An Eye Opening Aspect to the CBA "Negotiations"

[Hostile]

I've been wondering about a comment made by someone who is dialed in to the behind the scenes stuff with the negotiations. I was asking him for some clarification on one thing that just blows my mind and he said I could post this.

I don't know what to think of this. You guys will have to tell me.

Most of the negotiations with the Federal Mediator were not face to face. The owners were in one room. The NFLPA* was in another room. The Federal Mediator, George Cohen, was nothing more than a go between or gopher.

Now note, I did not say all of the meetings. For instance we know that Jerry addressed them all in his infamous fist bump speech which I was told was an impassioned plea for a final extension to avoid the lockout.

We also know about the Jerry Richardson meeting where he asked Brees and Manning if they needed help translating the financial data they were given. I think though that might have been before Mediation. I am not 100% sure.

Personally, I do not know how they could hope to get anything done without being in the same room and actually having back and forth. But apparently there was very little of that.

Now, I know the inevitable question will be asked, whose idea was this? I cannot answer this. I wish I could. I have reported that Cohen was angry at Smith for "wasting his time." Perhaps this is part of that. I say again, I do not know for sure.

For the record, I am sending the URL of this thread to a member of the DFW media to investigate. Perhaps if the story of this breaks it could piss some people off and start some movement. That is my sole intention in doing this.

 

[pugilist]

worth a shot at least.. good luck man

come on guys (players and owners), get your **** together!

 

[7footer]

Wait a minute...

So most of these supposed "talks" and "negotiations" weren't even done face-to-face or in the same room?

Wow...

Just wow...

Just...wow...

 

[Hostile]

Wait a minute...

So most of these supposed "talks" and "negotiations" weren't even done face-to-face or in the same room?

Wow...

Just wow...

Just...wow...

That is correct.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

WTH...what was the point if they weren't face to face? That's a completely useless waste of time and the only thing I get from it is that one side, or more likely both, had already completely decided on their stance and there wasn't going to be anything done anyway.

That's just mind boggling to me.

 

[WoodysGirl]

Jay Feely said that a long time ago...

That they spent most of the time in separate rooms trying to come up with things on their own. That they barely talked/saw the owners reps.

 

[Hostile]

Jay Feely said that a long time ago...

That they spent most of the time in separate rooms trying to come up with things on their own. That they barely talked/saw the owners reps.

I missed that report.

I think players have a right to be pissed off. These guys are screwing with their lives and livelihood.

 

[SkinsFan28]

I can imagine the notes:

(from Brees) Jerry R, i am having trouble with my math, what is 3 * 707

(JR to DB) Drew baby, i loved when you stood up to me, hey can you watch my mansion for me on Sep 11th, I am pretty sure you won't be busy?

(RG to DSmith) De, your a good guy, I really like your style, how about we do lunch sometime?

(DSmith to RG: music file attached) bah da duh - You Suck

(RG to DSmith) De, don't be like that, look, 18 games you know that was just a negotiating tool, we aren't really gonna do that

(DSmith to RG: music file attached) bah da duh - YOU Suck

(DB to JR) I can't make the 11th, but I will be studying music and TREBLEs .. bah da duh You Suck

(JR to DB) why you little, when I played the game, ooohhh you make me soo mad

(RG to DSmith) Really De, whatcha gonna do, go up before college kids and yell that or something, man don't be such a baby, just do lunch with me and we can make up or somethin.

(DSmith to RG: music file attached) bah da duh - YOU SUCK

(GC to both) now you two sides, there will be no note passing in class, detention for all of you!

(DSmith to GC: music file attached) bah da duh - YOU SUCK

(RG to GC) oh George, don't be that way, we can work it out.

 

[arglebargle]

Anyone involved with the mediation scene know if this is standard practice, or at least an accepted practice? Or is this highly unusual?

Doesn't sound like a good plan to me, but maybe they had to take away their guns and knives during the first FTF meeting, and thought it would progress better with some seperation.

