BTB: Carpenter Play By Play

[BAT]

Not true at all. He was still dragging people down under Parcells.

And ad, I don't know. Maybe even Zach Thomas? But Bobby is no Zach, and I still think the expression is an oxymoron.

I hope he somehow turns it around but if they don't bite when they're puppies, they're probably not going to bite.

It went further back than that. Carpenter was a grab and drag tackler at OSU too. Some of the knocks on him coming into the draft was that he was not a physical player, not as in "smart and fast" but as in "did not relish contact".

 

[RoadRunner]

Carp is developing into a decent pass coverage linebacker, and I think we will start seeing him on the field more in obvious passing situations.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Not true at all. He was still dragging people down under Parcells.

And ad, I don't know. Maybe even Zach Thomas? But Bobby is no Zach, and I still think the expression is an oxymoron.

I hope he somehow turns it around but if they don't bite when they're puppies, they're probably not going to bite.

Like I said in his FIRST PRESEASON he lowered his shoulder and put a hit on the ball carrier that caused a fumble.

Apparently you're definition of being nonfinesse is different than mine. To me holding the point of attack is what makes a physical linebacker. What you're talking about is someone getting a running start, not getting blocked and then getting hit.

Carp did not shy away from the guards that were getting repeated shots at him. The only time he shied from contact is during a sweep play to the other side.

Now he lost 3/4 of those battles against guards and you can point to that as him not being 'physical'. OTOH, He literally had no help. Siavii was inconsistent, seaswright was below average and Anderson was horrible. Williams was overplaying everything running past plays and Butler was getting repeatedly sealed out or overplayed.

You use 'finesse' and 'physical' as if that is all that needs to be said to explain what is going on. Brady is physical because he hit someone when he was was a rookie and Carpenter is not because he hasnt that you can remember.

Neither can handle guards getting Free shots at them and both have had big hits their rookie season.

Also there is no video of Carp trying to avoid contact a la Jenkins from last year. If there was then it would be all over the place.

 

[Hoofbite]

Carpenter's rookie year in preseason he was taking on an olinemen was able to shed the block, lower his shoulder into the ball carrier and cause a fumble. Thats just off the top of my head.

You can talk about a term that Jerry used once all day long but at the endo of the day, Carp had no issues with physicality his first year. It was only once Stewart took over the defense that he turned 'soft.'

That seems pretty convenient.

I'm about as big of a Carp detractor as they come and I don't hide it at all. I think he's been a complete waste of space thus far and until he proves otherwise, I expect nothing more from him.

1st rounders don't need a defense team. If they have one, it's usually because they aren't living up to their billing.

You've posted three of these play-by-play accounts from BTB so far. Look at who the other two players are. This shouldn't even be a discussion for Carpenter right now. He should be a starter and should have his spot on lockdown but he isn't and he doesn't.

Thus far the Carp story has been pretty crappy. In fact, its been totally crappy.

Other than being a Cowboy, I can't see much of a reason for rooting for the guy. If he were a Commander this site would have daily laughs at how horrible he has been and how Dan Snyder wasted a 1st rounder on a guy who has had more face time on ESPN than he has on the field.

 

[Everlastingxxx]

I’ve rewatched the Raiders game some 3 or 4 times.

I have no doubt Carp can’t play in the NFL. Too Soft. Plain and simple. We may get by with him as a nickle LB...but at some point id rather have Sensabaugh or Hamlin covering than Carp.

If i am wrong, then i will rejoice with you.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

I think Wade's at the point where he's like, "screw it, he's playing"

 

[RS12]

I’ve rewatched the Raiders game some 3 or 4 times.

I have no doubt Carp can’t play in the NFL. Too Soft. Plain and simple. We may get by with him as a nickle LB...but at some point id rather have Sensabaugh or Hamlin covering than Carp.

If i am wrong, then i will rejoice with you.

