According to our favorite source, WR Matt Jones may be looking for a home

[iceberg]

My position in this debate is 'pro-Jones', why would you expect me to take an opposing stance.

While I'm defending my position, I don't think I'm ignoring facts or outright lying, am I?

Fine, but by your own standards then, this team's current #2 receiver would also be a 'scrub'.

Actually he was. Looking at his 2006 starts, he started only 4 games which would mean he was the team's #3 receiver for the other 12.

Again, my position in this isn't unbiased, I am pro-Jones in Dallas. I freely admit that. And while I am defending the player, I'm not lying when I do it. I'm using numbers and facts to back that up.

Again, my stance in this debate is pro-Jones, not unbiased. I'm certainly trying to hear all sides on the topic and if someone makes a good point I would gladly acknowledge it.

And if someone has a better alternative, I would love to hear it.

But I haven't.

Quite frankly, it surprises me how many people are passionately opposed to using a late round draft pick on a chance at improving the current wide receiver corps on what is potentially a Super Bowl team.

a better alternative...

let our young guys see what they can do. if we're ever in a position anywhere where we have to rely on matt jones, i'd say our season is over anyway.

since we're going to grow as a team, i'd rather develop danny, hurd and stanback and not give those reps to someone who's not achieved anything noteworthy to date.

i'll end it here cause we're sidetracking on issues now and that just frustrates both sides.

good argument - i disagree and am over and out.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

That's your opinion. Fior the record, what "plays" did Ausitn make? Two where his biggest contribution was getting interfered with?

I'm not making phantom excuses for the fact that he didn't live up to Jacksonville's expectations. There's no denying that.

I'm merely saying that he's not 'garbage' as some would believe and that a late round draft pick is a small price to pay to potentially improve this team in some way.

So, according to you, Austin can "improve his hands', but Jones cannot?

And Hurd can suddenly get faster? Seems that's asking a lot.

Austin will turn 24 years old this month, Jones just turned 25, yet one has upside and the other does not?

I don't understand that thinking.

Jones came out of the SEC and has stagnated. Hurd and Austin came out of small schools and have gotten better in both of their two years. Jones has played three seasons, has gotten oppurtunities and has not succeeded.

Tom Landry says that if a player doesn't show anything within three years they probably never will. If Austin or Hurd don't improve next year then of course it is time to scuttle those projects as well. Its time to scuttle Matt Jones now.

But really you could teach Jones to run better routes or catch the ball better. thats not really what i am concerned about. they guy shies from contact, he gives up on blocks, he' shirk inside routes and the likes. You can teach a man what to do but you can't teach him the willingness to do it. We've seen Austin and Hurd fight through blocks and make tackles on ST heck we've even see Stanback run into a wedge at full speed which takes some serious guts if you ask me.

Can you imagine Matt Jones playing ST? I can't.

What i do know is that Garrett and Sherman like our young guys and Del Rio and Co over in Florida don't like Jones. That is really good enough for me.

 

[Wrangler87]

And notice that all of Jacksonville's receivers are poor?

Ever wonder why that is?

Maybe all of the blame doesn't go solely on Matt Jones?

He led the team in receiving in 2006.

Despite a down year in 2007 where Del Rio deactivated him for several games, his overall production was better than that of Austin, Hurd, and Stanback combined.

They have been really bad in the passing game. There QB's have been less than stellar since Brunell left. Garrard was okay, but he defines "bus driver" and when the pressure was put on him to win the games, he couldn't.

 

[neosapien23]

I would not mind Matt Jones for a 6th or 7th round pick at all. Crayton only posted the numbers he did because teams were concentrating on Witten and Owens. Crayton has good hands and runs good routes, but the ceiling has probably been reached. His best fit was as a slot receiver, but Glenn got hurt. Jones is alot more developed than Austin, Stanback, and Jefferson. Hurd shows good hands but like Crayon is not as physically gifted as other receivers. Will Jones ever be a Michael Irvin type reciever? No. But he could develop into a decent number 2 option in a short amount of time. I think Jones would develop alot faster than Austin and is probably worth a look.

 

[Nightman]

I simply don't understand why people would be against bringing him in for a try-out. If Hurd, Austin and Stanback are better, they will beat him out in camp. The competition alone is worth bringing him in. He has special size and speed and a change of scenery to a veteran team may be all it takes. Roy Williams, Ocho Cinco and Boldin are not coming. Glenn looks to be done. If someone has a realistic option please let us know.

