2017 NBA Finals: Warriors vs Cavalier

casmith07 said:
I hate the Cavaliers and Dan Gilbert, but I think - as objectively as I can - that LeBron James is the best basketball player of all time. Again - objectively. You've got to look at it from a pure basketball standpoint and not number of titles, etc.
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I do look at it objectively, Cas, and MJ's killer instinct is what tips the scale for me. But you're right, if we were discussing all-around game, LBJ gets the nod. But I don't think his better all-around game is better than MJ's poise and killer instincts.
 
Trouty said:
I do look at it objectively, Cas, and MJ's killer instinct is what tips the scale for me. But you're right, if we were discussing all-around game, LBJ gets the nod. But I don't think his better all-around game is better than MJ's poise and killer instincts.
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I don't use stuff like "killer instinct" (which LeBron has plenty of, aside from the first Finals with Miami).

LeBron has also done a lot more with pathetic teams than Jordan ever did, though, if you do want to consider intangible stuff rather than just pure basketball evaluation.

The Cavs I teams were terrible and the Cavs II teams he's on right now are teams full of bums. You could legitimately argue they'd be a lottery team without LeBron -- not a top lottery team, but missing the playoffs for sure. 6th seed at absolute best.
 
But don't get me wrong - having grown up watching the tail end of Julius Erving and watching all of Michael's career, MJ was of course a sensational, incredible player. I think he and Kobe are more alike, however as pure shooting guards. I think LeBron compares most favorably to Magic Johnson, or to nobody, to be honest.
 
casmith07 said:
I don't use stuff like "killer instinct" (which LeBron has plenty of, aside from the first Finals with Miami).

LeBron has also done a lot more with pathetic teams than Jordan ever did, though, if you do want to consider intangible stuff rather than just pure basketball evaluation.

The Cavs I teams were terrible and the Cavs II teams he's on right now are teams full of bums. You could legitimately argue they'd be a lottery team without LeBron -- not a top lottery team, but missing the playoffs for sure. 6th seed at absolute best.
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This Cavs team is not a lottery team w/o LBJ. No way, not with Kyrie and Love. The ones he started out with, sure. And yes, he carried them to the Finals.

Also, Bron had a nice cast in MIA.

Won't disagree about Bron's intangibles, they're amazing.

He doesn't have killer instinct and lacks poise at times when the spotlight is the largest. It is what it is.

Still, I gave him (imo) the second best ever slot. Hardly a slight. He'll have to win a couple more Chips to be ahead of Mike, for me.

This series, if he wins it, will be another piece to favor Bron in this debate.

Still, Bron is my favorite player in the NBA right now. MJ is the GOAT.
 
casmith07 said:
But don't get me wrong - having grown up watching the tail end of Julius Erving and watching all of Michael's career, MJ was of course a sensational, incredible player. I think he and Kobe are more alike, however as pure shooting guards. I think LeBron compares most favorably to Magic Johnson, or to nobody, to be honest.
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To nobody :)

LeBron is a different animal!

Kobe was a killer of the high order. Mike was on a whole other level, tho.
 
Trouty said:
This Cavs team is not a lottery team w/o LBJ. No way, not with Kyrie and Love. The ones he started out with, sure. And yes, he carried them to the Finals.

Also, Bron had a nice cast in MIA.

Won't disagree about Bron's intangibles, they're amazing.

He doesn't have killer instinct and lacks poise at times when the spotlight is the largest. It is what it is.

Still, I gave him (imo) the second best ever slot. Hardly a slight. He'll have to win a couple more Chips to be ahead of Mike, for me.

This series, if he wins it, will be another piece to favor Bron in this debate.

Still, Bron is my favorite player in the NBA right now. MJ is the GOAT.
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Good stuff. I went on record (lol) of saying LeBron was the GOAT after he dragged this squad of bums to that epic win last year.
 
casmith07 said:
Good stuff. I went on record (lol) of saying LeBron was the GOAT after he dragged this squad of bums to that epic win last year.
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What a sensational win! I am praying that the Cavs win this series! My son, next to me, is a GS fanboy. Ugh

Only when the Lakers are sucky, tho lol :)
 
Trouty said:
What a sensational win! I am praying that the Cavs win this series! My son, next to me, is a GS fanboy. Ugh

Only when the Lakers are sucky, tho lol :)
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They ain't gonna win man. I would not be surprised if the Cavs didn't win a game. I think they'll get at least 1 in Cleveland, though.

Trouty said:
Kobe is my favorite of all-time!! Love him. But Mike, man, Mike took the soul of everyone around him, even his teammates LOL
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lol...that is true about Mike. Mike apparently once punched or slapped Steve Kerr in the face at practice. I heard it on the radio last week.
 
casmith07 said:
They ain't gonna win man. I would not be surprised if the Cavs didn't win a game. I think they'll get at least 1 in Cleveland, though.



lol...that is true about Mike. Mike apparently once punched or slapped Steve Kerr in the face at practice. I heard it on the radio last week.
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Who's your team, Cas? Just curious, brudda
 
Trouty said:
Who's your team, Cas? Just curious, brudda
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I don't particuarly have one. I played (still play) a lot of basketball myself, and when you're close to the game it's hard to be a fan of any one team. I just really enjoy good basketball and in a perfect world I'd be able to coach at a high level collegiate or professionally one day.

I rooted for the Wizards all year because that's my hometown. I love LeBron James. I like the Warriors for basically "changing" the game. They're like the first team to play "passing league" basketball kind of like how the NFL's changed over the years. Always have loved Popovich, too.
 
casmith07 said:
I don't particuarly have one. I played (still play) a lot of basketball myself, and when you're close to the game it's hard to be a fan of any one team. I just really enjoy good basketball and in a perfect world I'd be able to coach at a high level collegiate or professionally one day.

I rooted for the Wizards all year because that's my hometown. I love LeBron James. I like the Warriors for basically "changing" the game. They're like the first team to play "passing league" basketball kind of like how the NFL's changed over the years. Always have loved Popovich, too.
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Good stuff, Cas!
 
Tony Brothers practically gift wrapped game 2 for GS....pathetic. I had to do a search to see who was refeeing this game...and as soon as Tony Brothers name came up....oh the hate. LOL...everybody hates him...And after tonight...I can see why. I would like to see the final tally of how many calls he had vs Cleveland...and how many times he swallowed his whistle to give GS an advantage. No way Cleveland stands a chance if GS is going to get that many calls. Hate it when refs dictate the outcome of a game or series.:rolleyes:
 
Floaty said:
Tony Brothers practically gift wrapped game 2 for GS....pathetic. I had to do a search to see who was refeeing this game...and as soon as Tony Brothers name came up....oh the hate. LOL...everybody hates him...And after tonight...I can see why. I would like to see the final tally of how many calls he had vs Cleveland...and how many times he swallowed his whistle to give GS an advantage. No way Cleveland stands a chance if GS is going to get that many calls. Hate it when refs dictate the outcome of a game or series.:rolleyes:
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There were a million bad calls/no calls and equally just as many for/against both teams.

It was horrible but hardly an advantage.
 
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