It seems that Trysten Hill belongs on a milk carton

Sydla · Sep 10, 2019

buybuydandavis said:
Bottom of the 2nd, and picked for his physical traits.

Collins, Covington, Hyder, and Crawford for pass rushing DTs. Woods as 1T. Not a bunch of bums. Not so easy for a rookie to dislodge. It would be great to have him do it game one, but a failure to do that isn't something to get excited about.

Stop.

Covington and Hyder are basically journeyman type DL. They aren't good enough that they would block a 2nd round pick who played well in preseason from making the active roster.

Hill isn't on the active roster for one reason - he showed in camp and preseason games he was overmatched by NFL talent at this point in his development. It wasn't that Covington, for example was so good, that he kept Hill off the active list. Frankly, Covington was just blah in preseason himself. But Hill was simply raw and overmatched by back up OL in the preseason.

The fact a 2nd round DT can't get active in his first game is pretty disappointing and I suspect that wasn't the plan the Cowboys had in mind when they used the 58th pick on him when there were safeties on the board they also liked.

erod · Sep 10, 2019

So the top two defensive linemen of your last three drafts can't dress out on game day.

That defines the word 'bust'.

xwalker · Sep 10, 2019

Sydla said:
Was Russell Maryland inactive for his first game? Was JJ Watt?

Most top college DL do take some time to get their feet wet but few, if any, are so bad that they are inactive in their first ro game. I tried to do a quick look and I couldn't find a first or second round DL that was healthy and also was inactive in their first NFL game. Granted, I only loked at a few drafts from a couple of years ago.

Top 10 DL...

Verdict · Sep 10, 2019

buybuydandavis said:
Bottom of the 2nd, and picked for his physical traits.

Collins, Covington, Hyder, and Crawford for pass rushing DTs. Woods as 1T. Not a bunch of bums. Not so easy for a rookie to dislodge. It would be great to have him do it game one, but a failure to do that isn't something to get excited about.

I’m going to have to disagree with your assessment. They would normally be forcing the playing time like they did with Taco. The fact they aren’t doesnt bode well for Hill—-at least at this point.

buybuydandavis · Sep 10, 2019

Sydla said:
Stop.

Covington and Hyder are basically journeyman type DL. They aren't good enough that they would block a 2nd round pick who played well in preseason from making the active roster.

Hill isn't on the active roster for one reason - he showed in camp and preseason games he was overmatched by NFL talent at this point in his development. It wasn't that Covington, for example was so good, that he kept Hill off the active list. Frankly, Covington was just blah in preseason himself. But Hill was simply raw and overmatched by back up OL in the preseason.

The fact a 2nd round DT can't get active in his first game is pretty disappointing and I suspect that wasn't the plan the Cowboys had in mind when they used the 58th pick on him when there were safeties on the board they also liked.

It's not like we haven't put over matched nobody UDFAs on the roster before at DT. In other seasons, Hill would have been active. This season, not. Our journeymen are better than usual.

Verdict · Sep 10, 2019

xwalker said:
They limited the snaps for DLaw and Crawford to about half of what they played last season.

The could go with 1 less DE this week.

It seems easier to have Hill active than Taco based on the numbers at DE vs DT.

DT
Maliek Collins
Antwaun Woods
Christian Covington

DE
DeMarcus Lawrence
Dorance Armstrong

DE/DT
Tyrone Crawford
Kerry Hyder
Joe Jackson

Inactive:
DT Trysten Hill
DE Taco Charlton

You would expect Hill to be active over Taco based on the numbers at the position. Taco has years of experience on his side over Hill. Jason’s Garret’s comments on Taco recently didn’t sound too favorable to Taco, although that involves reading between the lines. He must really have a bad attitude.

Verdict · Sep 10, 2019

erod said:
So the top two defensive linemen of your last three drafts can't dress out on game day.

That defines the word 'bust'.

