An oddity about Washington

[Hostile]

Dayum lol...I haven't read your post yet but holy stinkin' kumquats, that's some lengthy smack right there!! lol ...I'm gonna have to read it later when I have more time to digest it and form a response worthy of your effort...and you know I will.

That's fine. If you think I was done with just that tiny amount, you really don't know how deep into the trenches I can dig.

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[Mansta54]

That's fine. If you think I was done with just that tiny amount, you really don't know how deep into the trenches I can dig.

:

Not sure it's worth the effort though Hos. They're a DEAD LAST team coming off a 4 win season and changing HC and staff AGAIN. Talk is all he has, cause it darn sure isn't in their play on the field.

 

[Yeagermeister]

Child please. You want to talk smack, I'm your huckleberry. But don't bring this weak crap in here. This is like bringing a flyswatter to a gunfight. The Cowboys don't cast a shadow over the Commanders? In your best wet dreams, and nowhere else.

Since 1960 when the Cowboys came into the league the Commanders have been our punching bag with very few exceptions. It is one of the chief reasons why you hate the Cowboys and denying that would be silly. There's 50 years of head to head History staring you right in the face.

You want a little come uppance? Let's start with this. You're shooting your mouth off on a Cowboys forum after finishing dead last in the Division.

Since 1961 the Cowboys and Commanders have been in the same Division. The lone exception was the 1982 strike year where Divisions were done away with. This means we have 48 years of Division rivalry with them. In that 48 year span the Cowboys have been last in the NFC East a total of 4 times.

Tom Landry's last year...1988. Jimmy Johnson's first year...1989. Dave Campo's final two years of 5-11 madness...2001 & 2002.

Dan Snyder bought the Commanders in May 1999. Counting 1999 he has owned the team for 11 seasons. They have 4 dead last finishes in the Division just since he took over the team.

2004 under Joe Gibbs. 2006 under Joe Gibbs. 2008 under Jim Zorn. 2009 under Jim Zorn.

Oh, and in case anyone is curious, 3 times before Little Danny bought the team...1961, 1993, & 1994.

The all time series shows the Cowboys with a huge advantage. 59-37-2. If you went on a winning streak against us right now, it would take 11 years of sweeps to break even. The problem with that idea is you've only swept us 4 times in the 48 years of home and away series. 1984, 1987, 1995, & 2005. You couldn't even sweep us the year we went 1-15. Hells bells, the worst Head Coach in our History, Dave Campo was 5-1 against the Commanders.

Not one of our Head Coaches in our History has a losing record against the Commanders.

Meanwhile, we have swept you 15 times after last year's broom job. Adding insult to injury, you don't even hold a winning record against us in your house. Dallas is 26-24 playing @ Washington and 8-5 at Fed Ex Field.

Do you know what your longest winning streak against the Cowboys is? Of course you don't. It's 4 games. The last game of 1986 through the first game of 1988. One of those wins was the replacement game of 1987 that Commanders fans are so proud of. If we win our first match in 2010, the season opener in your house, it will be 4 in a row for us, matching your longest ever. It's not our longest ever against you. I am just throwing it out there for the sake of information.

Actually our longest win streak was 10 games. The last game of the 1997 season through the first game of the 2002 season. Had you guys not figured out Campo for that one game in 2002 our streak would have been 15 games, because as soon you won 1 against us, we immediately added another 4 in a row, again, matching your longest streak. We have matched or exceeded your longest streak 4 times already, and a season opening win will make it 5 times.

You can throw out your little post season glory for the last 12 years weak jab, but it doesn't impress me one bit that you've won more post season games than us over the last 13 years. If you want to compare post season records, just wait until the record starts playing and we'll dance. The Cowboys are 33-25 all time in the Post Season. The Commanders are 10 wins behind us at 23-17. Behind us is where you belong as I have already demonstrated. We have a 10 win advantage over you despite you having a 28 year head start on us. Give us 28 more years and that 33 is going to look pedestrian.

While I care about all kinds of records and accomplishments it really comes down to Super Bowls. We've won 3 of those things since you last won one. How does that taste? We've got a legit shot to make it 4 since your last one. I bet that was bitter. Yeah I know all about your NFL Championships in 1937 and 1946, giving you 5 just like us. Think we'll be stuck on 5 in 28 more years? I bet we won't be. Maybe we will. I guess it is something for you to hope for.