 

[gmoney112]

I really hope there is no NFL this season so these jackrabbits can realize how useful they are truly.

 

[WoodysGirl]

I missed that report.

I think players have a right to be pissed off. These guys are screwing with their lives and livelihood.

From the transcript from his interview with Mike Florio

**: There were a lot of other terms in that offer and the full summary is at nfllabor.com and we have posted item on it, we posted the full statement. A lot of the other non-economic terms, [the offer] looked very enticing. And Jay, my reaction when I, and I try to look at all this stuff objectively and dispassionately, I looked at the proposal, the summary of the proposal, and it looks to me like the NFL really glossed over the financial side of it, almost hoping that the non-economics would cause the fish to bite. And that when you saw no 18-game season for at least two years and it would be on the table and you’d have to agree to it later, and some of the other things, the reduction in offseason workouts, the potential for remaining in the player medical plan for life, third-party arbitration for drug and steroid suspensions is a very big concession. Did the players have that same perception, that they’re loading up a lot of non-economic terms just to soften us up to take a financial deal that maybe we’re not interested in?

JF: Well no, not really, because all of those things were in our proposal that we gave to them originally. So they’re coming back to us and agreeing to some of those proposals. Obviously, we made a lot of progress in mediation on the health and safety issues, and the offseason program, and you know, Sean Morey who heads that up for our Executive Committee did a tremendous amount of work trying to come up with a system that both the owners and the coaches, keeping the coaches, you should have seen, Mike, this whole system, all day long going back and forth, debating all the different ways it would work and not work, and whether it would help veterans as well as rookies, whether the coaches could do the job that they need to do. I mean, the public has this perception that the players sat there and had no desire to get a deal done. So far from the truth. The frustration came from the fact that, I’ll give you an example, I sat up there Tuesday and Wednesday, all day and I spent thirty minutes total in front of the owners. So we’re spending all day up there yet not having the dialogue, not having the communication with the owners. We’re up there for what, 17 days or so, in the total mediation process we may have spent an aggregate total of twenty hours in front of the owners in that entire time. Now I don’t know if that was the owners’ desire to not be there. I do know that they’d tell us we’re going to meet at two o’clock and then five o’clock would roll around and we’re still waiting there to meet and then come down and say well they broke for dinner so we’re not going to meet now. That’s where a lot of the frustration came from on the players’ side, not that they were not giving us what we want, that they weren’t meeting with us and dialoguing with us and trying to come up with solutions and answers. And we sat in our room, our mediation room the entire time trying to come up with answers, trying to come up with all different kinds of models that they could possibly work with. In the end, they agreed somewhat with the model we presented them but didn’t do so in a timely enough fashion that we could actually have dialogue going forward on the negotiation process.

**: Well, Jay, help us understand what was actually going on during the mediation process because I’ve been involved in many mediations [in] civil litigation, where the only time one side sees the other side is in an initial meeting and then people retreat to separate rooms and the mediator goes back and forth and exchanges offers and talks about strengths and weaknesses and tries to get the two sides to come together. What were you doing, what was happening when you weren’t meeting with the owners? Were you talking to the mediator, were you strategizing, did the mediator keep you apprised of what to expect next? Help us understand what was going on.

