Big Ben in King's MVP watch but not Romo

THUMPER

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Pittman4Two;2940686 said:
Color me unimpressed with Ben Roethlisberger.

Still don't see how people are gushing over him other than he has two rings. Maybe I'm missing something.

You must have missed the part where he plays defense. :rolleyes:

Come on man, I don't see how anyone can not think of Big Ben as the greatest two-way player since Chuck Bednarik. He is their sack-leader and has led the team in tackles and INTs for years now. Didn't you see him?

He also punts and kicks FGs. The guy is simply the greatest player in Stealers history!!!

OK [/sarcasm] :D
 

THUMPER

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Phrozen Phil;2940747 said:
Picking Brees vs Romo at this point after one game is a bit premature. Both players had solid games. Brees played a team that didn't win a game all of last year, but he did his job very well. Six touchdowns is an accomplishment that's worthy. Romo had his challenges, but he overcame them against opposition that was a bit of an enigma. Brees faces tough opposition next week, as does Romo. Maybe we'll know more about Tony's abolity to deal with a strong D after next week. As much as I was looking forward to the first game of the season, I'm REALLY looking forward to the next game.

I agree, good points. I am looking forward to next week vs the Giants.
 

DFWJC

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Kilyin;2940493 said:
Nope, Romo is number 1 currently with a 140.6.

Brees is at 137.0

I think it's the 13.1 yards per pass that puts Romo at the top. Brees also threw an int.
Brees had a pick, I think. Also, the yards per pass...as you said...was part of it. Either way, I think Brees was off-the-charts great.

As for Big Ben. face it, the media loves the guy and he is pretty good. The two SB rings kind of help with the overall perception. :D I personally think Romo is better, but it's splitting hairs at this point.
 

bbgun

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What a dork. Who poses for a photo like this?

235-915-peter-king-450x600.jpg
 

TNCowboy

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THUMPER;2940742 said:
I agree with most of what you are saying.

IMO, TD% for a QB is the #1 stat to measure a QB by. Scoring TDs is the primary goal of the offense, above yardage, TOP, turnovers, or anything else.

You win games by scoring more points than your opponent, period! Not to say that those other things do not factor into the equation, but if TD% is not the top of the list then the list is flawed because that is the point of playing the game.

Aikman is an anomaly in that he was a great QB who threw relatively few TDs. 15 of the top-29 QBs with the highest TD% are in the HoF. 3 of those top-29 are still playing and therefore not eligible (Romo, Peyton Manning, & Philip Rivers) so that is 15 out of 26 eligible are in. That tells me that TD% is a very telling stat for a QB.

A turnover, while a seriously negative play, does not always lead to points, a TD pass ALWAYS results in at least 6 points, without fail. :D

Obviously TD% is not the ONLY measure of a QB but it is the primary one INO. After that I would go with Yards per attempt, then turnovers, then Completion %, then wins, then sacks. I have my own rating system that takes a lot of factors into account but TD% has the highest weight in it.

You can throw more INTs, complete fewer passes, gain less yardage, and get sacked more often and STILL win the game. You cannot score fewer points and win, it's that simple.

In Aikman's case, we had a dominant running game and a RB who was money to score inside the 5 yard line. Emmitt is the all-time leader in rushing TDs for a reason. So Troy didn't need to throw a lot of TDs for us to win games, but he got us into scoring position a lot. The same can't be said of most QBs though so using Troy as an example is kind of stretching the point.
If you look at the career YPA listing, most of those guys that are from the modern era are HOFers, or some, like Romo, who may well be on their way to the HOF.
 

THUMPER

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Double Trouble;2940886 said:
If you look at the career YPA listing, most of those guys that are from the modern era are HOFers, or some, like Romo, who may well be on their way to the HOF.

That's true, that's why it comes next in my system.

I guess I am just reacting to people (not you necessarily) who disregard Romo's TDs and focus on his turnovers as if TDs were unimportant.
 

Hoofbite

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Pittman4Two;2940686 said:
Color me unimpressed with Ben Roethlisberger.

Still don't see how people are gushing over him other than he has two rings. Maybe I'm missing something.

Yeah, aside from the whole "winning" aspect, he sucks pretty hard.
 

THUMPER

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Hoofbite;2941115 said:
Yeah, aside from the whole "winning" aspect, he sucks pretty hard.

That explains why Peyton Manning is undefeated in his career!
 

CrazyCowboy

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Kilyin;2940493 said:
Nope, Romo is number 1 currently with a 140.6.

Brees is at 137.0

I think it's the 13.1 yards per pass that puts Romo at the top. Brees also threw an int.

You are correct........ROMO is in the lead rating wise.
 

kmd24

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Double Trouble;2940639 said:
There's no system anyone could devise which would give Brees a higher rating, unless they put a higher weight in touchdowns. I think Troy Aikman's career shows that TDs can be overrated as a measure of a QB's worth.

The only reason that Romo is ahead of Brees is that there is a cap on each category. Romo barely exceeded the cap in ypa, met the cap in int%, and was below the cap in TD% and comp%.

Brees was well above the cap in TD% but below the cap in all other categories.

If you removed the cap, Brees would be at 156.25 while Romo would be at 142.97.

It's just an artifact of a small sample size. In the long run, Brees will have some scoring drought, but his rating will not fall as much as Romo's will for a similar drought.

If Romo has a game where his ypa dips, he will see a similar effect, but it won't be as pronounced because he's only barely over the cap.

To illustrate, suppose both QB's go 20/30 0 TD's, 0 INT's, and 300 yards in their next outing. The resultant ratings would be Brees - 129.6 and Romo 120.

In short, Brees is really ahead of Romo even though the formula doesn't say so, kind of like how a runner can be ahead of another in the 400m even though he is behind coming out of the first curve.
 

TheRat

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Hoofbite;2941115 said:
Yeah, aside from the whole "winning" aspect, he sucks pretty hard.
Well I guess that makes Trent Dilfer all world then huh.
 

Nav22

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If Romo keeps up his stellar play, the media will have no choice but to pucker up and kiss his MVP-worthy behind. They can't attribute his success to T.O. anymore (while ripping T.O. for drops and being washed up).
 

The Quest for Six

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Kilyin;2940493 said:
Nope, Romo is number 1 currently with a 140.6.

Brees is at 137.0

I think it's the 13.1 yards per pass that puts Romo at the top. Brees also threw an int.


I'd take Bress over Romo anyday
 

The Quest for Six

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Nav22;2941716 said:
If Romo keeps up his stellar play, the media will have no choice but to pucker up and kiss his MVP-worthy behind. They can't attribute his success to T.O. anymore (while ripping T.O. for drops and being washed up).


Romo is over rated. I'd take ten Qb's over him.
 
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