 

[Stash]

I would not mind Matt Jones for a 6th or 7th round pick at all. Crayton only posted the numbers he did because teams were concentrating on Witten and Owens. Crayton has good hands and runs good routes, but the ceiling has probably been reached. His best fit was as a slot receiver, but Glenn got hurt. Jones is alot more developed than Austin, Stanback, and Jefferson. Hurd shows good hands but like Crayon is not as physically gifted as other receivers. Will Jones ever be a Michael Irvin type reciever? No. But he could develop into a decent number 2 option in a short amount of time. I think Jones would develop alot faster than Austin and is probably worth a look.

You've seemingly summed up in a few sentences what I've been trying to say in 500 posts!

Well done and welcome aboard!

:thankyou:

 

[zeromaster]

There seem to be a couple of things at work here: (1) Jones could be in a bad situation with a team not known for developing WRs, but Sherman could overcome that, and (2) the coaches seem to have a high opinion of Stanback, but I haven't heard if Sherman is also part of that cadre.

Now if Sherman does think Stanback is worth the effort, is it worth a 7th roundpick and the decreased time/reps for Hurd/Austin/Stanback to find out about Jones, simply because he was a 1st-round pick and has shown some ability? That plays into the equation as well, IMO.

Somewhere along the line we fans are going to have to trust the coaches on their decision, whatever it turns out to be.

 

[Kolemmitt]

I simply don't understand why people would be against bringing him in for a try-out. If Hurd, Austin and Stanback are better, they will beat him out in camp. The competition alone is worth bringing him in. He has special size and speed and a change of scenery to a veteran team may be all it takes. Roy Williams, Ocho Cinco and Boldin are not coming. Glenn looks to be done. If someone has a realistic option please let us know.

I have to agree with this statement. I just don't see much of a risk. I really don't see how bringing in legitimate competition for our young recievers is a bad thing. If taking away a few snaps from Hurd or Austin in training camp was such a big deal they wouldn't have signed so many rookie FA WR's.

It's a long shot, but I wonder if he could be an Alvin Harper type just with the situations reversed. A physically gifted reciever that flourished as a our #2 reciever and was a great complement to our All-Pro #1 WR and TE that floundered when he went to another team with a mediocre passing game. Let's face it, there are some teams that know how to make good use of their talent and some that just don't. Bigg and Arizona come to mind.

 

[Stash]

I have to agree with this statement. I just don't see much of a risk. I really don't see how bringing in legitimate competition for our young recievers is a bad thing. If taking away a few snaps from Hurd or Austin in training camp was such a big deal they wouldn't have signed so many rookie FA WR's.

Completely agree. And would it be a crime if Matt Jones were to take Miles Austin's practice snaps or even his role on this team?

It's a long shot, but I wonder if he could be an Alvin Harper type just with the situations reversed. A physically gifted reciever that flourished as a our #2 reciever and was a great complement to our All-Pro #1 WR and TE that floundered when he went to another team with a mediocre passing game. Let's face it, there are some teams that know how to make good use of their talent and some that just don't. Bigg and Arizona come to mind.

I saw some similarities in their games myself. Harper was a receiver with good size and speed, but he wasn't a great route runner. Harper did what he did well and that consisted mainly of running a select number of routes and being the team's downfield threat.

And if you really want to blow the naysayers out of the water, try comparing Alvin Harper's career numbers with the big underachiever Matt Jones' numbers!

Yet, somehow Harper was a solid player who was good enough to be the #2 receiver for a back-to-back Super Bowl championship team?

The more I know, the less I undertand.....

 

[Stash]

There seem to be a couple of things at work here: (1) Jones could be in a bad situation with a team not known for developing WRs, but Sherman could overcome that, and (2) the coaches seem to have a high opinion of Stanback, but I haven't heard if Sherman is also part of that cadre.

1) That's my line of thinking. I think a coach like Sherman could get more out of Jones than the Jaguars offensive coaches could.

Take a look at the number of coaching changes Del Rio has made to his offensive staff and then let me know how a team can have any level of consistancy.

2) I remember reading that Sherman was excited about the prospects for Stanback this season. With a full offseason, he may step up and contribute this season.

Now if Sherman does think Stanback is worth the effort, is it worth a 7th roundpick and the decreased time/reps for Hurd/Austin/Stanback to find out about Jones, simply because he was a 1st-round pick and has shown some ability? That plays into the equation as well, IMO.

For me a late round draft pick is a small price to pay. This team already has extra picks for 2009 and should get a few more compensatory picks as well. A 6th or 7th rounder is almost a throw-away.

