Realistic contract for Shultz

CowboysFaninHouston

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ESisback said:
Of course he’d a HUGE luxury, and I hope they don’t do it, but doesn’t that sound Jerry-ish?

My wish is Jordan Davis at 24, followed by OL, DE, WR, LB, TE, RB, OL, WR, then a couple of FA’s.
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I would love to see a trade down to bottom of first, take an OG, perhaps even Linderbaum if he is still there.
 
ESisback

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CowboysFaninHouston said:
I would love to see a trade down to bottom of first, take an OG, perhaps even Linderbaum if he is still there.
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I could ride with that too! But do you think Linderbaum would last until 31, and why take the chance? Just grab him at 24.
 

Dalmations202

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CowboyRoy said:
He was the #2 receiving option last year behind Lamb. Shultz was a big part of Dak's passing game and security blanket on many first downs and down by the GL.

They basically made a decision of Cooper or Gallup and Shultz. Without question, they made the right call. Not even close to be honest.

Having Lamb as the new #1 certainly helped.
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I question if they made the correct call. ( #1 Coop) or (#3 Gallup with avg receiving TE Schultz who hurts the running game).
I will be the first to admit they may have made the correct call, but to say without question is a joke to me.

IF -- they find a better TE -- Woods, Wydermeyer, Ruckert, Otten, McBride in this draft who can both catch and block better than Schultz, then it comes down to whether you think Coop or Gallup is the better receiver, because they will let Schultz go--- IF--- they find a better TE.

And if Coop get 1200 yards next year in Cleveland with Watson -- then Dallas will NEVER admit their mistake and that they blamed him for the real problems they have.

What if Dallas running game takes off and by mid year they have a new starting TE? Would they have made the correct call then?

The injuries to Coop may have meant they made the correct choice and they were getting out early instead of too late. So I don't want it to sound like I hate the trade. I just don't know enough about what they really know or don't know to make a legit judgement on it. I do have the last 1/4 century of futility to tell me that Dallas isn't infallible though. I also want to say that YES Schultz is a good check down who can catch very well when covered by one of their least best cover guys. Schultz is a good receiving TE, that I think hurts their overall offense with his inability to block either in line or in space. He is not an elite receiving threat, and he is not an elite blocker. Yes he is average and can help the team, but no I don't see him as top 5, and shouldn't have been paid that way.

If I were Schultz and offered the money.......I would take it 10 times out of 10 though.
 

kskboys

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Doomsday101 said:
Kyle Pitts

Kyle Pitts Contract Breakdowns, Salary Cap Figures, Salaries, Bonuses | Spotrac

What people seem to be doing in undervaluing players, especially Cowboys players. Outside of Zeke the Cowboys have not overpaid, some guys have not lived up to their contracts I think DLaw is one but when Cooper got his deal people whined he was over paid, now that he is gone they are whining about that as well. The NFL has a market value and you can choose to avoid that and not pay players, that is the organization choice. As for Dalton I do agree that to pay him on a long term deal, he will have to show that he can both block and receive
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No wonder ATL can't win.
 
Cebrin

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Coogiguy03 said:
If and when we sign him, what kind of deal is he worth?? I say 4 years 16-20 million???
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As much as this board will hate this he was a top 3 to 5 TE last year in production. There are variables, and tape, but regardless he's definitely one of the bettter young TE's in football right now.

I wish I could drum up when I said he'd be good here, but I'm not bored enough to hunt for it. I got plenty of guff for it. I'm wrong plenty, so I'm here to say I was right. :laugh:

I do think the production can be replaced, and think the FO feels the same. I thought at this point he'd have developed in to a much better blocker. That was his strength early on.
 

kskboys

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Doomsday101 said:
Fact is SF and KC can win and yet pay TE, Kittle 15 million and Kelce 14.3 million. Fact is your sense of market value and that of the NFL are 2 different things.
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Actually, I think it's your sense of market value that is screwed up.

