Anybody not think this is coaching?

[Picksix]

So was New Orleans D was last year. In fact, they their D was the worst in the league last year. So now that they have Rob that turned that D around. Which proves that is not talent that turns teams around. Its coaching.

Garrett is nothing more than an average coach. He won't turn any team around despite talent. We can have all the talent in the world but we will still get mediocre results. Thats why you need a good coach that knows what his doing. Garrett doesn't know what his doing. He is in over his head.

I see your point and agree to an extent, but I think having Sean Payton and an aggressive offense helps the defense. Spagnolu had great defenses in NYG, but was terrible last year in NO, without Payton. Why? Was spas overrated in NY? Was he put in a position to fail last year without Payton? Why was Rob so poor last year with the cowboys and so good this year with saints? I dont know.

 

[ConstantReboot]

I see your point and agree to an extent, but I think having Sean Payton and an aggressive offense helps the defense. Spagnolu had great defenses in NYG, but was terrible last year in NO, without Payton. Why? Was spas overrated in NY? Was he put in a position to fail last year without Payton? Why was Rob so poor last year with the cowboys and so good this year with saints? I dont know.

I don't think Rob did a bad job for the Cowboys. He did what he could with all of the injuries. Coaching can only bring you so far. Honestly, I think he was unfairly vilified for taking a bunch of street guys and turning them into football players. Its the same thing with Kiffin but only thing worst, since our best player Ware is out.

Maybe Rob just fits NO. Maybe the NO defense is really talented but they didn't play up to their potential since Payton wasn't there as coach - so they slacked. Who knows. But you can't deny it. Rob is making play better than last years team. You have to give credit where its due.

 

[BAT]

I don't think it's coaching, it's a lack of talent

Wade Phillips took almost exactly the same personnel and won 2 division titles in 3 seasons, equaled the most wins in team history and took the team to the second round of the playoffs (which even Parcells was unable to do) while Garrett can't even break .500. 3 straight seasons of coaching a 3rd place team in NFCE. Last 2 seasons all he has to do is win last game and is in post season.

 

[NickZepp]

Phillips didn't have the same personnel particularly on defense. Defenses were much more experienced and overall more talented and it's not even close. But they were better coached which is a credit to Wade Phillips. Lane Kiffin and that defensive staff look clueless against today';s NFL game. Our offense has been good enough. But the defense is giving up more than 30 almost every week.

 

[Ren]

Phillips didn't have the same personnel particularly on defense. Defenses were much more experienced and overall more talented and it's not even close. But they were better coached which is a credit to Wade Phillips. Lane Kiffin and that defensive staff look clueless against today';s NFL game. Our offense has been good enough. But the defense is giving up more than 30 almost every week.

What team have you been watching, take away the Rams and Broncos games and our offense has looked terrible, we had something like 80 total yards going into the 4th QTR on Sunday and we couldn't take advantage of 4 turnovers, our offense has been pretty far from good enough

 

[Ren]

There are two reasonable explanations.

Injuries is one. Both defenses are/were bad and have this in common,

The fact that Kiffin was really not an upgrade at this stage in his life is the other.

And while we can pretend that Ryan's success in New Orleans is "talent", care to explain where it is decidedly better, talent-wise?

That's too easy, just look at our DL and safeties then theirs

 

[NickZepp]

I don't think Rob did a bad job for the Cowboys. He did what he could with all of the injuries. Coaching can only bring you so far. Honestly, I think he was unfairly vilified for taking a bunch of street guys and turning them into football players. Its the same thing with Kiffin but only thing worst, since our best player Ware is out.

Maybe Rob just fits NO. Maybe the NO defense is really talented but they didn't play up to their potential since Payton wasn't there as coach - so they slacked. Who knows. But you can't deny it. Rob is making play better than last years team. You have to give credit where its due.

I think this might be true in retrospect. Didn't think so at the time. Rob Ryan unfairly got fired looking back. But it's not like the defense was that good in his entire tenure here.

 

[jobberone]

Well, all I can do sometime is smile because something is fundamentally wrong with this team.

Yes. It's called we are still paying the price for poor cap management/player retention since it was started, poor player acquisition remotely, more than our share of injuries primarily on defense presently and the Curse of the Root.

 

[Alexander]

Not sure it's only coaching. I think it's a culture. Dez is the first to openly express that he's fed up with it. Twenty years of mediocrity? We've had good enough talent to win since Parcells left and we haven't. It's definitely the culture and it starts at Jerry Jones.

There is a good deal of truth to this. When the organizational culture is mainly to remain relevant, it is going to seep down to the players eventually.

Overall, there is not enough fear of failure because what is defined as successful is way off.

 

[Reality]

Overall, there is not enough fear of failure because what is defined as successful is way off.

I agree with this completely. After 17 years of average to below average results, this team's definition of a successful season has dropped so low that it makes 8-8 seem like an "almost there milestone" every year. Let's face it, a 9-7 season would be treated as an "improvement" by Jerry Jones as well as a "something to build on" speech that would be regurgitated throughout the off-season in an effort to make 2014 "THE" year.

/reality

 

[Alexander]

I agree with this completely. After 17 years of average to below average results, this team's definition of a successful season has dropped so low that it makes 8-8 seem like an "almost there milestone" every year. Let's face it, a 9-7 season would be treated as an "improvement" by Jerry Jones as well as a "something to build on" speech that would be regurgitated throughout the off-season in an effort to make 2014 "THE" year.

/reality

A 9-7 season and a playoff appearance would just provide him what he has been talking about for the last three years, which is to be like the Giants or Ravens be "in it until the end" and just make it and hope a switch goes on for a Super Bowl run.