JF: Well, you summed it up pretty well as far as what the process was like. We just didn’t feel like there was near enough dialogue between the owners and the players. Had there been more dialogue on a face-to-face basis then we could have made more progress. When there was that dialogue that obviously it’s not just numbers anymore, it’s not just words on paper, you can exchange ideas and you can help enlighten them and they can help enlighten you. You know, so that’s where I think opportunity existed and wasn’t taken advantage of. And as I went through and looked at their proposal that they released to the public and looked at our proposal, you know, I think there’s room to get a deal done, I really do. I don’t see that as a hindrance, just because we chose to decertify. And I know that they’ve tried to present that to the public, that we decertified and I listened to Jeff Pash, he said players quote forced the lockout by decertifying. You asked him that question and Pash said yes. But that’s so far from the truth. If you look at the Judge Doty ruling, the NFL and their TV lawsuit before Judge Doty, used as their justification of their position that imminent lockout of the players. They were planning to lock the players out the whole time whether we decertified or not, it was just a legal maneuver that the NFL believed gave them the most leverage locking us out. Conversely, decertification for us was a legal maneuver that we knew we had to take, not because we thought we could get a better deal that way but because that was the only way we could ensure hopefully that games weren’t missed.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/03/14/jay-feely-interview-transcript/

 

[Hostile]

From the transcript from his interview with Mike Florio





http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/03/14/jay-feely-interview-transcript/

I consider that freaking ridiculous. No wonder a deal didn't get done.

 

[peplaw06]

I consider that freaking ridiculous. No wonder a deal didn't get done.

That's how mediations are typically done. I suspect it's been the same with the Megistrate Judge.

 

[Outlaw Heroes]

I was actually shocked when I heard about this, since in my experience negotiations are always in the same room. So I just asked another lawyer I know who does a lot of labor mediations. She says it's becoming more and more common, particularly where there's concern that the parties will get positional and the negotiations may be contentious. I still find it all rather bizarre, to be quite honest.

 

[BrassCowboy]

Wait a minute...

So most of these supposed "talks" and "negotiations" weren't even done face-to-face or in the same room?

Wow...

Just wow...

Just...wow...

i know, what are we.... like 12? :

 

[DCDave]

I don't know what to think of this. You guys will have to tell me.

Most of the negotiations with the Federal Mediator were not face to face. The owners were in one room. The NFLPA* was in another room. The Federal Mediator, Stephen Cohen, was nothing more than a go between or gopher.

This is absolutely standard practice in court-ordered mediations or settlement conferences. I was just in a settlement conference last week with a federal magistrate judge and, other than shaking hands before it started, we never even spoke to the lawyers on the other side. That's the whole point of having the third party -- to act as an intermediary so as to prevent the sides the ability to speak more freely and frankly, as well as to keep the process from becoming overly contentious. For litigation-related mediations, this is absolutely standard practice. I'd be surprised if they proceeded any other way.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

This is not anything out of the ordinary with mediation.

This type of thing was done when my wife had an auto accident and there was a mediator.

He would come into the room with the wife and the lawyer and say the other side is willing to pay x amount. The lawyer would tell the mediator that the wife wants this amount.

The mediator continued to go between rooms until a deal was agreed upon.

So for those that are getting upset or feel it is crazy...it is not something that is unheard of.

 

[jobberone]

I don't think it matters who says what or when. Both sides decided their strategies a long time ago. This will play out until the bell whistles then both sides will cave. Some. I think the players will cave a lot more than the owners. Until then it's all smoke and mirrors.

 

[jobberone]

This is not anything out of the ordinary with mediation.

This type of thing was done when my wife had an auto accident and there was a mediator.

He would come into the room with the wife and the lawyer and say the other side is willing to pay x amount. The lawyer would tell the mediator that the wife wants this amount.

The mediator continued to go between rooms until a deal was agreed upon.

So for those that are getting upset or feel it is crazy...it is not something that is unheard of.

You're right and when hostilities are running high its often the best way to operate.

 

[BubbleScreen]

Face to face negotiations only work when there is a shared desire to resolve a conflict. The issues are usually well understood by each side and the process is just getting to the right number that is usually painful to everyone.

Some player was on Twitter the other day telling Goodell to give up the 18 game dream. There are many many issues still pending. An ideal mediation would take each side's wishlist and find that painful unhappy medium that each side will accept. But obviously we're not there yet. Each side has matters pending that they think will give them negotiation leverage (TV deal, lockout ruling). Until those possible leverage issues fall into place, we're going to be at status quo.