Where would you rank Dak?

[Nav22]

his rookie stats are comparatively good with some of the others because you are trying to look at them in isolation..... however, the question is did anybody else have a all time great OL like we did in 2016? a 2000 yard RB in the back field, Dez Bryant and Witten two probowl recievers..... secondly in 2016, there were 13 QBs who threw for more than 4000 yards.... that was a milestone 15, 20 or even 10 years ago...13 QBs with over 4000 yards...that tells me what the norm is in the league as opposed to the stats in isolation without context..... peyton manning threw for 3700 yards his rookie season and he didn't have the OL Dak enjoyed or a player in the caliber of Zeke. again, caliber of Zeke. that's about 300 more yards than Dak, but Peyton was 3rd in the league in passing vs. 19th..... and btw, there was only two 4000 yard passers that season, vs. 13.

you can't compare pure numbers in different eras, without taking into account the context and norm of the era....

and passer rating onto its own is meaningless. in 1998 chris chandler and vinny testeverde had higher rating than Aikman, and favre....would you take either of the former over the other two?​

so back to the selective stats that Dak lovers like to point to....

and given now they know the the way QB ratings were being calculated accounted for a lot of garbage, the new QBR rating is more effective in measuring a QB ability...and dak ranked in the middle.

again, selective stats to prove your point and if he was the type of QB you say he is, there wouldn't be so much discussion not only on this board, but among media as well....

I can come up with a bunch of stats on how Dak ranked low on many categories......
again, selective stats​

with that said, in regards to RB, I am not giving all the credit to Zeke. I am giving Zeke the same credit you are giving Dak. no different, but you seem to take offense to that...

what facts we do know, without Zeke Dak is 4-3. with Zeke in 2018, Dak was 9-1 when Zeke went over 100 total yards and 2-6 otherwise....it just tells me the value of Zeke and his performance to the team vs. Dak. take the stat as you will, but I find it funny you laugh off the similar stats that you use to prove your point. you listed a whole bunch of stats to prove why Dak is good...now you are trying to laugh off other stats because it doesn't fill your narrative...

either stats are an indicator or they are not. you can't live on both side of the fence...either Dak stats support your point so does Zeke stats...or they don't.... so laugh as much as you want, given you seem not to have an answer for that...​

teams depending on the time, # of points behind, game situation use different tactics...being behind by 3 points, with 10 minutes to go? why abandon the run...but if we come back and win being down 3 with 10 miutes to go, Dak gets credit for the comeback and you and other Dak lovers have certainly been throwing that stat around a lot lately...so a perfect example was the Philly game at philly. Zeke ran a lot...a lot of back and forth. Zeke certainly contributing to the win...151 total yards...... so your broad brush on tactics for coming from behind and having a lead is totally baseless and a non-answer.

but it fits the narrative of Dak supporters....giving all the credit for every comeback to Dak....the rest of the team meh.....​

and in regards to needing strong support to succeed, its what you just described....he needs strong supporting cast and has the intangibles to lead them to victory. nothing wrong with that....he needed a Top 5 WR to succeed. he needed a very strong OL to succeed...he had those in 2016 and with average output, he led the team to victories..... he wasn't asked to do much outside of driving the bus...I am perfectly ok with that...

but the insistence of Dak lovers to put him among the elite...and continuously compare him to HOFers and all time greats...its just very laughable....

Dak QBR was average among his peer...the rating you are pulling off of NFL is meaningless by itself, given 12 others ratings were better than him....so even that stats puts him in the middle of the pack which is what everyone keeps saying...

with that said, I am sure your next response most probably will be, well he is about to get paid, deal with it, burn, or change your team or something to that effect...its an inevitable response from Dak lovers at this point in time.




t

LOL in 2016, neither Dez nor Witten was a “Pro Bowler”. Dez had already begun his steep decline. Nice try!

Dak’s QBR in 2016 was 3rd-best in the NFL, not “in the middle”. Nice try!

LOL you literally said Zeke “ran us to victory” before, I’m glad you’re backtracking on that.

 

[Sydla]

In 2016 and the 2nd half of 2018, he was outstanding.

The rest of the time, he was average.

That’s pretty good from a QB as young as Dak. When you look at the circumstances behind each of those years, you’d see that when Dak has a solid supporting cast he plays great football.

Troy Aikman was also an average QB when he didn’t have a good supporting cast. Team sport.

So for half his time he was good, half his time he was bad.

In no world would anyone sane then conclude, based on PFFs analysis, that Dak Prescott is really one of the best QBs in football. That screams what a lot of people have said............ he's a decent, not great QB.

 

[Nav22]

So for half his time he was good, half his time he was bad.

In no world would anyone sane then conclude, based on PFFs analysis, that Dak Prescott is really one of the best QBs in football. That screams what a lot of people have said............ he's a decent, not great QB.

