2009 Draft "Needs" list?

[jterrell]

1. OL or Safety. Guy you draft should be able to start day 1.
2. whichever of the above you didnt fill or QB to be the primary backup.
3. Linebacker... yes this sad beyond belief but Carpenter was/is a waste and Burnett is always hurt.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

He's going to be one heck of a LT

yea I wouldn't mind gambling on him in a trade up.

 

[Cowboy Bill Watts]

guarantees for opening day next season.

1. either BJ or bollinger, or both will not be on the roster.

2. at least one rookie QB on either the final roster or PS via either draft or UFA.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

Cal LB Zack Follett

He's good and he's plays in a 3-4.

 

[Goldenrichards83]

I would love for the Cowboys with there first 3 picks to go:

OG/OT Herman Johnson or Phil Loadholt
SS Kam Chancellor or Patrick Chung
DT BJ Raji or Demarcus Granger

However if Brandon Spikes is on the board in the 2nd rd(which I really doubt he will be) he should be the pick.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

i think it would be better to find a DE then move Ratliff. There's really isn't a huge NT that's going to be there by our 2nd round pick....It's going to be hard for any NT to replicate the success that Ratliff is having.

We don't need a NT to be as successful as Ratliff. Ratliff excells as a pass rusher, but is below averege stopping the run (for a NT), we need someone who's the complete opposite.

 

[ThatsmyQB]

I would love for the Cowboys with there first 3 picks to go:

OG/OT Herman Johnson or Phil Loadholt
SS Kam Chancellor or Patrick Chung
DT BJ Raji or Demarcus Granger

However if Brandon Spikes is on the board in the 2nd rd(which I really doubt he will be) he should be the pick.

Spikes would be the ONLY L.B. I'd aprove of drafting with our top pick, I'd rather sure up the D-line which will help the L.B.'s more then a L.B. would, and then use our top pickin 2010 on a stud I.L.B. to come in behind a stout D-line.

I'd like our 1st 3 picks in no particular order to be

N.T.
D.T. to convert to D.E. that can rush the passer
F.S.

With one exception, if we don't re-sign Columbo, and Loadholt is still there, take him and plug him in next to Davis and our Running game would just dominate with Barber and Felix running 5 yards before a defender can touch them. LOL

 

[ThatsmyQB]

We don't need a NT to be as successful as Ratliff. Ratliff excells as a pass rusher, but is below averege stopping the run (for a NT), we need someone who's the complete opposite.

BINGO, I still don't know why we don't put Spears at N.T. and move Ratliff to R.D.E. and move Canty to L.D.E., that would make more sense IMO since Spears can't do anyhting but clog up the running lanes, hence move him to N.T. and Ratliff at R.D.E. where he would be free to rush the passer!

Anyhow, we need not one but TWO big N.T.'s in this draft, cause no point in getting just one, we don't have ANY True 3-4 N./T. on this current team, so we need one to come in day 1 and start, and the other to be the backup to spell him, and in case of injury so we won't have to move Ratlifff if our starting N.T. gets hurt, and it doesn't hurt to have another huge run stuffer for Goal line and short yardage plays either.

 

[ThatsmyQB]

He's good and he's plays in a 3-4.

does he currently play O.L.b. in the 3-4 or I.L.B.?
cause everyone has him listed as an O.L.B., and IMO he's too small to play inside in the 3-4, and if he is palying O.L.b. now in college, who's to say if he could handle the inside in the 3-4 since they really are two different types of positions that a person who excells at O.L.b. sometimes can't make the adjustment or be as good as he can be on the outside.

We already have a Foller CLONE on our team in Burnett, and you can see with his constant injuries that small bodied I.L.B.'s just don't hold up well in the 3-4, I'd pass on him.

I'd pass on I.L.B. altogether this year and if we can fix our other areas like N.T. and some other D-lineman, our current L.B.'s will improve just based off that more so then by drafting another I.L.B.

I'd rather use our top picks to overhaul the D-line, and maybe get a safety, so that in 2010 our only need should be I.LB. and we can then manuever in round 1 to get us a true STUD I.L.B. with the size to hold up AND the speed.