Fact is, KC and SF have everything else in place.
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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ESisback said:
I could ride with that too! But do you think Linderbaum would last until 31, and why take the chance? Just grab him at 24.
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not sure...he is a center and centers are less valued (although we as Cowboys know value of a good center). They have to be out of this world good to be taken high in the draft just in mid first round. so there is a chance he may drop since some teams may panic and jump on certain players they like because they won't last into second (WRs, as deep as it maybe or QB, or DTs or DEs)....and Linderbaum has some questions, although I think he will be good in NFL as he is a technician and just needs to add a little power and he already has good size. I think one of the top guards would last to our spot in the second, but I seriously doubt Jerry and company to do the right thing and draft two OL men back to back in first two rounds.
 
Doomsday101

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kskboys said:
Actually, I think it's your sense of market value that is screwed up.

Fact is, KC and SF have everything else in place.
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Players are paid a lot like it or not, you want to underpay players and act as if we set our on market value? lol Yes they pay to keep top players, had these guys left they would have gapping holes in their team. Kittle is getting 15 mill, is Schultz? NO, he is getting in the areas where his number justify his contract. You down play it all you want. Your sense of Market value and what teams across the NFL does not match up
 

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fivetwos said:
But it's certainly part of things, and we are paying 11m to a guy who is a liability in that regard while being cheap elsewhere.

I don't want a block first TE. I want a guy who is catch first but isn't bad in the run game. He himself knows he was bad and is trying to do something about it. I'm rooting for him.
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its about available options and then assuming we don't have that player.....I understand the sentiment of fans not wanting to pay that much, although where the market is and where fans think it should be are never the same. but 3 other TEs got tagged and all similar to Schultz, so that left dallas with no real options in FA. add to it other factors that we lost cooper, we lost wilson. and that was a 1/3 of our recieving and then if we would have lost Schultz that would have been over 50% of our recieving and put us in a desparate situation. now, there was also no other option after him really, I don't look at McKeon and go wow, I am ready to have him take a major role in our offense. he maybe cheap, but sometimes Cheap gets you what you pay, which is not good. so most think he is worth, what? 8-10 M, so one season you over pay by what?1-3M to make sure you don't have a huge need (again due to everything else that's happened) and then you have a year to draft, find another FA or something else (not sure what)..... its about contingency planning. so yeah, in fans mind he may not be worth what he is getting, reality is market says otherwise.

probably, we draft a TE, move on, hopefully that TE shows potential. hopefully we draft a WR and he works out. but none of that has happened yet, so lets wait until it happens before we walk away from schultz. and market reality says, he will probably get a 4 year about 12-14M average salary (higher salary later in the contract), which is about where TE market is moving to, given the Elite like Kelce, Andrews, Kittle are 15+ and about to get contracts redone over next couple of years and move closer to 20M range.
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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Dalmations202 said:
I question if they made the correct call. ( #1 Coop) or (#3 Gallup with avg receiving TE Schultz who hurts the running game).
I will be the first to admit they may have made the correct call, but to say without question is a joke to me.

IF -- they find a better TE -- Woods, Wydermeyer, Ruckert, Otten, McBride in this draft who can both catch and block better than Schultz, then it comes down to whether you think Coop or Gallup is the better receiver, because they will let Schultz go--- IF--- they find a better TE.

And if Coop get 1200 yards next year in Cleveland with Watson -- then Dallas will NEVER admit their mistake and that they blamed him for the real problems they have.

What if Dallas running game takes off and by mid year they have a new starting TE? Would they have made the correct call then?

The injuries to Coop may have meant they made the correct choice and they were getting out early instead of too late. So I don't want it to sound like I hate the trade. I just don't know enough about what they really know or don't know to make a legit judgement on it. I do have the last 1/4 century of futility to tell me that Dallas isn't infallible though. I also want to say that YES Schultz is a good check down who can catch very well when covered by one of their least best cover guys. Schultz is a good receiving TE, that I think hurts their overall offense with his inability to block either in line or in space. He is not an elite receiving threat, and he is not an elite blocker. Yes he is average and can help the team, but no I don't see him as top 5, and shouldn't have been paid that way.

