4-3 defense

[zrinkill]

If there's one player that I feel can benefit from a 4-3 it would be Spears. I remember his LSU days and he was dominant. Maybe he is playing out of his comfort zone here with the 3-4. How do you think Carpenter would play in a 4-3?

I agree ....

And I think Carpenters biggest problem is shedding blockers .... this would be much easier for him to avoid in a 4-3.

But I have pretty much given up on him.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

4-3 would be really good we should make the switch

 

[hairic]

This would be a move to be made next season if two of the combination of Canty, Bowen, and Johnson are lost. That would put the "DT" depth chart at 4 (Ratliff, Spears, Hatcher, and 1 of Canty/Bowen/Johnson).

I think you'd have to put Ware at LB in a 43 too. Not on every down, of course. He could be moved between LB positions and both DE spots. That'd allow you to get the best group of pass rushers out there. Ware, Ellis, and Spencer would be playing together more than they do now.

The fun thing about Ware at DE in a 43 is that he would be playing contain less (it'd belong to the ROLB more often). He would be free to work on more inside rush moves...

 

[Aliencowboy]

Ratcliffe? u mean Ratliff

3 OLB? no ILB?

Yes, Ratcliff and James inside.
You're a stickler.

Can't believe you bothered posting that.

 

[BAT]

This is insane. There are no quality 4-3 OLB on this roster. Unless you want to start Mr. Glass Burnett and/or Barbie Carpenter?

And you might as well cut James now, he is not a 4-3 MLB. Zach most definitely is, but how long is he going to play, 1 year, 2 years more??

And Ellis has been much more productive as a 3-4 OLB than he ever was as a 4-3 DE. How soon people forget his FIRST double digit sack season AND a pro bowl nod was as a 3-4 OLB, not a DE.

Finally, Ware is the best player on this defense, BAR NONE. Ware's BEST position is as a 3-4 OLB.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

This is insane. There are no quality 4-3 OLB on this roster. Unless you want to start Mr. Glass Burnett and/or Barbie Carpenter?

And you might as well cut James now, he is not a 4-3 MLB. Zach most definitely is, but how long is he going to play, 1 year, 2 years more??

And Ellis has been much more productive as a 3-4 OLB than he ever was as a 4-3 DE. How soon people forget his FIRST double digit sack season AND a pro bowl nod was as a 3-4 OLB, not a DE.

Finally, Ware is the best player on this defense, BAR NONE. Ware's BEST position is as a 3-4 OLB.

IDK if you can call it insane. Ware rushing the QB every done is good. James could play strong side OLB.....Carp played in the 4-3 and College like some one else already said he wont have to come up against so many blockers. He and Burnett could play WOLB and be fine....you're overacting just a tad IMHO.

 

[a.mart24]

I don't think Ware would excel in the 4-3. It would take away his speed game and force him to bull rush a lot more which isn't his strength. While I think Ellis would be great for it, Ware would have a rough time adjusting as would Spencer since he was converted more to a speed type OLB since being drafted. I think our D could be a lot more lethal if we did some simple changes around the D-line. Example: Moving Ratliff to starting DE over Spears and having him alternate with Tank at DT. I bet Rat would wreak havoc against the league's many weak starting RTs. In the nickel, Ratliff would share the center of the line with Tank, and if too tired, then Spears would take his spot.

All-in-all, I think moving to the 4-3 would set us back a couple years and we'd lose a lot of our players while in their prime. What we really need is an emotional leader on D. Someone like a Merriman, or R. Lewis could really make all the talent on this team play like we want it to.

 

[rojan]

I been thinking about this but who would coach it?

I remember hearing that if Garret got that job in Balti he would bring in a 3-4 zone/blitz coach. I cant remember his name but he was thinking about coming here as a consultant but our Stewart didn't like the idea. I think he was a Defensive coach for the Stealer's and Head Coach of the Texans.

 

[BAT]

IDK if you can call it insane. Ware rushing the QB every done is good. James could play strong side OLB.....Carp played in the 4-3 and College like some one else already said he wont have to come up against so many blockers. He and Burnett could play WOLB and be fine....you're overacting just a tad IMHO.

LMAO!!! I'm overreacting???!!!??


You and your ilk are the ones scrapping a scheme that is FINALLY doing what Cowboys' fans have clamored for since the 90's SB teams_get to the QB and make plays. Yes, the D has yet to peak, it is afterall ONLY the SECOND season under Wade's scheme, however last season, the D was finally a top 5 sack team and league leader in turnovers. Do you even remember who the LAST Cowboy (and how long ago) to post double digit sacks before Wade turned Ware and co. loose?????


The Dallas defense has failed to pressure the QB in over a DECADE. That is 10 PLUS YEARS of not being able to sack the QB. Ninety percent of that time was in the 4 frikkin 3 that you are advocating.


The 3-4 gives the most prolific offenses in this league FITS, even a Parcells' 3-4. And Wade's 3-4 is so much more aggressive AND productive than the Parcell's version. Does Wade need to tweak his scheme NOW, of course, but to scrap it when it has taken YEARS to build and compile pieces conducive to running a 3-4, especially when the team is THIS CLOSE to contending for a championship, that is the definition of INSANITY.