I didn’t say “bad”, I said “average”.

When his supporting cast is good, he’s been great. When his supporting cast sucks, he’s been average.

If you look closely around the league, you’d see that this puts him in pretty good company. I never said he was “one of the best” but he’s certainly in the top 10.

Pretty good spot to be in 3 years into your career. Where was Russell Wilson being ranked after 3 years?

 

[CATCH17]

Wouldn't take Goff over Dak but would take Trubisky

LOL this place.

It's a coin flip.

Goff is a weakling and should be thanking his lucky stars that McVay is his coach or he would be headed to bustville.

Dak doesn't have Goff's skill as a thrower of the football but Dak is not a liability in big moments like Goff who is out there playing terrified.

 

[mattjames2010]

It's a coin flip.

Goff is a weakling and should be thanking his lucky stars that McVay is his coach or he would be headed to bustville.

Dak doesn't have Goff's skill as a thrower of the football but Dak is not a liability in big moments like Goff who is out there playing terrified.

The criticism of Dak in 2017 was that he played "terrified" after the Atlanta game and he was hearing footsteps.

 

[mattjames2010]

I didn’t say “bad”, I said “average”.

When his supporting cast is good, he’s been great. When his supporting cast sucks, he’s been average.

If you look closely around the league, you’d see that this puts him in pretty good company. I never said he was “one of the best” but he’s certainly in the top 10.

Pretty good spot to be in 3 years into your career. Where was Russell Wilson being ranked after 3 years?

> never said he's one of the best
> he's just a top 10 QB

Wew

 

[Sydla]

I didn’t say “bad”, I said “average”.

When his supporting cast is good, he’s been great. When his supporting cast sucks, he’s been average.

If you look closely around the league, you’d see that this puts him in pretty good company. I never said he was “one of the best” but he’s certainly in the top 10.

Pretty good spot to be in 3 years into your career. Where was Russell Wilson being ranked after 3 years?

You just called him a bus driver...... only good when everything around him is good.

Your own words are betraying you. What you just described isn’t a Top 10 QB.

 

[cern]

he's been hamstrung by linehan and his play calling. I expect him to do far better under Kellen moore's play calling. and having Amari cooper will certainly help. i'm seeing a quantum leap in performance by our qb.

 

[GMO415]

This season we will find out. We play against some of thee best QBs in the league...NO, NE, GB. Then add in other higher paid QBs or soon-to-be paid QBs....MIN, LAR, DET and iggles.

I believe Dak will pass the test.

 

[cern]

This season we will find out. We play against some of thee best QBs in the league...NO, NE, GB. Then add in other higher paid QBs or soon-to-be paid QBs....MIN, LAR, DET and iggles.

I believe Dak will pass the test.

those are 6 very good tests. but for the coaches and the entire team. not just dak. it will be interesting.

 

[Hadenough]

Your ranking system just shows how far off you are on properly analyzing QB's. So basically you took last years numbers ONLY and used that? Which doesnt take into account his other two years or the type of offense that he is in.

However, I notice you didnt include his rushing numbers or rushing TD's which will be top 3. Then you dont mention his 4th quarter and overtime comeback wins which is #1 in the NFL.

The of course there is the leadership/win factor for a QB where he is also near the top of the NFL in his 3 years.

Pro bowls, rookie of the year honors, playoffs, team wins, playoff wins, ect.....ect.....

Yes I'm ranking Dak on his current performance . I didnt include the rushing TD s because that has nothing to do with throwing a football. I didn't take into account wins or losses because Those are team stats.
Dak is middle of the pack to me.

 

[Nav22]

You just called him a bus driver...... only good when everything around him is good.

Your own words are betraying you. What you just described isn’t a Top 10 QB.

So you think there’s 10 NFL QBs who play great football even when their supporting cast is garbage?

Name them.

 

[Number1]

Top 10? better than Matt Ryan who had arguably a better year than his mvp season? Better than Rivers who just went 12-4 and lit up the chiefs? How many people are in your top 10? 15?

keep in mind Dak just went though rebuilding the O with 5 new starters and 5 new WRs, a lame duck OC, and freakish issues on the OL

Ryan had issues too to deal with, by mid seasons both teams were 3-5, Rivers who's O was solid all year .... so let's look at how they played the second half of the year

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/2577417/dak-prescott

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/11237/matt-ryan

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/5529/philip-rivers

compare the same vs FHOF Brady, Brees, and Rodgers

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/2330/tom-brady

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/2580/drew-brees

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/8439/aaron-rodgers

If Brady, Brees, Rodger, Ryan, and Rivers are you top 5 ... none of those guys out played Dak down the stretch
keep in mind those guys all have 5+ years experience on Dak
and in head to head games we've seen him out play Rodgers and Brees

top 5?