You've got 6 Division Championships to be proud of in the years we have been head to head rivals. Congrats on those. I do think they matter. We have 21 in the same time span. We have twice won 5 in a row.

16 times since we joined the NFL in 1960 the Commanders have been to the Playoffs. I don't think it will be 17 in 2010. I've been wrong before, but I just don't see you as a Playoff team in 2010. I do think we are. That will make 31 times. 1 short of doubling your success at achieving the post season.

No shadow cast on your team by ours? Like I said before, child please.

ost:

That is some straight up pwnage :laugh2:

 

[SaltwaterServr]

It's the shadow of an anorexic teenage girl standing directly under the 12:00 noon sun lol...an ant couldn't get shivers from that shadow.

You would think that you'd be slipping into hypothermia after getting whooped by a team on a, what was it, 23 game losing streak?

At least you didn't follow that up with getting beat down by Tampa Bay team on another double digit losing streak.


You should consider putting this on your Xmas wish list.

http://www.thenorthface.com/webapp/...bCat&parent_category_rn=11702&variationId=612

 

[Ren]

Point out all the posts on CZ by Commanders fans where they claim how "great" the Skins will be this season. Or is this just Cowboys fan hyperbole along the lines of Skins fans claiming that "The Cowboys are always picked to go to the Super Bowl"? lol...At least I gave some links and quotes to back up that poster's claims.

There's a search function and archive section, have at it, there's PLENTY to see there if you want to see it. I'm not your butler i have better things to do then indulge some troll we won't see 3 months from now

 

[Phrozen Phil]

The reality of it that neither team has won the Superbowl in a while, and the only game that really matters is the next one. Having said that, I like our chances better this year and the lack of drama in Dallas provides for a a more confident view. I expect that Washington will be better with the changes they've made, but I'm not sure that they will be there this year. Team chemistry counts for something, and I really have no idea how that can be measured at this point in DC. I do get a sense that it's positive in Dallas. In any event, I look forward to the matchups between the clubs this year.

 

[Califan007]

There's a search function and archive section, have at it, there's PLENTY to see there if you want to see it. I'm not your butler i have better things to do then indulge some troll we won't see 3 months from now

In other words, you can't show me any posts because no Skins fans have been saying how "great" the team will be this year lol...Just own up to it, you'll feel a lot better.

Although kudos to your approach: make a baseless claim, then say that you don't have to prove your claim is true, and tell anyone who disagrees with your claim to go out and prove that it didn't happen, which is proving a negative (which is impossible to do).

 

[Califan007]

The reality of it that neither team has won the Superbowl in a while, and the only game that really matters is the next one. Having said that, I like our chances better this year and the lack of drama in Dallas provides for a a more confident view. I expect that Washington will be better with the changes they've made, but I'm not sure that they will be there this year. Team chemistry counts for something, and I really have no idea how that can be measured at this point in DC. I do get a sense that it's positive in Dallas. In any event, I look forward to the matchups between the clubs this year.

I said something very similar on Extremeskins...that the reality is neither the Cowboys or the Commanders have actually accomplished much at all since the mid-90s...and the race is on to see which team can make it to the Super Bowl first. THAT team's fans will have bragging rights, but neither team has given it's fan base miuch to gloat over in the last 15 years.

And I'm looking forward to the matchups this year as well...

 

[Ren]

In other words, you can't show me any posts because no Skins fans have been saying how "great" the team will be this year lol...Just own up to it, you'll feel a lot better.

Although kudos to your approach: make a baseless claim, then say that you don't have to prove your claim is true, and tell anyone who disagrees with your claim to go out and prove that it didn't happen, which is proving a negative (which is impossible to do).

Your like a little kid who wanders into someones house and starts crying that there's no bathroom in front of a closed bathroom door demanding someone open it for you to prove it's there, even though you're fully capable of doing it your self.

The "proof" you're looking for is right here on this very site if you want to see it, look around or use search function, prove me wrong if you're so obsessed with proof, i honestly don't care enough to indulge you

 

[Hostile]

The reality of it that neither team has won the Superbowl in a while, and the only game that really matters is the next one. Having said that, I like our chances better this year and the lack of drama in Dallas provides for a a more confident view. I expect that Washington will be better with the changes they've made, but I'm not sure that they will be there this year. Team chemistry counts for something, and I really have no idea how that can be measured at this point in DC. I do get a sense that it's positive in Dallas. In any event, I look forward to the matchups between the clubs this year.