Walterfootball has these two I.L.B.'s ranked 1 and 2 as 1st round picks, although Spikes COUDL come out this year and if we could somehow move up in round 2 and get him I'd do it, otherwise I'd rather wait till 2010 and use our top pick on one of these 2 guys and get an I.L.B. stud with BOTH SIZE and SPEED.

1. http://BAN-INCOMING-IN-3-2-1/college/Florida_logo.gif Brandon Spikes, Florida
   Height: 6-3. Weight: 244.
   Projected 40 Time: 4.65.
   Projected Round (2010): Top 25 Pick.
   5/11/08: In addition to being a sound tackler (a whopping 131 stops in 2007), Brandon Spikes is also great in pass coverage.
   
   2007: The centerpiece of Florida's defense despite being only a sophomore. Either leading the Gators in tackles or sacking opposing quarterbacks on multiple occasions every single week.
2. http://BAN-INCOMING-IN-3-2-1/college/Alabama_logo.gif Rolando McClain*, Alabama
   Height: 6-4. Weight: 255.
   Projected 40 Time: 4.65.
   Projected Round (2010): Top 25 Pick.
   8/3/08: Despite being a mere true freshman, Rolando McClain started eight games, and recorded 75 tackles (five for loss), four pass break-ups and two interceptions. GMs will love the 4.6 at 255 pounds.

Now tell me you wouldn't rather wait till 2010 and grab McClain at 6'-4 255 pounds and running a 4.6?????
Or Spikes if he doesn't come out this year being 6'-3 245 pounds and running 4.65 and can cover R.B.'s and T.E.'s and rush the passer and stuff the run.
I'd love to see one of them come in as a rookei to play behind a revamped D-line then draft an I.L.B. this year with our top pick to play behind the same line we got now.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

does he currently play O.L.b. in the 3-4 or I.L.B.?
cause everyone has him listed as an O.L.B., and IMO he's too small to play inside in the 3-4, and if he is palying O.L.b. now in college, who's to say if he could handle the inside in the 3-4 since they really are two different types of positions that a person who excells at O.L.b. sometimes can't make the adjustment or be as good as he can be on the outside.

We already have a Foller CLONE on our team in Burnett, and you can see with his constant injuries that small bodied I.L.B.'s just don't hold up well in the 3-4, I'd pass on him.

I'd pass on I.L.B. altogether this year and if we can fix our other areas like N.T. and some other D-lineman, our current L.B.'s will improve just based off that more so then by drafting another I.L.B.

I'd rather use our top picks to overhaul the D-line, and maybe get a safety, so that in 2010 our only need should be I.LB. and we can then manuever in round 1 to get us a true STUD I.L.B. with the size to hold up AND the speed.

Walterfootball has these two I.L.B.'s ranked 1 and 2 as 1st round picks, although Spikes COUDL come out this year and if we could somehow move up in round 2 and get him I'd do it, otherwise I'd rather wait till 2010 and use our top pick on one of these 2 guys and get an I.L.B. stud with BOTH SIZE and SPEED.

1. http://BAN-INCOMING-IN-3-2-1/college/Florida_logo.gif Brandon Spikes, Florida
   Height: 6-3. Weight: 244.
   Projected 40 Time: 4.65.
   Projected Round (2010): Top 25 Pick.
   5/11/08: In addition to being a sound tackler (a whopping 131 stops in 2007), Brandon Spikes is also great in pass coverage.
   
   2007: The centerpiece of Florida's defense despite being only a sophomore. Either leading the Gators in tackles or sacking opposing quarterbacks on multiple occasions every single week.
2. http://BAN-INCOMING-IN-3-2-1/college/Alabama_logo.gif Rolando McClain*, Alabama
   Height: 6-4. Weight: 255.
   Projected 40 Time: 4.65.
   Projected Round (2010): Top 25 Pick.
   8/3/08: Despite being a mere true freshman, Rolando McClain started eight games, and recorded 75 tackles (five for loss), four pass break-ups and two interceptions. GMs will love the 4.6 at 255 pounds.