Where were you early in the day when the pom pom squad was on the loose?:laugh2:

 

[LeonDixson]

Sounds like Carps issues he sheding blocks. A major weakness for a linebacker, which is why he will only play on passing downs in the nickel defense. On most plays, he shouldn't have a guard hitting him. That is an issue with the dline not eating olinemen.

Right on the money. That's exactly the impression I got reading the play-by-play. Good coverage, made some tackles but can't get off of blocks.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

We simply disagree, Fuz.

I hope you're right and I'm wrong, though.

 

[Apollo Creed]

You're high if you think Bobby Carptenter is going to be anything more than an average LBer in this league. He'll be lucky to even be that. I just think he was in a very good situation, playing with a very overhyped school, in a very mediocre conference.

 

[Quarterback Coach]

Sounds like Carps issues he sheding blocks. A major weakness for a linebacker, which is why he will only play on passing downs in the nickel defense. On most plays, he shouldn't have a guard hitting him. That is an issue with the dline not eating olinemen.

So this is good...we have a first round nickel package linebacker...nice...oh and he is afraid of contact but that is because people are bigger than him...solid...

I can sum it up with slightly less verbage...barbie sucks.

 

[Fletch]

So this is good...we have a first round nickel package linebacker...nice...oh and he is afraid of contact but that is because people are bigger than him...solid...

I can sum it up with slightly less verbage...barbie sucks.

One preseason game where he is getting some starting reps and he sucks? Let him find his groove. People hated on Bradie for the longest and he finally came around.

I think Carpenter can be a very productive LBer for us. I've got your back Carp!

He's going to prove a lot of you wrong, and then what?

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

We simply disagree, Fuz.

I hope you're right and I'm wrong, though.

True dat. May we win many games this year.

 

[SMCowboy]

That seems pretty convenient.

I'm about as big of a Carp detractor as they come and I don't hide it at all. I think he's been a complete waste of space thus far and until he proves otherwise, I expect nothing more from him.

1st rounders don't need a defense team. If they have one, it's usually because they aren't living up to their billing.

You've posted three of these play-by-play accounts from BTB so far. Look at who the other two players are. This shouldn't even be a discussion for Carpenter right now. He should be a starter and should have his spot on lockdown but he isn't and he doesn't.

Thus far the Carp story has been pretty crappy. In fact, its been totally crappy.

Other than being a Cowboy, I can't see much of a reason for rooting for the guy. If he were a Commander this site would have daily laughs at how horrible he has been and how Dan Snyder wasted a 1st rounder on a guy who has had more face time on ESPN than he has on the field.

There seems to be the disconnect. My understanding is that noone is saying that he played like a 1st round DP, or that he is ready to or ever will be a All Pro LB in the NFL, atleast based on the Raiders game.

But, what some people are saying is forget about the fact that Carpenter was a 1st round DP, that has not and most likely never will live up to his 1st round status. That does not mean that he can not be a solid backup LB, and good nickle LB for us, that thus an asset to the team.

No Bobby Carpenter is not the most physical LB we have, but I believe that while he would still not have looked great, his play would have looked better had he had Ratliff, Spears, and Igor in front of him, and Brady James, Spencer and Ware along side him, than he did with the entire second string, and Butler/Williams running themselves out of most of the plays.

 

[InmanRoshi]

I think its pretty evident that Carpenter is what he is. What I find odd is so much handwringing and ridicule over Carpenter, yet Anthony Spencer in comparison gets a free pass and has accomplished equally as much nothing coming into his 3rd year in the league and Carpenter last year. I mean, at least I can point to a stellar game from Carpenter's rookie year from the Seattle playoff game ... I can't point to a memorable Anthony Spencer game, other than when he was pancaked on those two long Raven touchdowns in maybe the most embarassing choke in franchise history.

I find it much more troubleing and worrisome that we're asking a guy coming off a 1.5 sack season to be a 3 down player as the the starting SOLB, with absolutely no depth behind him to challenge him, than I am about Carpenter playing nickel LB as a pass coverage. It's not like Carpenter has huge shoes to fill left from Kevin Burnett.