I disagree only in the sense that I believe every game and accomplishment matters. If it didn't, why do we praise the fact that Tom Landry had 20 consecutive winning seasons? He didn't win 20 Championships. Why do we count division crowns if they don't matter? Why do we appreciate the fact that Dallas has the highest winning % in NFL History if none of that matters?

It all matters. Every wonderful moment of it. Why do I care that we are 0-3 against the Ravens if it is not Super Bowls? Because I hate being in any team's shadow and right now, they own us. The only team we have never beaten.

I have never agreed with cherry picking like "most playoff wins in the last 12 years." Who cares about a manufactured time frame other than someone to whom the big picture is one scary bunch of facts. Like when you compare the Skins to the Cowboys. Skins fans can disagree all they want, but their team does not measure up and never has. They have 2 things to crow about over us. One I find trivial, the victory in the replacement game where we had players cross the picket lines. The other is a 2-0 record against us in the post season. They were better than us both years. I don't mind admitting it.

In every other way with the exception of the very last game played between the 2 teams and assuming the Skins have won that game, they do not measure up. They just don't. It is a fact and I don't mind sharing it.

They hate us because we own them. It is just that simple, and it matters.

 

[Califan007]

Child please. You want to talk smack, I'm your huckleberry. But don't bring this weak crap in here. This is like bringing a flyswatter to a gunfight. The Cowboys don't cast a shadow over the Commanders? In your best wet dreams, and nowhere else.

Only in the minds of delusional Cowboys fans does Dallas "cast a shadow" over ANYthing Commanders related lol. Ok, maybe in the arrogance category, and maybe in the "Overrated Media Darlings" category, but that's about it.

Since 1960 when the Cowboys came into the league the Commanders have been our punching bag with very few exceptions. It is one of the chief reasons why you hate the Cowboys and denying that would be silly. There's 50 years of head to head History staring you right in the face.

For someone who says they "study" their teams and other teams in the division so much, you REALLY have zero clue as to what the rival fan bases are thinking, at least when it comes to how they view your team and why. I guess it's mentally easier to tell yourselves that it's all due to "jealousy", "envy" and other wonderfully inaccurate adjectives along those lines lol...but that line of thinking DOES hint at the biggest reason Commanders fans tend to absolutely hate the Cowboys and their supporters.

Since you're unable to actually fathom what most Skins fans think, I'll clue you and the rest of this board in: the biggest reason we despise the Cowboys the way we do? Your complete and total arrogance, both as a team and as a fan base. It doesn't have squat to do with keeping some kind of running total on who has the better record since 1961

...It's not who has the most NFL Championships since 1961 lol...It's not who has the win/loss advantage in head-to-head competition...it's the absolute arrogance that just surrounds your franchise and your fan base.

Numerous other franchises have had better success over the last 50 years than the Skins, but that doesn't automatically equate to Skins fans disliking either the team or their fans...Hell, the Giants have been pretty damn impressive over the last 30+ years, and the have the hardware to go with it. And Lord knows they've been embarrassing the Commanders over the last 5+ years to a degree that Cowboys fans could only fantasize about...while the Cowboys eek out 3-and-4 point wins against the Skins (when they DO manage to win, that is), the Giants have absolutely destroyed the Skins on a regular basis on all but one or two occasions. But Skins fans, as much as they hate the Giants, don't view them with the same contempt as the Cowboys. Why? Because that team doesn't come with an entire 747's baggage compartment's worth of arrogance.

For most Skins fans, the true moment of hatred against the Cowboys starts when George Allen was our coach. That man LOVED to hate Dallas, and for the very same reasons I just mentioned...he'd point towards Dallas and point out the arrogance of the franchise, players, coaches and fans, and use that as a tool and a weapon for motivation. It didn't matter if half of what he said was inaccurate or not lol...because the other half that WAS accurate was more than enough. And that hatred filtered easily to the fan base, because we were seeing the same things Allen was seeing.

Think I'm wrong?...Please. Just using common sense and logic would dictate that the fans back during Allen's time that were hating the Cowboys with a laser-like intensity were NOT hating them due to some perceived "shadow" they felt they were living under. Yeah, right, only the arrogance of a delusional Cowboys fan would think that the 4-decades of franchise history and success up until the 70's would be overshadowed by Dallas' 10 years in the division lol

...No, it's not some nickel-sized "shadow" that makes us Commanders fans despise your team and alot of your fanbase...it's the gawd-awful stench of arrogance that you emit.

