Draft debate: Trading up to get who your target

CowboyoWales · Apr 15, 2022

darthseinfeld said:
Micah no, but there are Lamb caliber players in this draft. With Lamb, they had him ranked 6th in that class and he dropped. When they talk about "another Lamb", I believe they are talking about that type of value

Ive heard a number of times that CeeDee would be WR1 in this draft.

darthseinfeld · Apr 15, 2022

CowboyoWales said:
Ive heard a number of times that CeeDee would be WR1 in this draft.

Im not talking in terms of WR's, but overall talent

JBS · Apr 15, 2022

We might as well package 1+2 every year to move up. We just waste our 2nd rounders anyways.

Aerolithe_Lion · Apr 15, 2022

I think there are 3 major factors:

1. The Unique aspect of the player. Do you feel he’s a generational talent, or uniquely qualified to fit with Dallas better than anyone else? Are you missing out if you draft literally anyone else?

2. the position. If Dallas loves Jordan Davis, trading up for a DT is a slam dunk. If Dallas covets Chris Olave, trading as much as an extra 1 to move up for a WR is a questionable move IMO.

3. the draft itself. What is the talent value at your original pick? If you feel there’s a drop off in talent level just before you pick, absolutely you move up. If you feel the opposite and the talent at 15 is right around what it’ll be at 24, it’s not as wise.

CowboyoWales · Apr 15, 2022

darthseinfeld said:
Im not talking in terms of WR's, but overall talent

So if we agree there's no Edge (assuming we all want Micah to play on the line) and there's no WR better than CeeDee which impact player are we drafting up for?
As mentioned repeatedly by a number of posters this isnt the year to trade up (and lose the valued picks for the privilege), the value is to trade down especially if we can get additional 2nd/3rd RD picks.

baltcowboy · Apr 15, 2022

darthseinfeld said:
This weeks debate is in the merits of trading up to get the player you covet. This comes on the heals of Jerry Jones saying essentially he is looking for another Micah or Lamb. Our last two trade ups in round 1 are both compelling arguments for and against. 2010, Dez Bryant and 2012 Morris Claiborne.

This weeks debate: Would trading up from 24 to get an impact player be wise for the Cowboys

Only for Cross. He is a young Tyron Smith clone.

Hawkeye0202 · Apr 15, 2022

Yes......but only for 1 of the top three tackles. Drafting let's say Neal or Cross is like killing two birds with one shot.......immediate LG starter, future Tyron Smith's replacement. The beauty of this also is WHEN Tyron misses his usual 3-5 games you have quality options.

Cebrin · Apr 15, 2022

darthseinfeld said:
This weeks debate is in the merits of trading up to get the player you covet. This comes on the heals of Jerry Jones saying essentially he is looking for another Micah or Lamb. Our last two trade ups in round 1 are both compelling arguments for and against. 2010, Dez Bryant and 2012 Morris Claiborne.

This weeks debate: Would trading up from 24 to get an impact player be wise for the Cowboys

I'd rather trade down unless a top 15-20 falls in our lap.

sdfidaho · Apr 15, 2022

I’m not a fan of taking TE’s early, but I’d trade up in the 2nd to get Trey McBride as long as they got their plug-and-play LG in the 1st.
I think he’s going to be very special

darthseinfeld · Apr 16, 2022

Aerolithe_Lion said:
I think there are 3 major factors:

1. The Unique aspect of the player. Do you feel he’s a generational talent, or uniquely qualified to fit with Dallas better than anyone else? Are you missing out if you draft literally anyone else?

2. the position. If Dallas loves Jordan Davis, trading up for a DT is a slam dunk. If Dallas covets Chris Olave, trading as much as an extra 1 to move up for a WR is a questionable move IMO.

3. the draft itself. What is the talent value at your original pick? If you feel there’s a drop off in talent level just before you pick, absolutely you move up. If you feel the opposite and the talent at 15 is right around what it’ll be at 24, it’s not as wise.

Good post. Ill give an example of a guy I would consider with your caveats. Trevor Penning

1) Unique. Don't know of I would say unique but he has the versatility to thrive at different spots on the the OL that make him uncommon

2) Position. He is probably playing OG for a year or two and that doesn't check the box. But you look at with with an eye on him being your future at LT and that does

3) The draft itself. If you are looking at the prospect purely in terms on initial roi, the gap betweem Penning and Green/Johnson may not be very big right now. But there is tremendous value in potentially secure your LT for 10 years. We arent getting that with Green and Johnson, and we are unlikely to get that at 24. Tyler Smith would be your best bet, and there is big bust potential

CowboyoWales · Apr 16, 2022

darthseinfeld said:
Good post. Ill give an example of a guy I would consider with your caveats. Trevor Penning

