A closer look at Norv's time in Washington

[silverbear]

Skins fan here to give a bid of insight to Norv's time in DC. The three things that come to mind first.

1. Inconsistent, bad play-calling. Skins fans were excited about Norv coming in because of his role guiding the awesome Cowboys offense to 3 Super Bowls. The Hall of Fame talent wasn't there for him, but the play calling was odd, at best. Very frustrating.

2. Undisciplined players and performance. What more can be said here. Training Camp was like recess at elementary school. 4 or 5 false starts every game. Internal fighting and complaining.

3. Awful drafts!

Norv had very little say in those drafts, and you know it...

 

[silverbear]

circumstance doesn't excuse sucking it up for seven years

Yeah, you should probably think about committing suicide, sparing yourself that misery that's SURE to follow...

 

[Gaede]

Yeah, you should probably think about committing suicide, sparing yourself that misery that's SURE to follow...

hmmm...sure thing pal

 

[ZeroClub]

Heath Shuler was Norv's unforgiveable mistake in Washington.

 

[MarkBrunell]

Heath Shuler was Norv's unforgiveable mistake in Washington.

Norvs time in Washington included bad play calling, poor clock management, no half time adjustments and lack of resepct from players.

and Heath Shuler :bang2:

 

[Maikeru-sama]

at least we have Jeff Ireland

God, that's the only positive I can see from this hiring

Wow, me and you agree.

It is rather interesting that the Norv Spin Machine is already at work trying to convince us otherwise of his many past failures as a Head Coach.

I would rather us hire Jason Garrett as the Head Coach, only if he is given the same kind of control and leeway Parcells had the luxury of having.

SB, you make some interesting point but at the end of the day, like this old fellow from New Jersey use to say "You are what you are".

- Mike G.

 

[CATCH17]

Skins fan here to give a bid of insight to Norv's time in DC. The three things that come to mind first.

1. Inconsistent, bad play-calling. Skins fans were excited about Norv coming in because of his role guiding the awesome Cowboys offense to 3 Super Bowls. The Hall of Fame talent wasn't there for him, but the play calling was odd, at best. Very frustrating.

2. Undisciplined players and performance. What more can be said here. Training Camp was like recess at elementary school. 4 or 5 false starts every game. Internal fighting and complaining.

3. Awful drafts!

Bottom line is that Norv is a mediocre HC. He's had his chances and has never performed. But, he could do better than Parcells...Who knows?

Even though I could be wrong I have a trouble believing one of the best Play Callers in the NFL was calling bad plays constantly in Washington.

If there is 1 thing Norv can do its call plays and I dont think we he stepped foot into Washington he just forgot how to.

 

[silverbear]

hmmm...sure thing pal

Just trying to show some concern, some compassion for my fellow man... it tears me up, seeing you so despondent...

But hey, I know what to do if you don't like that idea-- let's have a singalong!!!

I'm sure you know the words, jump right in:

Gloom, despair and agony on meeeee
Deep dark depression, excessive misereeeee
If it weren't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all
Gloom, despair and agony on meeee...

There, don't you feel better??

 

[CATCH17]

Seems none of you cynics are bright enough to figure out that the CIRCUMSTANCES of his first two coaching gigs were somewhat less than optimal...

Rather, you tell yourselves that because he's had mixed success to no success in his two previous stops, he'll never ever be worth a hammered crap...

To which I'll simply respond that Hall of Fame coach Sid Gillman took over a Rams team that had gone 23-11-2 the previous 3 seasons, a good team, and put up a disappointing 28-32-1 record with them, ultimately getting fired...

None of you guys would have ever even thought about giving him a job after that, not if you followed the "logic" you're employing here...

You would have missed out on a Hall of Fame coach...

None of you would have kept Tom Landry around after his fifth straight losing season with the Cowboys back in the 60s, either...

Silverbear is like my favorite poster now.

Just because you go somewhere and dont have much success doesnt mean you aren't a good coach.

Raiders job was a suicide job and he was dumb for taking it but I think thats just how bad he wanted to get back into being a head coach.

Personally I dont think you could take the best coach in the History of the NFL, give him the same circumstances Norv had, and have success in Oakland.

We have some good pieces in place and if we get a good defensive coordinator I would expect our offense to explode.

Its also amazing what a good Quarterback can do for any coach. You can ask where would a lot of the all time great coaches be without their alltime great Quarterbacks.

 

[MarkBrunell]

Even though I could be wrong I have a trouble believing one of the best Play Callers in the NFL was calling bad plays constantly in Washington.

If there is 1 thing Norv can do its call plays and I dont think we he stepped foot into Washington he just forgot how to.

I can tell you too that Norvs play calling sucked a lot. He went deep in short yardage, short on deep yardage, passed on running downs and did stuff that made you go ***?

You can't say that Norv was in a bad position as a coach for the Commanders. Norv was as bad as our organization. His play calling, clock management and player management was a huge reason we were dreadful and mediocre for 7 straight years.