Now tell me you wouldn't rather wait till 2010 and grab McClain at 6'-4 255 pounds and running a 4.6?????
Or Spikes if he doesn't come out this year being 6'-3 245 pounds and running 4.65 and can cover R.B.'s and T.E.'s and rush the passer and stuff the run.
I'd love to see one of them come in as a rookei to play behind a revamped D-line then draft an I.L.B. this year with our top pick to play behind the same line we got now.

He is listed as an OLB didn't even realize that however he would more than likely have to be moved inside....he still has experience in the 3-4 which is good....If Spikes comes out in the 2nd round and we can land him we should draft him. Until he declares I won't put him in my mocks.

 

[ThatsmyQB]

He is listed as an OLB didn't even realize that however he would more than likely have to be moved inside....he still has experience in the 3-4 which is goods.

Yeah, I don't like that, he has experience in the 3-4 but as an O.L.B., and I.L.B. and O.L.b. takes two differnet types of L.B.'s, your O.L.b.'s are your pass rushers where as the inside guys need to be able to handle big lineman and get off blocks and thus I feel you need to be bigger to play I.L.b. and also I.L.b.'s need to be better run stuffers and be able to handle covering back and T.E.'s where your O.L.B. while he has to also cover backs and T.E.'s, it's not his primary job, they're more your pass rusher types, basically just look at our own team, we got Spencer and Ware, two great pass rushers playing outside and inside we have James and Thomas, two guys who can't rush the passer at all but can really stuff the run and the Weakside I.l.B. in Thomas having to be the better coverage L.B., so it's not so simple to justmove outside to inside, they are playing O.L.B. in the 3-4 now for a reason, cause that better suits their specific skills I'm assuming.

I'd much rather just draft guys who's skill sets are that of primarily an I.L.B. is all.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

Yeah, I don't like that, he has experience in the 3-4 but as an O.L.B., and I.L.B. and O.L.b. takes two differnet types of L.B.'s, your O.L.b.'s are your pass rushers where as the inside guys need to be able to handle big lineman and get off blocks and thus I feel you need to be bigger to play I.L.b. and also I.L.b.'s need to be better run stuffers and be able to handle covering back and T.E.'s where your O.L.B. while he has to also cover backs and T.E.'s, it's not his primary job, they're more your pass rusher types, basically just look at our own team, we got Spencer and Ware, two great pass rushers playing outside and inside we have James and Thomas, two guys who can't rush the passer at all but can really stuff the run and the Weakside I.l.B. in Thomas having to be the better coverage L.B., so it's not so simple to justmove outside to inside, they are playing O.L.B. in the 3-4 now for a reason, cause that better suits their specific skills I'm assuming.

I'd much rather just draft guys who's skill sets are that of primarily an I.L.B. is all.

You don't know how Cal is running their 3-4. Typically what you said is right. However this guy gives no indication of being a DE or a pass rushing type of LB factor in that they switched to the 3-4 this year and he played LB the year before in the 4-3. I'm almost certain he can cover and stuff the run well.

 

[ThatsmyQB]

factor in that they switched to the 3-4 this year and he played LB the year before in the 4-3. I'm almost certain he can cover and stuff the run well.

What does him playing L.B. in the 4-3 and 3-4 have to do with assuming he can hanlde the duties of I.L.B. in the 3-4 when he plays O.L.b. in the 3-4?

 

[DaBoys4Life]

What does him playing L.B. in the 4-3 and 3-4 have to do with assuming he can hanlde the duties of I.L.B. in the 3-4 when he plays O.L.b. in the 3-4?

I explained it already.

 

[ThatsmyQB]

I explained it already.

No, you explained how you said if anyone played O.L.B. in the 4-3, they would automatically swithc to I.L.b. in the 3-4, which I thought we agreed isn't always the case, and what you're saying here is if he played L.B. in the 4-3 and L.b. in the 3-4 he must know how to cover R.B.'s and stuff the run well. LOL


What's next, he played S.S. in college in the 3-4 and also played S.S. in the 4-3 so that must mean he can cover receivers and rush the passer?