1) Unique. Don't know of I would say unique but he has the versatility to thrive at different spots on the the OL that make him uncommon

2) Position. He is probably playing OG for a year or two and that doesn't check the box. But you look at with with an eye on him being your future at LT and that does

3) The draft itself. If you are looking at the prospect purely in terms on initial roi, the gap betweem Penning and Green/Johnson may not be very big right now. But there is tremendous value in potentially secure your LT for 10 years. We arent getting that with Green and Johnson, and we are unlikely to get that at 24. Tyler Smith would be your best bet, and there is big bust potential

So you're advocating trading up for a player that potentionally secures your LT position for 10 years. Penning appears far from being the lock which we'd be expecting as we'd be potentially (at worse) giving a 2nd and 3rd Rd to get him.....if he was a guaranteed lock (Neal) then maybe, but to trade up you want to be certain.
The trade-up fraternity appear those that are scared drafting a Guard, even though every mock has either Green/Johnson as BPA at around 24.

DanA · Apr 16, 2022

Every time I’ve done a mock draft I’ve not been too happy with 2nd/3rd round picks compared to what goes in that trade up range at 40 or so.

LACowboysFan1 · Apr 16, 2022

Could work out, could not work out.

Cowboys need offensive line help terribly. What if there's a run on them? Threre are about 6 really top prospects there - Green, Johnson and Linderbaum at guard/center & Neal, Cross and Penning at tackle. Imo Dallas needs one of those. Sure, all 6 of those taken before #24 is somewhat unlikely. But there are so many teams with young qbs that need protection to be able to quickly blossom, not having to deal with getting sacked a lot is a great help.

Per one of the draft sites, I counted 9 teams that have OT or IOL as a need. That of course is 3 more than the available top talented OL players. Wouldn't take much for a run on those guys to wipe out all 6, now Dallas has to try and select the lesser-rated guys who have to "develop", and with players like T. Smith on their way out and players like Pollard nearing the end of their rookie contracts, I just don't feel Dallas has the luxury of time to develop players on the line. Continuity is big for the o-line, let's get a stud in there now...

Cowboyny · Apr 16, 2022

morasp said:
Agree, and I would probably add round 4 as well. Pollard, Schultz, Armstrong, Prescott, and Hitchens.

Think trade up in rd 2 or 3 makes more sense then in 1. Would like a small trade back at 24, give us more ammo to trade up on day 2

Cowboyny · Apr 16, 2022

darthseinfeld said:
Outside of Murray and Gallup even our better 3rd rounders hits have been average at best. In the last 15 years, only Crawford, Terence Williams, Jourdan Lewis, and Gallup have gotten 2nd contracts from us. Gallup is the only one of them that is really notable. Its too early to tell with Gallimore and Odighizuwa, but I dont think either are any better than Maliek Collins was.

If I sacrifice that because Dez Bryant 2010 situation arrises (Penning, Davis, Johnson) Im not losing any sleep over pulling the trigger

Thing is, I don’t see a game changer in this class even within the top 5. Good depth, but lacking star power

visionary · Apr 16, 2022

No way am I trading up for anyone

Stay at 24 and pick between Jones, Green and Zion. One or more of these 3 will be there

Gaede · Apr 16, 2022

There's not a single player in the first round draft that's worth trading up for.

Fla Cowpoke · Apr 16, 2022

Cowboyny said:
Outside top 5 prospects, have zero interest in moving up. This is truly the yr to trade back and get as many top 100 picks as possible

Yep, I think at 24 we are in a sweet spot where we can move down 4 or 5 spots and pick up a 3rd and still get a guy we like. We have so many holes and with the cap the way it is, if we can add 6 or 7 guys through the draft that stick it is good for the cap and it is good for the roster. We need at least two OL, one edge, one CB, one LB and a backup TE to develop for sure.

Fla Cowpoke · Apr 16, 2022

Hawkeye0202 said:
Yes......but only for 1 of the top three tackles. Drafting let's say Neal or Cross is like killing two birds with one shot.......immediate LG starter, future Tyron Smith's replacement. The beauty of this also is WHEN Tyron misses his usual 3-5 games you have quality options.

Yep, that could be a great move but I think I'd rather have the extra picks.

Fla Cowpoke · Apr 16, 2022

sdfidaho said:
I’m not a fan of taking TE’s early, but I’d trade up in the 2nd to get Trey McBride as long as they got their plug-and-play LG in the 1st.
I think he’s going to be very special

I like McBride too. Not sure if he is worth trading up for. Maybe if we went down some in the 1st and picked up another third, maybe you could package the 2nd and a 5th to move up, although I have seen McBride in the 3rd in a lot of mocks.

Draft debate: Trading up to get who your target

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