Afterall, there is a reason Forbes just recently conducted a poll that listed Jerruh Jones as one of the 10-most disliked figures in all of sports while Daniel Snyder was nowhere to be found on that list...and it's NOT because the magazine only asked Commanders fans lol . It's because Jones epidomizes the arrogance that numerous other sports fans see the Cowboys as embracing. An unearned and unwarranted arrogance.

Here's an example of what I mean (something I've seen happen waaay too much): Your average Dallas fan will say that it's 5 Super Bowl wins is what Skins fan "envy" and why Skins fans hate the Cowboys...when a Skins fan points out that the Commanders also have 5 league championships in their franchise's history, that same Cowboys fan will dismiss those earlier championships as being "before the Super Bowl era". Yep, just like a Dallas fan to arrogantly dismiss anything that occurred in the league before their arrival lol...You may want to pretend otherwise (or may actually have convinced yourself otherwise), but it's the arrogance of your team and its fans that push Dallas over from mere "Hated Rival" status into full-blown loathing.

And here's another aspect that fuels your average Commanders' fan's hatred towards the Cowboys...the types of players both teams have had over the decades. Back during the 70's George Allen put together the "Over The Hill Gang", and turned out some damn good teams with a bunch of cast-offs and players deemed too old to contribute anything worthwhile...and Commanders fans fell in love with their no-name, blue-collar workers, ones who believed in and followed a coach who emphasized that "40 men together can't lose!"...By contrast, we saw in Dallas a team that seemed more comprised of individual stars than "40 men working together". Again, whether or not that was accurate is irrelevant...because that vision of individual "household name" type players constrasted significantly with the no-name cast-offs that filled in 95% of the Skins roster. And Allen played on that vision and image like a **'er lol...used it to his and his team's advantage...and with the arrogance leaking from your team it was a forceful combo that fueled an already existing hatred due to being division rivals.

The Skins' history over the past 40 years has been full of those types of players...bloodied, broken-nosed, lunchpail types of players nobody ever heard of that seemed to succeed wih the Commanders to a level that they had not done anywhere else. We're the only team that actually had an organized cheering section for the offensive linemen, for pete's sake lol

...and NOT because it was full of 1st round marketable "name" players. And it wasn't even because they were so dominant. It was because we knew these guys did more than just help the Commanders dominate the 80s...they also represented what we absolutely LOVED about our team...that we constantly had unreconizable "no-names" that do all the dirty, unglamorous work and help the team keep winning and winning. You guys had players with nicknames like "Hollywood", we had guys with nicknames like "Diesel" and "Hogs". To most Skins fans, the Cowboys had "sexy" players...the Commanders had "average joe" players. The contrast couldn't have been more obvious if it were actually done so purposefully.

Back after the Skins went 14-2 and won the Super Bowl, Matt Millen said that that Skins team had more "7's" on the team than any team he had ever been on or seen. His point? That while most successful teams have future HOF'ers on the roster to help fuel their success, the Skins had a bunch of average to slightly above-average guys making up their team...and they were succeeding brilliantly with them.

THAT is what most Skins fans have loved about their team year after year...and it's just 180 degree opposite of the arrogant "star-driven" roster of the Cowboys. Skins fans saw their team win with players nobody else could win with...while in the Cowboys they saw a roster than anyone could win with. Heck, Jerruh said so himself lol...

We love our history of overachievers, and champion them.

It's one HUGE reason why so many Skins fans (much as you may want to think otherwise) despise Snyder's approach towards obtaining players over the last 10 years...we do NOT want to become a team full of "name" players. It's a HUGE reason why we despised the idea of Deion Sanders being added to the team...he abso-freakin-lutely symbolized the arrogance and "sexy" household name player that we always used to associate with the Cowboys. His talent level was irrelevant...we just did not want to become some nauseating version of the Cowboys. While free agency has unfortunately made acquiring an occasional "star" players pretty mucn unavoidable, we still feared losing our identity as a team and franchise, and worse looking like the pathetic Cowboys. For most Skins fans that would be worse than losing. I know you're gonna swear that's not the case, but if you actually surrounded yourself with Skins fans on a daily basis and talked with them about the team, you'd see just how accurate my portrayal is...because believe me, I do surround myself with Commanders fan on a daily basis and talk with them...and happily so lol...