 

[Manwiththeplan]

BINGO, I still don't know why we don't put Spears at N.T. and move Ratliff to R.D.E. and move Canty to L.D.E., that would make more sense IMO since Spears can't do anyhting but clog up the running lanes, hence move him to N.T. and Ratliff at R.D.E. where he would be free to rush the passer!

Anyhow, we need not one but TWO big N.T.'s in this draft, cause no point in getting just one, we don't have ANY True 3-4 N./T. on this current team, so we need one to come in day 1 and start, and the other to be the backup to spell him, and in case of injury so we won't have to move Ratlifff if our starting N.T. gets hurt, and it doesn't hurt to have another huge run stuffer for Goal line and short yardage plays either.

IMO, no matter who we draft, unless we trade for a NT, Marcus Spears will be the starting NT next season, but hopefully we draft someone as well. It's unrealistic to expect a 2nd round pick or latter to be a starter, so I hope our d-line will look like this next season

RDE-Chris Canty, Jason Hatcher
NT-Marcus Spears, BJ Raji (hopefully we draft him)
LDE-Jay Ratliff, Mitch King (hopefully we draft him too)

 

[ThatsmyQB]

IMO, no matter who we draft, unless we trade for a NT, Marcus Spears will be the starting NT next season,

I don't think that AT ALL, if he could play N.T., we would of moved him to N.T. by now and put Ratliff at D.E., so I don't see him playing N.T. for us at all, I could see him as a BACKUP D.E. at best next year.

but hopefully we draft someone as well. It's unrealistic to expect a 2nd round pick or latter to be a starter, so I hope our d-line will look like this next season

Why is it hard or unrealistic for a 2nd round player to come in and start?
Especially a N.T. since it's not like he's gotta learn all the plays or get used to the speed of the game or learn all the plays in the playboo, it's pretty much cut and dry for the most part.

RDE-Chris Canty, Jason Hatcher
NT-Marcus Spears, BJ Raji (hopefully we draft him)
LDE-Jay Ratliff, Mitch King (hopefully we draft him too)

I would hope we get more then just Raji and King to add to our line.
I think Ratliff would move to R.D.E. since he's our best pass rushing lineman.
I would like a D-line of

L.D.E. Chris Canty/Vince Oghobaase
N.T. Dorell Scott/Ron Brace
R.D.E. Jay ratliff/Jason Hatcher/Nader Abdallah

Then we can use our top pick on a STUD I.L.B. in 2010!

 

[Manwiththeplan]

I don't think that AT ALL, if he could play N.T., we would of moved him to N.T. by now and put Ratliff at D.E., so I don't see him playing N.T. for us at all, I could see him as a BACKUP D.E. at best next year.

It's always risky switching a players position mid season. Not to mention with the way ratliff is playing it would be best to give him an entire offseason to prepare for the move.

Why is it hard or unrealistic for a 2nd round player to come in and start?
Especially a N.T. since it's not like he's gotta learn all the plays or get used to the speed of the game or learn all the plays in the playboo, it's pretty much cut and dry for the most part.

Who was the last late 2nd round pick to come in and start for us on day 1? Even a simple position like NT, a player needs to get used to how much stronger guys are at this level, so some time will be needed to adjust.

I would hope we get more then just Raji and King to add to our line.
I think Ratliff would move to R.D.E. since he's our best pass rushing lineman.
I would like a D-line of

Why replace everyone in one year? You seem to suggest we rely on 4 rookies at a position where we'll only cary 7? Big mistake. Rookies get injured more often, are inconsistent and sometimes just aren't as good as advertised. And when you do find a good one, they all almost always hit that "rookie wall" at some point.

L.D.E. Chris Canty/Vince Oghobaase
N.T. Dorell Scott/Ron Brace
R.D.E. Jay ratliff/Jason Hatcher/Nader Abdallah

Then we can use our top pick on a STUD I.L.B. in 2010!