Dak ain't far off, only Mahomes played better the 2nd half of 2018

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/3139477/patrick-mahomes

is Dak in the top 10?
yeah

 

[DandyDon52]

most of the qb's fans here would want, the other teams would not let them go.
So it is pointless to say you want them.
Guys like cousins come up available, and bradford, and now foles might have been a good choice. but he was grabbed quickly.

The only way is if Dallas drafts a top prospect, and that is near impossible if they keep finishing 9-7 or better.
To get a good qb in the draft they would have to tank a season. And they wont do that.
They had a good chance last year to just tank and have a high rd 1 pick, but instead they gave their pick up for amari,
and then got beat in the playoffs.

I like amari, he is worth it probably, but I think it was maybe the wrong time to make that move.
I dont know if their is a good qb in this draft. and even if there was I dont know if the jones boys and team could spot the right one.
last time they were looking for guys who all turned out to be busts.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

LOL in 2016, neither Dez nor Witten was a “Pro Bowler”. Dez had already begun his steep decline. Nice try!

Dak’s QBR in 2016 was 3rd-best in the NFL, not “in the middle”. Nice try!

LOL you literally said Zeke “ran us to victory” before, I’m glad you’re backtracking on that.

ahh, they were pro bowlers that Dak got to play with and couldn't get them the ball enough...

witten was a top 10 TE in yards and catches in 2015....

Dez was a 1300 yard receiver and top 10 receiver in 2014, and yes he was injured in 2015....

so Dak had some players around him that had produced in the NFL and top 10 in stats in the lague.

and perhaps his QBR was high, but that's exactly my point...he was 19th in total passing yards.....QBR doesn't take into account total yards and production....Dak was a bus driver in 2016. asked not to make mistakes. drive the bus, let the team around him lead to victory. he was protected not to mess up.

and yes, Zeke runs us to victory. stats don't lie as you have continuously pointed out. when zeke does well we win. when zeke doesn't do well we generally lose. doesn't matter what dak does in those games.

so not back tracking on zeke, as much as you want me to......we know what Dak is without zeke...he is 4-3...

but keep ignoring those and stick to your meaningless stats because it makes you feel good.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

I didn’t say “bad”, I said “average”.

When his supporting cast is good, he’s been great. When his supporting cast sucks, he’s been average.

If you look closely around the league, you’d see that this puts him in pretty good company. I never said he was “one of the best” but he’s certainly in the top 10.

Pretty good spot to be in 3 years into your career. Where was Russell Wilson being ranked after 3 years?

let me correct that....

when his supporting cast is good...he has been good...when his supporting cast has been average, he has sucked.

which is par for the course and the whole argument. dak needs a strong supporting cast to be good as he can't elevate those around him.

what's wrong with that? why are you offended by the fact that Dak is average? middle of the pack.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

It's a coin flip.

Goff is a weakling and should be thanking his lucky stars that McVay is his coach or he would be headed to bustville.

Dak doesn't have Goff's skill as a thrower of the football but Dak is not a liability in big moments like Goff who is out there playing terrified.

but Goff got the team to superbowl.....

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

So you think there’s 10 NFL QBs who play great football even when their supporting cast is garbage?

Name them.

they make garbage look average.
they make average look good
they make good look great.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

I didn’t say “bad”, I said “average”.

When his supporting cast is good, he’s been great. When his supporting cast sucks, he’s been average.

If you look closely around the league, you’d see that this puts him in pretty good company. I never said he was “one of the best” but he’s certainly in the top 10.

Pretty good spot to be in 3 years into your career. Where was Russell Wilson being ranked after 3 years?

russel Wilson won the superbowl in h is first 3 years.....not sure if that's a fair comparison for Dak

 

[Nav22]

ahh, they were pro bowlers that Dak got to play with and couldn't get them the ball enough...

witten was a top 10 TE in yards and catches in 2015....

Dez was a 1300 yard receiver and top 10 receiver in 2014, and yes he was injured in 2015....

so Dak had some players around him that had produced in the NFL and top 10 in stats in the lague.

and perhaps his QBR was high, but that's exactly my point...he was 19th in total passing yards.....QBR doesn't take into account total yards and production....Dak was a bus driver in 2016. asked not to make mistakes. drive the bus, let the team around him lead to victory. he was protected not to mess up.

and yes, Zeke runs us to victory. stats don't lie as you have continuously pointed out. when zeke does well we win. when zeke doesn't do well we generally lose. doesn't matter what dak does in those games.

so not back tracking on zeke, as much as you want me to......we know what Dak is without zeke...he is 4-3...

but keep ignoring those and stick to your meaningless stats because it makes you feel good.

Try this.

Look up Dak’s record in games when he has a 90+ passer rating (or a 70 QBR if you’d like).

Now compare that to our record when Dak doesn’t reach those numbers.

Let me know what you learn. Here’s a hint: when your team wins, that usually means the key players played well. Dak and Zeke are BOTH key players.