So, yeah, you just keep throwing out all the stats you can look up and make the claim that us Skins fans are merely jealous of having to "live in the shadow" of the Cowboys lol...but just remember the old saying "Stats don't tell the whole story". By denying everything else, all it does it continue proving that the arrogance we detect from your franchise and your fan base is alive and well, and our utter hatred of everything Dallas-connected should continue to be alive and well, too. You may "study" the Commanders' history...but I lived through it. And considering how you also said you "study" the Cowboys and "knew" that nobody picked the Cowboys to go to the Super Bowl in 2006 or 2007, you might need to go to take a few night courses when it comes to both the Commanders and their fans lol ...

 

[DFWJC]

Yeah, it's lunacy. Building through successful drafts is the best long term way to stay competitive.

 

[Califan007]

Your like a little kid who wanders into someones house and starts crying that there's no bathroom in front of a closed bathroom door demanding someone open it for you to prove it's there, even though you're fully capable of doing it your self.

The "proof" you're looking for is right here on this very site if you want to see it, look around or use search function, prove me wrong if you're so obsessed with proof, i honestly don't care enough to indulge you

You can't even find ONE post, can you? lol...I have not seen any posts from Skins fans talking about how great the team will be this year, while you've apparently seen them again and again. Afterall, you said "It's cute how every offseason Skins fans come here to tell us how great they are."...So where are all these Skins fans who have come over here this offseason and are gloating about how "great" the Skins will be? Since I don't read nearly as many threads as you do (I don't come over here hardly at all), point some out. Should be easy for you, since apparently there are a bunch to choose from.

 

[Ren]

You can't even find ONE post, can you? lol...I have not seen any posts from Skins fans talking about how great the team will be this year, while you've apparently seen them again and again. Afterall, you said "It's cute how every offseason Skins fans come here to tell us how great they are."...So where are all these Skins fans who have come over here this offseason and are gloating about how "great" the Skins will be? Since I don't read nearly as many threads as you do (I don't come over here hardly at all), point some out. Should be easy for you, since apparently there are a bunch to choose from.

You're spending an awful lot of time here these days (hardly surprising since it's the offseason ) so why can't you look around your self?
You admit you don't read the forums much and have little to no idea what here yet you have the nerve to tell me what not on them...

Typical delusional Skins fan, only seeing what you wanna see

 

[Califan007]

You're spending an awful lot of time here these days (hardly surprising since it's the offseason ) so why can't you look around your self?
You admit you don't read the forums much and have little to no idea what here yet you have the nerve to tell me what not on them...

Typical delusional Skins fan, only seeing what you wanna see

You're not winning the perception battle, you DO realize that, right? lol

Since you DO spend a lot more time here than I do and since you DO say Skins fans are once again over here claiming that their team will be "great" this season, can you at least point me to a thread I can read that contains such posts? lol...It can't be that hard.

 

[Mansta54]

You're not winning the perception battle, you DO realize that, right? lol

Since you DO spend a lot more time here than I do and since you DO say Skins fans are once again over here claiming that their team will be "great" this season, can you at least point me to a thread I can read that contains such posts? lol...It can't be that hard.

SKINS SUCK!!!

 

[casmith07]

but just remember the old saying "Stats don't tell the whole story".

Well, you're going to have to enlighten all of us on what tells the "whole story", then, because the NFL hasn't ever handed out a trophy for style points (which you'd still lose to us) in 90 years of operation.

 

[Califan007]

SKINS SUCK!!!

Is that the title of the thread? lol...

 

[Califan007]

Well, you're going to have to enlighten all of us on what tells the "whole story", then, because the NFL hasn't ever handed out a trophy for style points (which you'd still lose to us) in 90 years of operation.

It depends on what story you want to be enlightened on...the story Hostile and I were talking about was the one where Commanders fans hate the Cowboys and their fans because we hate "living in their shadow". I just enlightened you up above on why stats don't begin to explain the feelings most Skins fans have towards Dallas and why that perception is 100% myth.

 

[casmith07]

It depends on what story you want to be enlightened on...the story Hostile and I were talking about was the one where Commanders fans hate the Cowboys and their fans because we hate "living in their shadow". I just enlightened you up above on why stats don't begin to explain the feelings most Skins fans have towards Dallas and why that perception is 100% myth.

Oh, I thought it was just a story about how the Commanders are in the Cowboys' shadow, and none of that extra added mustard that you put on it.

There is no perception to that. The Dallas Cowboys are clearly the better team and better franchise.