 

[visionary]

People (including the joneses) are just hoping and praying that somehow, someway, we catch lightning in a bottle so they can justify their failed process, can justify their 'faith'

Watch jerry and many of these fans on this board come here after an 8-8 or 9-7 season where we make the playoffs in a putrid division and are 1 and done, pump their chest and talk about how the team is headed in the right direction, how we need to believe, how they never lost faith and always believed

this year, next year, the year after that (yeah BTW i think jason is here for at least 2 more years), whenever that happens, they will be preening and cooing all over the place and congratulating themselves and their fandom

of course, all the while ignoring the fact that the next year and the year after that, we will continue to be mediocre, under the watchful eyes of jerry, stephen, and jason

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I don't like where our offense is schematically. Although watching All-22, Romo was lousy against the Lions and was as big of a contributor to the loss as anybody.

Defensively, we keep getting injuries. We have 4 D-Linemen out and we were using a UDFA to start at safety.

I tend to believe our problems are mostly with the offense and the schematics. We throw the ball so much that we don't take much time off the clock. This leaves our defense on the field longer and historically, defensive players are more than twice as likely to get injured than offensive players. So by leaving them on the field longer, it's only going to create more likelihood of getting injured.

Obviously, you have to pass the ball well in order to win in this league. But the running game has important attributes to it as well like setting up the passing game to make things easier, to make converting 3rd and short easier to keep the chains moving and to keep your own defense off the field while being able to score. And it really seems to hurt us when we play on the road. On the road the passing game is more difficult to execute between crowd noise, playing outdoors, playing on grass, etc.

To me, if you have a good running game, a good pass receiving Tight End and a good pass defense; you're likely to go to the playoffs because it's something that can make even mediocre QB's look good. In fact, it's basically how Parcells tried to set up every team he coached (and that's why it worked). We have the TE. The pass defense is suspect and the running game is putrid.

But as usual, I think it's a combination of things between poor coaching, poor schematics, and lack of talent in certain areas.




YR

 

[BlueStar22]

I don't like where our offense is schematically. Although watching All-22, Romo was lousy against the Lions and was as big of a contributor to the loss as anybody.

Defensively, we keep getting injuries. We have 4 D-Linemen out and we were using a UDFA to start at safety.

I tend to believe our problems are mostly with the offense and the schematics. We throw the ball so much that we don't take much time off the clock. This leaves our defense on the field longer and historically, defensive players are more than twice as likely to get injured than offensive players. So by leaving them on the field longer, it's only going to create more likelihood of getting injured.

Obviously, you have to pass the ball well in order to win in this league. But the running game has important attributes to it as well like setting up the passing game to make things easier, to make converting 3rd and short easier to keep the chains moving and to keep your own defense off the field while being able to score. And it really seems to hurt us when we play on the road. On the road the passing game is more difficult to execute between crowd noise, playing outdoors, playing on grass, etc.

To me, if you have a good running game, a good pass receiving Tight End and a good pass defense; you're likely to go to the playoffs because it's something that can make even mediocre QB's look good. In fact, it's basically how Parcells tried to set up every team he coached (and that's why it worked). We have the TE. The pass defense is suspect and the running game is putrid.

But as usual, I think it's a combination of things between poor coaching, poor schematics, and lack of talent in certain areas.




YR

It seems Callahan is calling the plays no differently than what Garrett called them. Is Callahan really the playcaller? Doesn't look like it.

 

[CATCH17]

Hate to disagree but we do't. No team could go 11-5 with that DL and little running game.

We should have easily gone 11-5 even with this DL.

We should be no worse than a 2 loss team right now as well.

Every single team is going to have a unit that struggles. The Saints DL is worse than ours and they could easily go 11-5. You know why? They play to win instead of not to lose.

BTW, only the Cowboys would make Romo the 2nd highest paid QB in history and make him a game manager most weeks.

 

[visionary]

It seems Callahan is calling the plays no differently than what Garrett called them. Is Callahan really the playcaller? Doesn't look like it.

when the offense is crap, does it matter which play you call from it or who calls the play?
it is still the "garrett offense"

 

[Alexander]

It seems Callahan is calling the plays no differently than what Garrett called them. Is Callahan really the playcaller? Doesn't look like it.

The offensive design is still Garrett.

 

[CATCH17]

People (including the joneses) are just hoping and praying that somehow, someway, we catch lightning in a bottle so they can justify their failed process, can justify their 'faith'

That is all we can do is hope to catch lightning in a bottle.


If this was European football Garrett would've been fired a long time ago.

There is not enough pressure here to win. Just be mediocre and not stink up the place too bad and it's considered a success.

I hate our current standard and I can't believe it's allowed by ownership.

 

[Seven]

We have an outdated defensive scheme and and outdated offensive scheme.

It really is that simple.

Add to it that this group still gets the penalties at the worst possible times, shoots itself in the foot AND continues to collapse at the end of games. I won't even spew the mediocre 8-8 seasons schpiel. Nothing has really changed..........in quite some time.

Also......I'm begining to believe Garrett thinks he invented football.

 

[PA Cowboy Fan]

Stop it!!! everyone that thinks this just stop it!!! Coaching is not the problem you could say defensive coord. But coaching is not the problem. It is the palyers. The patriots execute. Garrett is building this team, but he needs to be given the time and patience to fiinish, he is still cleaning out the rif raf that Parcells and Phillips left, the culture those guys Ieft. The depth that people are always complaining that we need on defense well we have it, they are starters, and they getting primed a couple may become starters but if we keep them,they will be the rotational guys need. yeah, the defense is getting hammered but they are being forged into a weapon of destruction, Sean Lee and Hatcher will not let them quit.

People watch this team.

How much time should we give him? 5 or 10 years? I see teams that had worse talent then we did when Garrett took over and they're playoff teams now.