 

[MossBurner]

Even though I could be wrong I have a trouble believing one of the best Play Callers in the NFL was calling bad plays constantly in Washington.

If there is 1 thing Norv can do its call plays and I dont think we he stepped foot into Washington he just forgot how to.

You are wrong here. The only reason he has a rep as a good play-caller is because he had a HOF QB, RB, WR, O-line in Dallas. He sucked in WAS, MIA, & OAK

 

[MossBurner]

Norv had very little say in those drafts, and you know it...

The head coach, without a doubt, had something to do with a decision at #3 overall - Heath Shuler. Hire Norv, please!

 

[CATCH17]

You are wrong here. The only reason he has a rep as a good play-caller is because he had a HOF QB, RB, WR, O-line in Dallas. He sucked in WAS, MIA, & OAK

I thought he was pretty good in Miami.

He didnt have a Quarterback in Oakland.

San Diego I thought he was good and i'd say he did a hell of a job with San Fran this year.

When Norv was calling the plays for Ricky Williams I thought Ricky was the best runningback in the league at that time.

 

[dboyz]

You are wrong here. The only reason he has a rep as a good play-caller is because he had a HOF QB, RB, WR, O-line in Dallas. He sucked in WAS, MIA, & OAK

Norv was a great play-caller. I remember thinking that even in Washington Norv was an excellent play-caller. When Turner left and Zampese came in, the play-calling was decidedly worse.

Also you may want to retract the statement about a HOF offensive line. None of the offensive linemen under Norv's watch will likely make the HOF. They were certainly a good group though.

 

[doomsday81]

We've heard opinions about whether or not he was a failure in DC, and defenders saying that until Dan Snyder came on board in 1999 (the next to last season of Norv's tenure there), he had the team "turned around", "headed in the right direction"... actually, a number of the defenders apparently believed that Danny Boy hired Norv, and of course Norv had been there a while when the Mad Midget showed up...

So I decided to refresh my memory about the Norv era, and look up his bio on Wikipedia... here's what I learned:

The year before Norv was hired, the Skins were 4-12... they were, simply, a team in disarray... his first two years there, they went 3-13, then showed a modest improvement, to 6-10...

Then in the next 4 seasons, the Skins went 9-7, 8-7-1, 6-10 and 10-6, an overall 33-31-1 record... they had reached mediocrity, actually a little better than mediocrity, since it would appear that 6-10 record was a bit of an aberration (I seem to remember the Skins got hammered by injuries in 98, but I'm not entirely confident about my memories on this one)...

The 10-6 season was the first year of the Dan Snyder era... presumably, Danny Boy didn't go around changing everything wholesale that year... but in year 2, the Skins regressed to 8-8, Danny Boy panicked and fired Turner... I find it easy to believe that part of the reason for the regression was the meddling of the Mad Midget...

And the Skins went steady downhill from there over the next 4 seasons, going 8-8, 7-9, 5-11 and 6-10, which would tend to support that subjective opinion...

So those who say that Norv's lack of success in Washington isn't because of Danny Boy are mostly right, it was only at the end of that time that Danny Boy was on the scene... but it sure looks like Norv had done a fair to middling job of bringing a team in the dumper back to respectability before Danny Boy showed up...

I totally agree. Norv Turner will make the Cowboys mediocre. Yippee. I can't wait.

 

[MossBurner]

Norv was a great play-caller. I remember thinking that even in Washington Norv was an excellent play-caller. When Turner left and Zampese came in, the play-calling was decidedly worse.

Also you may want to retract the statement about a HOF offensive line. None of the offensive linemen under Norv's watch will likely make the HOF. They were certainly a good group though.

Norv sucked in Washington. Get Real. I know that one playoff win might look good right now, but come on.

 

[Beast_from_East]

I can tell you too that Norvs play calling sucked a lot. He went deep in short yardage, short on deep yardage, passed on running downs and did stuff that made you go ***?

Cowboys fans are used to dumb arse play calling.

Kinda like playing a team with DBs signed off the street and you dont call a single deep pass.

:laugh2:

 

[Om]

Silverbear is 100%, totally, utterly on the money. Norv Turner was close to turning the Commanders back into a champion, but Dan Snyder showed up, meddled and cut him loose. Huge mistake we're still paying for up here.

Norv Turner is a tremendous football coach and the perfect fit to replace Bill Parcell in Dallas. I hope Jones has the vision to see this too and hires him imediately.

 

[superpunk]

....via the magic of the innernets.

 

[kingwhicker]

Way to miss the point, hoss... it's almost like you don't WANT to see the point being made...

I'd enlighten you, but you appear to be happy in your blissful ignorance, and I can't quite convince myself that you're worth enlightening...

So have fun in your little coccoon of despair, and enjoy the offseason...

I knew what your point was and have no issue with it, even though I doubt Norv Turner is the answer to our prayers. I was merely pointing out that the buffoon Parcells was no better than Norv was in that four year period in Washington. Maybe you were the one who was ignorant for missing the point, hoss...