It sure doesn’t bode well for either of them does it. I prefer Marinelli get fired. But if not I hope they tie him up and ball gag him when he gets ready to express his opinion on draft day.

Verdict · Sep 10, 2019

xwalker said:
Jay Ratliff and many players that become starters were inactive for game 1 of their rookie season.

Jay Ratliff was a 7th round pick though.

gimmesix · Sep 10, 2019

Sydla said:
Stop.

Covington and Hyder are basically journeyman type DL. They aren't good enough that they would block a 2nd round pick who played well in preseason from making the active roster.

Hill isn't on the active roster for one reason - he showed in camp and preseason games he was overmatched by NFL talent at this point in his development. It wasn't that Covington, for example was so good, that he kept Hill off the active list. Frankly, Covington was just blah in preseason himself. But Hill was simply raw and overmatched by back up OL in the preseason.

The fact a 2nd round DT can't get active in his first game is pretty disappointing and I suspect that wasn't the plan the Cowboys had in mind when they used the 58th pick on him when there were safeties on the board they also liked.

Not sure that I'd consider either Covington or Hyder journeyman types. Both have essentially been with one team. Hyder was signed by the Jets as a UDFA and stashed on their PS, then signed by Detroit. He was playing at a pretty high level before his injury. Covington was drafted by Houston and has not played for anyone else.

However, your point is still valid. If Hill was playing like a second-round pick, those players would not be keeping him off the active roster. I do think, though, it is also valid to say that if he was on a weaker roster, he probably would have been active. I am not sure, for example, that in 2017 players like Richard Ash and Lewis Neal would have been active ahead of him. But I'm not sure they wouldn't have either, which is your point. It would have been nice to see him come out of the gate strong instead of essentially making the roster because he was a second-round pick with potential. (Daniel Wise actually deserved the roster spot more than Hill did.)

Verdict · Sep 10, 2019

big dog cowboy said:

If you don’t think that’s a bad sign bro, I think you are expecting too little from a second rounder.

Verdict · Sep 10, 2019

xwalker said:
From the 2019 Draft:

DTs (rounds 2 and 3) active for game one: Zero

All Positions (rounds 1 and 2) NOT active for game one: 10

DTs (not top 20 picks) active for game one: 3

DTs (any round) with a sack: Zero

DTs (not top 20 picks) with a solo tackle: 1

That sounds well and good but Hill has a journeyman UDFA starting over him. That’s not a good sign bro.

Sydla · Sep 10, 2019

xwalker said:
Top 10 DL...

LOL. The other guy brought up those names and introduced them into the discussion. I didn't bring them up. I didn't use them in my analysis. And I said I only looked at DL drafted a few years ago. Watt and Maryland were drafted way before a couple of years ago.

buybuydandavis · Sep 10, 2019

Verdict said:
I’m going to have to disagree with your assessment. They would normally be forcing the playing time like they did with Taco. The fact they aren’t doesnt bode well for Hill—-at least at this point.

They aren't forcing Taco this year either. We've got more depth that usual.

Verdict · Sep 10, 2019

Whyjerry said:
Not Hill’s fault. Remember the guy had a 3 or 4 round grade by most. Did not play a lot in college. Dallas reached for him big time. Maybe he is a great athlete but not a good football player. That happens often.

Yes. That’s the point. It was a huge reach. Maybe it will pay off, maybe it won’t.

So many urged patience with Taco and so far that patience has been misplaced. The dude has bust written all over him at this point.

This could be more of the same. It’s sure not looking good. Yeah, Hill could end up being all that and a bag of chips. But so far, it’s not looking like a good pick. Most of us were like *** when he was picked. Very few were on the Hill bandwagon. And probably rightly so.

Verdict · Sep 10, 2019

buybuydandavis said:
They aren't forcing Taco this year either. We've got more depth that usual.

They are forcing Taco —-off the roster.