Why are we cutting Marcus Spears? Even if you don't like him, he's a solid contributer and will bring us a comp pick in 2011, when he leaves after the 09' season.

 

[tomson75]

speed on D
speed on D
speed on D

which means fast ILB
fast FS

a NT so that Rat can move to DE, a player similar to Rat the NT would be who I'm looking for

a penetrating DE to replace Bowen and/or Hatcher, even Canty

Bob has this thread on lock down...at least on the defensive side.

 

[ThatsmyQB]

Who was the last late 2nd round pick to come in and start for us on day 1? Even a simple position like NT, a player needs to get used to how much stronger guys are at this level, so some time will be needed to adjust.

Just cause WE haven't had anyone really come in and start as a late 2nd rounder, doesn't in no way say that one can't.
A LOT of teams have 2nd rounders come in and start from day 1.
BENNETT is a late 2nd rounder and he's starting in our BASE 2 T.E. set.

Here, read this, 2nd rounders come in and are expected to start in todays NFL and most do and a lot of them even excell.

What makes the second round of the NFL Draft such fertile ground for talent? During Week 1, players drafted in the second round of 2008 draft made it look easy -- and for more than half the price of a first-round selection, which made it look like twice the bargain.
Denver’s Eddie Royal, who caught nine passes for 146 yards and one touchdown Monday night in Oakland, was the fifth wide receiver selected in the draft. He turned around cornerback DeAngelo Hall so many times he looked like a 10-year vet.

Paul Sakuma / Associated PressBroncos WR Eddie Royal didn't look like a rookie in Week 1 as he helped lead the Broncos to a win over the Raiders.
Royal is as cool and calm about being in the NFL as a guy who had been to five Pro Bowls. He didn’t sense the pressure of starting on national TV in a season-opening game. He was as matter-of-fact about his stellar performance as an athlete that is only a year removed from college could be. He didn't even have time to watch the game tape or the postgame TV highlights, because he was getting ready for Sunday's game against San Diego. His biggest issue was that his mom just learned how to text message and was so excited during the game that she sent him lots of messages.
In Philadelphia, another second-round wide receiver was tearing up the field. Eagles rookie DeSean Jackson, the seventh wide receiver taken last April, caught six passes for 106 yards and topped it off with 97 more yards on eight punt returns.
Both Jackson and Royal had to step up and deliver because of injuries to starters. They both came to camp knowing they would make the team, but never really expecting to start on opening weekend. Consequently, they did not feel the pressure a first-round player has from day one.
Chicago's second-round pick, running back Matt Forte of Tulane, ran through the Colts defense the way general managers would love to see a high first-round guy do it. Forte, the sixth running back selected in the draft, wound up with the third-best day in the league with 123 yards on the ground. Throw in a 50-yard touchdown run and three receptions, and a star was born.
Forte is a guy who overcame having a bulls-eye on his back at Tulane as the most obvious threat on the field to be one of the most productive backs entering the draft. As a second-round pick, he was not under the same microscope as the five guys taken in the first round (Darren McFadden, Jonathan Stewart, Felix Jones, Rashard Mendenhall, Chris Johnson). Neither was Ray Rice, another second-round runner -- the seventh back taken -- who had 25 touches in the Ravens' win over the Bengals.
Two rookie corners got the call to start in Week 1 and both were drafted in the second round. The Chiefs put Brandon Flowers in the starting lineup. Kansas City coach Herman Edwards told me Flowers was relaxed and that the game wasn’t too big for him. He finished up with six tackles -- and you know he was a target, as most rookie corners are in the NFL.