 

[BAT]

No Bobby Carpenter is not the most physical LB we have, but I believe that while he would still not have looked great, his play would have looked better had he had Ratliff, Spears, and Igor in front of him, and Brady James, Spencer and Ware along side him, than he did with the entire second string, and Butler/Williams running themselves out of most of the plays.

Of course he would look better running w/the second team .... or his weaknesses may become more pronounced. In either case, Carp would not look better than Brooking. Brooking made more plays in his limited time than Carp did in 3 quarters.

And I also agree w/Inman, Spencer has yet to prove he is an upgrade over Ellis. I don't see what Wade, Jerry and all his teammates & coaches have been raving about. Yes, his run D is good (Witten has said he was 'unblockable' at times) but it does not always translate to the field. Don't get me started w/his pass rush either.

In any event, I will root for them when they get on the field, the Cowboys need both of them to produce for them to get anywhere this season.

 

[RealCowboyfan]

http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2009/...r-play-by-play

One thing I want to point to out is that on most of the run plays here Carp was not 'physical' enough was because he had a guard weighing 50+ more pounds than him on him. The defensive line was not doing diddly to keep the interior oline from getting to the second level. Time after time you see guard in these listings.

James is supposedly extremely physical but I remember when he first started that we couldn't keep guards off of him and he was a liability in the run game. Shane Andrews made him his ***** that year.

Can you say nickel linebacker... He can blitz and cover. That's it.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Can you say nickel linebacker... He can blitz and cover. That's it.

How about you rewatch the tape and look to see how Dixon and to a lesser extent Hatcher who were the DE in front of him and Butler and Williams who were the LBers to either side of him did.

They were absolutely awful and as a result Carp didn't have to step into the hole because the hole was coming to him with a guard to boot.

I find people hilarious. First hes not physical and he shies away from contact. He tries to run around blockers and the like. Now, he cannot shed blocks.

I just remember the end of his rookie year. He had no issues driving TE into the backfield or sealing the edge at SOLB. Oh, he cannot have dealt with horrible coaching, Stewart, and having to play with a putrid dline. Nope, he forgot how to play football after his rookie season.

 

[SMCowboy]

Of course he would look better running w/the second team .... or his weaknesses may become more pronounced. In either case, Carp would not look better than Brooking. Brooking made more plays in his limited time than Carp did in 3 quarters.

And I also agree w/Inman, Spencer has yet to prove he is an upgrade over Ellis. I don't see what Wade, Jerry and all his teammates & coaches have been raving about. Yes, his run D is good (Witten has said he was 'unblockable' at times) but it does not always translate to the field. Don't get me started w/his pass rush either.

In any event, I will root for them when they get on the field, the Cowboys need both of them to produce for them to get anywhere this season.

No where did I say that he would look better that Keith Brooking at MLB. I said that Carpenter would look better than he did with the second string, because he would have actually had some help.

In no way do I want Carpenter starting over Brooking. But, what I am saying is if he had to fill in for Brooking due to an injury, he could hold his own and be a decent not good, but decent backup LB.

Do I expect more out of a first round DP than to be a decent backup LB and a nickle LB? Absolutely. But, that is behind us, and I am not going to hate Bobby Carpenter because Bill Parcells fell in love with the son of one of his ex players and drafted him to early because of it.

 

[gimmesix]

First, your NT is supposed to eat two of them right off the bat. (If not, you need a new NT) If you've got a good DE, he too can eat two.

I didn't say they never face OL. Thats the reason 3-4 LBs are larger than 4-3 LBers. Well, thats not always the case in Wade's defense.

The way the 3-4 is designed, the strongside inside linebacker (Bradie James' position) has to take on a lineman on most plays, while the weakside inside linebacker is more free to make plays.

I believe Carp spent most of his playing time in the regular defense at SILB because we lack a true backup to James. He's better suited for the WILB spot, which is his regular position in this defense.