Whirlwin · Sep 10, 2019

Manster_Mash said:
We had our choice of quality Safeties, and they drafted this clown. This was a wasted pick. May just as well torn up the draft card on draft night and made it rain on Goodell.

I dont care if this blob becomes a serviceable DT 3 years from now, his contract will almost be up by then. What #@*!king good does that do us?

Obviously you just don't understand.

Fredbeard said:
The jaylon smith pick was already addressed earlier in this thread. Other posters bring up
D law as a example but it is flawed to assume that because it took d law time to develop
That trysten hill will follow the same trajectory and become a elite player. I made this point
Before that the cowboys were also said to be interested in Khalen Saunders ,who was drafted in the third round and Renel wren,who was drafted in the fourth round. Why did they choose hill when the hey could have drafted Saunders or wren later?. Both players had combine performances that were close to hill and Saunders was far more productive in college.

I was responding to someone who was responding to me constantly just annoying. He has a troll agenda

xwalker · Sep 10, 2019

Sydla said:
LOL. The other guy brought up those names and introduced them into the discussion. I didn't bring them up. I didn't use them in my analysis. And I said I only looked at DL drafted a few years ago. Watt and Maryland were drafted way before a couple of years ago.

Your post had two top 10 players. That's what I responded to.

Zero 2nd or 3rd round DL from this years draft were active.

Hill was 6 picks from being a 3rd rounder. There are plenty of 3rd round picks that are inactive for game 1.

Whirlwin · Sep 10, 2019

Verdict said:
Yes. That’s the point. It was a huge reach. Maybe it will pay off, maybe it won’t.

So many urged patience with Taco and so far that patience has been misplaced. The dude has bust written all over him at this point.

This could be more of the same. It’s sure not looking good. Yeah, Hill could end up being all that and a bag of chips. But so far, it’s not looking like a good pick. Most of us were like *** when he was picked. Very few were on the Hill bandwagon. And probably rightly so.

I actually think it's a little bit of the opposite. A football player without much talent

Fredbeard · Sep 10, 2019

gimmesix said:
I would think the scouts who brought it to McClay's attention would be first in line. Then, McClay. Then, Marinelli and his coaches.

I really do not know how much weight Marinelli actually has in the evaluation process. I'm sure the scouting department wants to get someone who is a good fit for his scheme, but other than that, I'm not sure he has a button to push that says he wants a specific player. He likely gives his input from speaking and working with a player after that player is under consideration and it is valued to an extent ... but if I'm the guy whose head is on the chopping block, so to speak, concerning draft picks, I'm not going to pick a player strictly based on Marinelli's opinion, especially since Marinelli's never shown that he's particularly good at that aspect of the game.

It's kind of like the Joey Ivie pick that Marinelli gets blasted over. It was a late-rounder when there are a lot of players that teams take a flier on. It wasn't like anyone knew whether he'd turn out to be worthwhile, but Marinelli getting excited about it seems to have made a lot of fans use that as a sign that taking him was Marinelli's fault. I don't see anyone blaming the secondary coaches for us taking Marquez White a round earlier than that or the running back coach for Bo Scarbrough being taken in the seventh round the next year and failing. (Maybe we just blame the coordinators and head coach?)

I tend to blame the scouting department when draft picks fail and give them credit when draft picks succeed, because I really can't say I know the process beyond that.

Rod gets picked for the Joey Ivey pick because the one tech was a position of need and the cowboys waited until the seventh round to draft a guy who didn’t make the roster,while there were defensive tackles drafted a round or two earlier who have had fairly good careers so far. Remember the following season , Stephen paea retired and Malik Collins had to play the one tech?

Verdict · Sep 10, 2019

gimmesix said:
Hill was always a long-term project IMO. He was taken more off potential than the fact that he had established himself. This is essentially a redshirt year for him.

You shouldn’t redshirt a 2nd round pick. Lol. That’s for late round picks.

It seems that Trysten Hill belongs on a milk carton

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