The pass rush is not the problem on this D, the secondary needs to mix up its coverages and press a heckuva lot more. Switching to a 4-3 would not guarantee this issue would be corrected.

 

[cowboyjoe]

This is the formation of the 4-3 defense and I do think the Cowboys would be better at the 4-3.
Defensive Ends, LDE Greg Ellis, Marcus Spears. Jay Ratliff
Defensive Tackles Marcus Spears, Tank Johnson, Chris Canty
Right Defensive Ends; Demarcus Ware
Left Outside Linebacker; Spencer, Rogers
Middle linebacker; Bradie James, Zach Thomas
WeakOutside Linebacker; Bobby Carpenter if not traded, Burnett,this might be the best postion for Burnett and keep him healty with Defensive covering him up, and letting burnett push carpenter and flowing to the ball
LeftCornerback; Terrance Newman, Mike Jenkins, this is normally the fleet cornerback that covers the speed wr
Right Cornerback; Orlando Scandrick, Anthony henry, this is the guy that goes against the physical big WR, not the speedy wr most of the time
Safety; Free; Hamlin; we do need backups Watkins keeps getting hurt
Strong Safety; this might benefit roy williams at strong safety and allow him mostly to play in the box like charley waters, cornell green and darren woodson did, but we need a backup keith davis is mainly a special teams player

 

[rojan]

LMAO!!! I'm overreacting???!!!??


You and your ilk are the ones scrapping a scheme that is FINALLY doing what Cowboys' fans have clamored for since the 90's SB teams_get to the QB and make plays. Yes, the D has yet to peak, it is afterall ONLY the SECOND season under Wade's scheme, however last season, the D was finally a top 5 sack team and league leader in turnovers. Do you even remember who the LAST Cowboy (and how long ago) to post double digit sacks before Wade turned Ware and co. loose?????


The Dallas defense has failed to pressure the QB in over a DECADE. That is 10 PLUS YEARS of not being able to sack the QB. Ninety percent of that time was in the 4 frikkin 3 that you are advocating.


The 3-4 gives the most prolific offenses in this league FITS, even a Parcells' 3-4. And Wade's 3-4 is so much more aggressive AND productive than the Parcell's version. Does Wade need to tweak his scheme NOW, of course, but to scrap it when it has taken YEARS to build and compile pieces conducive to running a 3-4, especially when the team is THIS CLOSE to contending for a championship, that is the definition of INSANITY.


The pass rush is not the problem on this D, the secondary needs to mix up its coverages and press a heckuva lot more. Switching to a 4-3 would not guarantee this issue would be corrected.

Some times you gotta look past the Stats. I cant remember the last time we dominated on Defense.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

LMAO!!! I'm overreacting???!!!??


You and your ilk are the ones scrapping a scheme that is FINALLY doing what Cowboys' fans have clamored for since the 90's SB teams_get to the QB and make plays. Yes, the D has yet to peak, it is afterall ONLY the SECOND season under Wade's scheme, however last season, the D was finally a top 5 sack team and league leader in turnovers. Do you even remember who the LAST Cowboy (and how long ago) to post double digit sacks before Wade turned Ware and co. loose?????


The Dallas defense has failed to pressure the QB in over a DECADE. That is 10 PLUS YEARS of not being able to sack the QB. Ninety percent of that time was in the 4 frikkin 3 that you are advocating.


The 3-4 gives the most prolific offenses in this league FITS, even a Parcells' 3-4. And Wade's 3-4 is so much more aggressive AND productive than the Parcell's version. Does Wade need to tweak his scheme NOW, of course, but to scrap it when it has taken YEARS to build and compile pieces conducive to running a 3-4, especially when the team is THIS CLOSE to contending for a championship, that is the definition of INSANITY.


The pass rush is not the problem on this D, the secondary needs to mix up its coverages and press a heckuva lot more. Switching to a 4-3 would not guarantee this issue would be corrected.

IDK man I still think your overacting just a tad. In a 4-3 DWare would prob rush the QB about 98 percent of the time in the 3-4 IDK how much he rushes but it's not on ever play. So If you figure Dware is the best pass rusher we've had in years the more he rushes the pass rusher the hgiher chance he has of getting a sack right? IDK if I am right or wrong on this one but I think most of Ware's sacks this year are coming while we are in the nickel and he is the DE and not playing OLB.