If I were Schultz and offered the money.......I would take it 10 times out of 10 though.
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lets be clear, our running game hurts not just because of Schultz, but because of OL. our LG and Center position are huge weakness. you build the OL, the rest will come, but you don't build through your TE.

and lets wait until we draft a TE, see how he is before dumping the one we have....
 

kskboys

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Doomsday101 said:
Players are paid a lot like it or not, you want to underpay players and act as if we set our on market value? lol Yes they pay to keep top players, had these guys left they would have gapping holes in their team. Kittle is getting 15 mill, is Schultz? NO, he is getting in the areas where his number justify his contract. You down play it all you want. Your sense of Market value and what teams across the NFL does not match up
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No matter how pouty you get, it's your overall sense of contracts that doesn't make sense.
 
Doomsday101

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kskboys said:
No matter how pouty you get, it's your overall sense of contracts that doesn't make sense.
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It is what is paid across the NFL, yes they are paid a lot. Schultz was 3rd in most reception in the NFL for TE he was 2nd in TD catches, it is what it is. Not being pouty at all, NFL market value is high, I would say too high but it it what it is and only going up in price. Dallas can allow all these players to leave and no doubt many would be happy about it and yet will whine because we are not paying a kings fortune for FA.
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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john van brocklin said:
Agreed, he cant block, and can only catch.
Don't see why we even tagged him.
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what were other options? Jarwin...oh wait. he sucked and injured. McKeon? unfortunately we can't take 50 minutes of game time and extrapolate a season and career out of it, and even then he sucked. so draft? who? has draft happened? do you know who we are getting and have at hand already? even then are you projecting his college output to NFL? have we even seen "whomever" in preseason? its about options and available options. If we had kept Cooper and Wilson I would say, ok, let Schultz walk, but we lost cooper, wilson and losing schultz would have amounted to more than 50% of our recieving output. add to it the mess the OL is in and need at DE, DT and Saftey and OC, OG and add to that TE....yeah, not enough draft picks in first 4 rounds to address all needs. despite his lack of blocking ability he was the only viable option and a move that made sense.

three other TEs similar to Schultz were tagged. it is what it is in the NFL.
 
john van brocklin

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CowboysFaninHouston said:
what were other options? Jarwin...oh wait. he sucked and injured. McKeon? unfortunately we can't take 50 minutes of game time and extrapolate a season and career out of it, and even then he sucked. so draft? who? has draft happened? do you know who we are getting and have at hand already? even then are you projecting his college output to NFL? have we even seen "whomever" in preseason? its about options and available options. If we had kept Cooper and Wilson I would say, ok, let Schultz walk, but we lost cooper, wilson and losing schultz would have amounted to more than 50% of our recieving output. add to it the mess the OL is in and need at DE, DT and Saftey and OC, OG and add to that TE....yeah, not enough draft picks in first 4 rounds to address all needs. despite his lack of blocking ability he was the only viable option and a move that made sense.

three other TEs similar to Schultz were tagged. it is what it is in the NFL.
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There were some nice TE's in free agency that signed for less than the tag amount.
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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john van brocklin said:
There were some nice TE's in free agency that signed for less than the tag amount.
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not impressed with any of the TEs that signed else where. again, if we had kept wilson, cooper or either, I would be OK. but no denying that Schultz was better than those other FAs...yes we want better blocking, but if he had that too, he would be in the 15M plus range. so thus the 11M range. if we had lost schultz, plus cooper and wilson, that would be more impact than just losing 50% of recieving output. as strategy to stop cowboys would be simple.

I am not making Schultz into this can't lose TE....no denying he is better than these other average cheaper TEs that signed elsewhere....but its the overall combination of everything that has happened and players we have lost.......give one of these other TEs a few million and then keep wilson...I would be OK...because Wilson can start in a pinch, has impact and was great depth and then any of these other average TEs and combination would be much better. keep cooper, plus wilson and any TE, the combination would be better....but washington and any of these other TEs is crap.
 
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