Sunday, Sept. 14
» Indianapolis 18, Minnesota 15
» Carolina 20, Chicago 17
» Tennessee 24, Cincinnati 7
» Green Bay 48, Detroit 25
» Oakland 23, Kansas City 8
» N.Y. Giants 41, St. Louis 13
» Buffalo 20, Jacksonville 16
» Washington 29, New Orleans 24
» San Francisco 33, Seattle 30 (OT)
» Tampa Bay 24, Atlanta 9
» Denver 39, San Diego 38
» New England 19, N.Y. Jets 10
» Arizona 31, Miami 10
» Pittsburgh 10, Cleveland 6
Monday, Sept. 15
» Dallas 41, Philadelphia 37


In New Orleans, where the secondary has been a weak spot on the roster for a few years, second-round pick Tracy Porter from Indiana delivered against the 2007 division-champion Tampa Bay Bucs. Porter was in on three tackles and had two passes defended.
Flowers was the sixth corner taken, while Porter was the seventh corner selected. None of the five first-round corners selected in the draft started for their respective teams.
It would be easy to say NFL personnel people miss the boat in their evaluations. It would seem obvious to some that the first-round money is a big mistake. It may be, but time will tell.

Why replace everyone in one year?

WHY NOT?????
Get rid of the DEAD WEIGHT!
I wouldn't say EVERYONE, keep Ratliff, i'd maybe re-sign Canty depending if we do take a guy like Oghobaase to play L.D.E. thus moving Ratliff to R.D.E. and making Canty too expensive to keep as a backup, and we'd still have Hatcher who I'm hoping one more year he mihgt breakout, but other then those 3, EVERYONE ELSE can let the door hit them on the way out.

You seem to suggest we rely on 4 rookies at a position where we'll only cary 7? Big mistake. Rookies get injured more often, are inconsistent and sometimes just aren't as good as advertised. And when you do find a good one, they all almost always hit that "rookie wall" at some point.

Well considering most all of them will only br ROLE PLAYERS, I don't see it as a problem, say we draft Raji in round 2 to be our N.T. which would allow Ratliff to move to D.E., then we'd have our starting D-line be

L.D.E. Canty (He moves to L.D.E.)
N.T. Raji
R.D.E. Ratliff (moves to R.D.E. cause he's the better pass rusher)

So you'd only have ONE ROOKIE starting on the D-line, and you'd have Hatcher and 3 other rookies backing them up, I don't see a problem with that.

Raji might hit the rookie wall, but since we'll draft another N.T., we can rotate a lot so they dont' get worn down, and the rest will all be role players and backups only getting a few snaps a game, thus none of the rookies other then Raji who'd come in and start from day 1 woudl hit the rookie wall, and we'd add some fresh young blood all across the D-line, I mean, I'd rather have Raji and a 3rd round pick and TWO other decent rookie prospects then Tank/Bowen/Spears.

Now I am just saying draft a N.T. in round 2 and then use our 3rd on another d.T. we can convert to D.E., and the rest of the 4 guys on the D-line willall be 7th rounders with one 6th rounder mixed in, so if they can't cut it in camp, they get cut, no big deal, but if we overload the position and make the competiton so strong everyone needs to pick up their game, that's not bad either, and if some of the 7th rounders don't show much, we'll keep Spears or Bowen then, It's not like I'm saying draft 6 D-leinman and all 6 are gonna stick, it's possible they do, but if not, then we keep a vet or two, but I'd rather just overload the position and hopefully find a GEM in one of those late round picks is all, the 2nd round N.T. and 3rd round D.T. would make the team, and then have Bowen/Tank/Spears/Hatcher and the 4 other rookies in round 7 all fight it out and we'll keep the 4 with the best upside is all.

Why are we cutting Marcus Spears? Even if you don't like him, he's a solid contributer and will bring us a comp pick in 2011, when he leaves after the 09' season.

I just think if we're gonna use a pick on a N.T., that would allow us to move Ratliff to D.E., and Spears is the odd man out, also I have us drafitng D.T. Oghobaase with our top pick who's 6-6 310 pounds and NOT FAT to play L.D.E. with Ratliff moving to R.D.E. and have Canty and Hatcher and whoever else (rookie late round picks) to round out the D-line.
Spears has NO UPSIDE IMO, he is what he is, a tub of lard who can hold up good agianst the run but has NO PASS RUSH AT ALL, invisible comes to mind, and so I would cut our losses, BUT you make a good point, we only need to keep him one more year and get a comp pick for him, and he could be a valuable backup.