I can see giving Stanback plenty of attention, but I don't think Austin's performance as a receiver guarantees him anything. Hurd is a good posession receiver, but I can see him being pushed for his roster spot by Amendola. I think both are similar players, but if Amendola is better in the slot, that could make the difference.

I can envision a receiving corps of:

Owens
Crayton
Jones
Hurd
Stanback
Amendola

Somewhere along the line we fans are going to have to trust the coaches on their decision, whatever it turns out to be.

I trusted them last year when they spent an entire season waiting for a "healthy Terry Glenn". I'm not interested in going through another year of that as I feel a "healthy Terry Glenn" no longer exists.

 

[Cowboys2008]

I would definitely take a reach at this, especially with the uncertainty surrounding Glenn. Though then again, what's new with that? I'd just like us to change our losing ways, and it always seems to be somewhat related to our depth at WR...and that's ever since we lost Alvin Harper, sadly. Give me a team full of former first round picks at WR for Romo to play with. That's what I say. At least till we get it right.

 

[iceberg]

The more I know, the less I undertand.....

anyone else singing don henley now? : )

jones taking austins place wouldn't bother me a bit. that would be having to earn his spot. i just couldn't figure out why you were pegging him as #3 or even #2 here right off the bat. if he came in and earned it that's one thing.

but that's what he would have to do. take austins spot? since he can't catch and we've got jones and others for return duty, austin will likely be the odd man out anyway. if if we keep that danny kid, don't we have rules that no team can have (2) white WRs at the same time? : )

events are yet to unfold on this but if jones came in and bumped austin not sure why anyone would really care and i'd see him as a #5 in here to start. he'd have to earn his way up from there. my issue.

 

[PosterChild]

anyone else singing don henley now? : )

jones taking austins place wouldn't bother me a bit. that would be having to earn his spot. i just couldn't figure out why you were pegging him as #3 or even #2 here right off the bat. if he came in and earned it that's one thing.

but that's what he would have to do. take austins spot? since he can't catch and we've got jones and others for return duty, austin will likely be the odd man out anyway. if if we keep that danny kid, don't we have rules that no team can have (2) white WRs at the same time? : )

events are yet to unfold on this but if jones came in and bumped austin not sure why anyone would really care and i'd see him as a #5 in here to start. he'd have to earn his way up from there. my issue.

You're not getting to the heart of the matter...

 

[Stash]

anyone else singing don henley now? : )

I figured that would happen the "new york minute" I wrote it.

jones taking austins place wouldn't bother me a bit. that would be having to earn his spot. i just couldn't figure out why you were pegging him as #3 or even #2 here right off the bat. if he came in and earned it that's one thing.

I'm not advocating 'giving' Matt Jones anything, and at the cost of a 6th round pick you wouldn't have to. Worst case scenario, and the guy is an uncoachable bum who doesn't care about football? You cut him in preseason and chalk it up to having tried and failed. What did taking that chance cost? A 6th round pick from a team who's going to have plenty of picks for 2009.

but that's what he would have to do. take austins spot? since he can't catch and we've got jones and others for return duty, austin will likely be the odd man out anyway. if if we keep that danny kid, don't we have rules that no team can have (2) white WRs at the same time? : )

Exactly. There are plenty of candidates for kickoff returner so that won't keep Austin around again this year. He either shows up as a receiver, or it's time to move on.

events are yet to unfold on this but if jones came in and bumped austin not sure why anyone would really care and i'd see him as a #5 in here to start. he'd have to earn his way up from there. my issue.

I think his talent and the NFL experience he does have would put him in at #3 from the start.

I found it very interesting that Matt Jones' overall numbers for the first 3 years of his career are better than those of Alvin Harper.

I don't think anyone would have labeled Harper a "bust" or an "underachiever" while he was here in Dallas.

 

[iceberg]

I think his talent and the NFL experience he does have would put him in at #3 from the start.

here's where we disagree then. i don't want hurd or stanback to lose reps and their own gains. i'd put it
TO
Glenn
Crayton
Free For All with no one secured to any spot.

at that point the best man wins. if glenn leaves, then 1 and 2 are set and the rest are fighting for a spot.

oh well, this is the end of my innocence.

 

[Stash]

here's where we disagree then. i don't want hurd or stanback to lose reps and their own gains. i'd put it
TO
Glenn
Crayton
Free For All with no one secured to any spot.

at that point the best man wins. if glenn leaves, then 1 and 2 are set and the rest are fighting for a spot.

oh well, this is the end of my innocence.