The pass rush is the problem on the defense. Not only is the pass rush the problem but the coverage scheme is also the problem. Also someone pointed out that the players we have would fit the 4-3 better. Consider they played the 4-3 in college Carp, Spears and Tank(to name a few) was awesome for ChiTown in the 4-3. We are trying to get 4-3 players to play the 3-4 and they have been very underwhelming at times. I like the 3-4 it really nice however I think there could defintley be some benefits to us running a 4-3 and a lot of our players could/ does fit better in the 4-3.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

This is the formation of the 4-3 defense and I do think the Cowboys would be better at the 4-3.
Defensive Ends, LDE Greg Ellis, Marcus Spears. Jay Ratliff
Defensive Tackles Marcus Spears, Tank Johnson, Chris Canty
Right Defensive Ends; Demarcus Ware
Left Outside Linebacker; Spencer, Rogers
Middle linebacker; Bradie James, Zach Thomas
WeakOutside Linebacker; Bobby Carpenter if not traded, Burnett,this might be the best postion for Burnett and keep him healty with Defensive covering him up, and letting burnett push carpenter and flowing to the ball
LeftCornerback; Terrance Newman, Mike Jenkins, this is normally the fleet cornerback that covers the speed wr
Right Cornerback; Orlando Scandrick, Anthony henry, this is the guy that goes against the physical big WR, not the speedy wr most of the time
Safety; Free; Hamlin; we do need backups Watkins keeps getting hurt
Strong Safety; this might benefit roy williams at strong safety and allow him mostly to play in the box like charley waters, cornell green and darren woodson did, but we need a backup keith davis is mainly a special teams player

Why do you have Spencer at LB when he play DE in college?

 

[cowboyjoe]

he is playing outside linebacker now for cowboys in 3-4 and i think he would be a great strongside linebacker, with his size and all and his speed;

generally as you know, the strong side linebacker you want one of the strong biggest linebackers that you have on the left linebacker,

spencer fits that bill to me,

 

[cowboyjoe]

and yesssssssss, ware would be dynamite at right defensive end, just like charles haley was and harvey martin

 

[cowboyjoe]

carpenter is more a finese linebacker, so if he stayed with the team, i would put him at weakside linebacker, coming on some rushes behind ware on pass rushes sometimes, but to me, with burnetts speed he would be great at weakside linebacker, and probably hold up more with a defensive end covering him up on runs etc,

 

[DaBoys4Life]

he is playing outside linebacker now for cowboys in 3-4 and i think he would be a great strongside linebacker, with his size and all and his speed;

generally as you know, the strong side linebacker you want one of the strong biggest linebackers that you have on the left linebacker,

spencer fits that bill to me,

Spencer is one of the smaller OLB we have. 3-4 OLB doesn't = 4-3 OLB. 3-4 OLB = 4-3 DE. Spencer was a DE in college and will prob move back to DE if we made the switch back to a 4-3. I think james would be able to man the Strongside LB'r spot.

 

[KingintheNorth]

If went went 4-3. Chris Canty would move from weakside end to strongside end. Marcus Spears would move inside to defensive tackle. Ware, Ellis, and Spencer would be DE's not OLB's.

Ware would definitely start at RDE and Ellis would replace Canty at LDE on passing downs. Spencer and Hatcher would be underutilized reserve defensive ends.

3 players... Ratliff, Spears, and Tank ... would rotate at the 2 DT spots.


Zach Thomas would play MLB and I guess Bradie James would move to LOLB. ROLB would be natural fits for Burnett, Carpenter, or...wait for it.... Roy Williams. Think Dexter Coakley and Darrin Smith here. If Carpenter or Burnett move to another team next year and they run a 4-3, I can pretty much guarantee they will be playing ROLB.

 

[cowboyjoe]

i disagree with you there on spencer being smallest on team;
57 Burnett, Kevin LB 6-3 227
54 Carpenter, Bobby LB 6-2 248
56 James, Bradie LB 6-2 239
52 Polk, Carlos LB 6-2 262
50 Rogers, Justin LB 6-4 250
93 Spencer, Anthony LB 6-3 257
55 Thomas, Zach LB 5-11 228

as you can see and this is off of dallas cowboys home page website,

only rogers is taller, and spencer weighs the most;
also, when spencer was drafted in an article he was touted as benching over 400 pounds or so and leg lifting over 600 pounds, that to me says the strongest linebacker, to me, spencer is too light to play at left defensive end, that should be your strongest defensive linemen

and since ware our best pass rusher is at right defensive end, which sometimes you can play a light defensive end at right defensive end in the 4--3,

thats why i put spencer at strongside, i want him to play alot and have him as the cowboys biggest linebacker on the strongside

 

[DaBoys4Life]

i disagree with you there on spencer being smallest on team;
57 Burnett, Kevin LB 6-3 227
54 Carpenter, Bobby LB 6-2 248
56 James, Bradie LB 6-2 239
52 Polk, Carlos LB 6-2 262
50 Rogers, Justin LB 6-4 250
93 Spencer, Anthony LB 6-3 257
55 Thomas, Zach LB 5-11 228

as you can see and this is off of dallas cowboys home page website,

only rogers is taller, and spencer weighs the most;
also, when spencer was drafted in an article he was touted as benching over 400 pounds or so and leg lifting over 600 pounds, that to me says the strongest linebacker, to me, spencer is too light to play at left defensive end, that should be your strongest defensive linemen

and since ware our best pass rusher is at right defensive end, which sometimes you can play a light defensive end at right defensive end in the 4--3,

thats why i put spencer at strongside, i want him to play alot and have him as the cowboys biggest linebacker on the strongside

Spencer plays OLB why are you comparing him to our ILB? Polk is bigger than him but rogers isn't. IF you looked at what I said he's one of our smaller OLB!!!. Which he is he's only bigger than Rogers and Rogers only plays ST.....