??? Cowboy losses have come from some good teams ... at least teams with winning records.

Good idea. I’m just too tired to do it, LOL. We do have losses to winning teams Houston, Wash, and Carolina. And also we lost to the now .500 Titans and Seahawks, so every team we lost to is a contender. Hmmm....

 

[Bobhaze]

Funny thing is if we beat the Commanders then they will technically not be a winnning team and we will still not have beaten a winning team...

No the skins are currently 6-4, so even if we win they will still be 6-5.

 

[aria]

Never mind, too late, going to bed, can’t do simple math.

 

[Jipper]

No the skins are currently 6-4, so even if we win they will still be 6-5.

Ahh yrs....my mistake I thought they were crappier than that

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

No the skins are currently 6-4, so even if we win they will still be 6-5.

Yeah but even then......like what's the difference between beating a 6-5 team and beating a team that is 4-6? Its all mediocrity. Patriots beat the Chiefs....props to them but they lost to the Lions and got DESTROYED by the Titans.

So ultimately it means nothing unless you are constantly beating the juggernauts like the Rams, Chiefs and Saints and no one is consistently doing that.

 

[aria]

Yeah but even then......like what's the difference between beating a 6-5 team and beating a team that is 4-6? Its all mediocrity. Patriots beat the Chiefs....props to them but they lost to the Lions and got DESTROYED by the Titans.

So ultimately it means nothing unless you are constantly beating the juggernauts like the Rams, Chiefs and Saints and no one is consistently doing that.

But at least those teams showed the capability of beating SOMEONE. We’ve barely beat losing teams and are on a high because we did it two weeks in a row and now get to face a back up QB, making it three in a row.

If we beat the Saints, or even come close, then I’ll be impressed. At least it shows we have the capability of beating one of the best teams in the league which all the teams you mentioned have done, we haven’t.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

But at least those teams showed the capability of beating SOMEONE. We’ve barely beat losing teams and are on a high because we did it two weeks in a row and now get to face a back up QB, making it three in a row.

If we beat the Saints, or even come close then I’ll be impressed. At least it shows we have the capability of beating one of the best teams in the league which all the teams you mentioned have done, we haven’t.

I get that but mostly this league is all of the same caliber with the exception of those 3 teams. Even if the Cowboys were undefeated right now the knock on them would be "They haven't beaten anyone". They've lost to teams of their caliber. Panthers, Seahawks, Texans, Commanders, Titans....all of the same ilk. But are they any better then the teams we have beaten? Are they that much better than the Eagirls or Falcons? Or Lions? The only team of a different class that we have on the schedule is the Saints and we haven't gotten to them yet.

 

[Bobhaze]

I get that but mostly this league is all of the same caliber with the exception of those 3 teams. Even if the Cowboys were undefeated right now the knock on them would be "They haven't beaten anyone". They've lost to teams of their caliber. Panthers, Seahawks, Texans, Commanders, Titans....all of the same ilk. But are they any better then the teams we have beaten? Are they that much better than the Eagirls or Falcons? Or Lions? The only team of a different class that we have on the schedule is the Saints and we haven't gotten to them yet.

You’re right about the NFL being a league where the difference between a 6-4 team and a 4-6 team is razor thin. We could easily be 7-3 right now. Probably should be.