I'm already writing Glenn out of my equation.

Not a happy prospect but I feel a realistic one.

I have no problem with Owens and Crayton as the incumbent #1 and #2 but in my opinion, Matt Jones' ability would 'pencil' him in at #3 from Day One.

Now whether he stayed there, rose up to #2, or fell off completely would be up to him.

Ideally, I would love to see the team make a move as soon as possible to give any receiver they acquire the most time to assimilate the offense and get familiar with the scheme, the team, and the coaches.

 

[DFWJC]

Here is an update on the Jags WR situation. The group does seem to be deeper than in the past. Same old Matt Jones take though:

The wide receiving corps has been the focus of attention for the past five years.
Nothing has changed for 2008.
Jerry Porter has reportedly been the clear choice to be the guy this year. Based on his contract numbers, as well as on his performance since arriving in Jacksonville, he has taken to the role of number one quite nicely, showing to be head and shoulders above all other prospects in his route running skills, speed, and catching ability. He has been dinged up during OTAs, which could have him sitting out during mini camp in an effort to avoid aggravating his already tender hamstring and Achilles tendon.
Mike Walker returns from a 2007 on the injured reserve. Expectations were set that he would not participate in any drills until training camp. However, doctors cleared him earlier this week to begin practicing again. After participating in OTAs on Tuesday, Walker’s knee responded positively. It is now expected that he will participate, at least on a limited basis, during mini camp this weekend.
John Broussard returns to find competition as the speed receiver on the roster, going up against Troy Williamson, the former first round pick from Minnesota. All indications are that this will be one of the more entertaining battles during the camp season as both players are playing extremely well.
Matt Jones has been the focal point for a lot of speculation this off season. After a disappointing 2007 season that found Jones deactivated for a handful of games, talk began to surface that some on the coaching staff were encouraging the Jaguars to trade or release the quarterback turned receiver. The perception of a lack of effort on his part has been a heated topic of discussion for the past year as many felt that Jones had simply decided to mail it in because his desire is to play elsewhere in 2008.
Unfortunately for Jones, Del Rio has no intention of cutting him loose any time soon. Early indications from OTAs were that Matt Jones was struggling, but in recent sessions, he has started to turn it on to some extent. Granted, it is non-contact drills in shorts and shirts. But, at least there is some sign that he is starting to at least put some effort into advancing his career. Perhaps it is a maneuver intended to accelerate his departure from Jacksonville, or it is a genuine attempt to salvage what has been a disappointing career here in Jacksonville. It will be an interesting scenario to watch as it plays itself out.

-----------
When I look at the group they have--not just descrobed here, but also adding Reggie Williams, Northcut and others---the group is not so bad at all. They still lack a true #1 IMO. After that, I think thir group is as good as the Cowboys. A no-brainer here: Witten and TO make a huge differnce.

 

[Stash]

"Matt Jones has been the focal point for a lot of speculation this off season. After a disappointing 2007 season that found Jones deactivated for a handful of games, talk began to surface that some on the coaching staff were encouraging the Jaguars to trade or release the quarterback turned receiver. The perception of a lack of effort on his part has been a heated topic of discussion for the past year as many felt that Jones had simply decided to mail it in because his desire is to play elsewhere in 2008."

I think that might very well be the case. And if I had led the team in receiving in 2006 yet was still not starting the following season, it might affect my attitude as well.

"Unfortunately for Jones, Del Rio has no intention of cutting him loose any time soon. Early indications from OTAs were that Matt Jones was struggling, but in recent sessions, he has started to turn it on to some extent. Granted, it is non-contact drills in shorts and shirts. But, at least there is some sign that he is starting to at least put some effort into advancing his career. Perhaps it is a maneuver intended to accelerate his departure from Jacksonville, or it is a genuine attempt to salvage what has been a disappointing career here in Jacksonville. It will be an interesting scenario to watch as it plays itself out."

I had read that Del Rio's intention was to stick it to Jones by keeping him until the last cutdown of preseason and release him when all the receiver jobs had been filled.

If that's accurate, it's pretty vindictive, and a bit foolish. To take away reps and a possible roster spot out of spite?

That's why I advocate offering Jacksonville a 6th or 7th rounder for him - and make it public knowledge if Del Rio balks.

Matt Jones would do the Cowboys no good if they picked him up right before the season. He would need all the time he could get to come in and learn the system and pick up as much coaching from Ray Sherman as he could in that short peroid of time.