BTB/Vela: Hiding in Plain Sight? On the Garrett/T.O. Churn

[wileedog]

No, it isn't.

It's the opposite in fact.

If Garrett doens't get his way he'll run away?

Doesn't scream 'leader' to me.

More like 'coward'.

But since you're on an anti-Owens agenda, you'll see things they way you want to.

Coward because he doesn't want to work with an narcissistic, combative, selfish ego-maniac who falls asleep in meetings and spends most of his time complaining to anyone who will listen what a terrible job he is doing?

Given that Garret has absolutely positively no power over TO whatsover - Jerry is certiainly never going to let him bench TO - what exactly would you have him do? Make funny faces at him?

I guess he could continue to be a puppet like Wade and let Jerry and TO walk all over him though. That would be courageous.

 

[fanfromvirginia]

No, it isn't.

It's the opposite in fact.

If Garrett doens't get his way he'll run away?

Doesn't scream 'leader' to me.

More like 'coward'.

But since you're on an anti-Owens agenda, you'll see things they way you want to.

It's leadership if he thinks he can best do his job as OC without TO.

 

[Stash]

Coward because he doesn't want to work with an narcissistic, combative, selfish ego-maniac who falls asleep in meetings and spends most of his time complaining to anyone who will listen what a terrible job he is doing?

Given that Garret has absolutely positively no power over TO whatsover - Jerry is certiainly never going to let him bench TO - what exactly would you have him do? Make funny faces at him?

I guess he could continue to be a puppet like Wade and let Jerry and TO walk all over him though. That would be courageous.

At least that would show some guts, unlike his current crybaby tactics.

Coaches are paid to deal with players and that's what Garrett needs to do.

And if you think that Owens couldn't be disciplined if his behavior actually warranted it, I think your off-base.

And even if it were true, then it's a fundamental flaw in how Jerry Jones runs his team - and that should be why Garrett would leave, not over one player. His problem would be with Jones, not Owens.

Garrett is this team's 'golden boy' and the 'head coach in waiting' not to mention the highest paid coordinator in the league. If you think he has no power, influence, or control I think you're sadly mistaken.

But if he doesn't have the guts to deal with a player rather than running away, he lacks the key ingredient necesary to be a coach anyway and this team would be better off without him.

 

[Stash]

It's leadership if he thinks he can best do his job as OC without TO.

'Leaders' don't run.

 

[rangers71]

Very good article. Some very good points. Also I hope Garrett stays. I am one of the few that thinks he will be a good head coach and if he does that elsewhere get ready to duck while on this message board.

 

[wileedog]

Coaches are paid to deal with players and that's what Garrett needs to do.

How do you know he hasn't? Has TO ever listened to a coach he had 'written off' the way he has Garret ever in his entire carer?

For all you know Garret has had several talks, arguments, etc with him and TO has blown him off like every other authority figure that doesn't cater to him.

And if you think that Owens couldn't be disciplined if his behavior actually warranted it, I think your off-base.

Really? Because on just about any other team in the league a player who gave interview after interview calling out his OC would be disciplined. If nothing else he would be told to shut up.

Get any whif of anything happening to TO after the Deon interview? Me neither.

And even if it were true, then it's a fundamental flaw in how Jerry Jones runs his team - and that should be why Garrett would leave, not over one player. His problem would be with Jones, not Owens.

Maybe that is the change Garret is really looking for though. Maybe its not really about TO, its about Jerry backing his coaches over his players.

For Garrett, who has already turned down HC offers, maybe this is testing the waters to see how much influence he will really have here as a coach. Becaue as a HC, you absolutely have to have the power to cut a player you don't want.

I don't think we know the whole story, but again I think Garret has already tried his "come to Jesus" with TO and got laughed at, and he wants to make sure he has the authority to really control the locker if he takes over here eventually. Not just be another bobblehead like Wade.

 

[khiladi]

Jason Garrett sucks and even he knows TO is his bread-and-butter, just like Romo. Everybody says this offense forces the ball to TO. If they were forcing the ball to TO against Garrett, then how does that prove Garrett is a leader? People are ridiculous if they think Garrett has no hand in trying to egt the ball to TO. Further, why would Roy Williams even complain about not getting the ball enough, andin this context, point fingers at Garrett, not TO? How many times did you hear him say that he knows this offense and is waiting for the ball. He surely wasn't pointing fingers at TO.Logic fails when it comes to the Garrett supporters. There is no evidence that Garrett isn't the problem. Every player has pretty much openly questioned his schemes, including the franchise QB, Tony Romo.

 

[Stash]

How do you know he hasn't? Has TO ever listened to a coach he had 'written off' the way he has Garret ever in his entire carer?

For all you know Garret has had several talks, arguments, etc with him and TO has blown him off like every other authority figure that doesn't cater to him.

The point is that we don't know what has or hasn't happened behind closed doors, but those that want to be rid of Owens assume the worst.

If what you say has happened, there should be no debate and Owens should be gone. And if he isn't, that a problem with the way Jerry Jones handles his team - plain and simple. But there should be no 'me or him' ultimatum from Garrett. He should have a problem with how Jones runs his team and simply not want to work for him.

Really? Because on just about any other team in the league a player who gave interview after interview calling out his OC would be disciplined. If nothing else he would be told to shut up.

Get any whif of anything happening to TO after the Deon interview? Me neither.

I'd really like to see those quotes you're referring to because up to this point, I haven't seen the supposedly 'terrible things' that Owens had to say. If you could post them I would honestly appreciate it.

And if discipline was warranted and not administered, whose fault is that? Owens for acting up? I don't think so. I'd place more blame on an organization that was either unable or unwilling to do it. Because even if you released Owens, there would be no team discipline.

Maybe that is the change Garret is really looking for though. Maybe its not really about TO, its about Jerry backing his coaches over his players.

For Garrett, who has already turned down HC offers, maybe this is testing the waters to see how much influence he will really have here as a coach. Becaue as a HC, you absolutely have to have the power to cut a player you don't want.

I don't think we know the whole story, but again I think Garret has already tried his "come to Jesus" with TO and got laughed at, and he wants to make sure he has the authority to really control the locker if he takes over here eventually. Not just be another bobblehead like Wade.

If that's the case, an ultimatum isn't the way to do it. Because even with Owens gone, the next player with a problem would walk all over the staff too. And if Garrett doesn't want to work for Jones, he should simply come out and say it - or resign.

I think there's a better, more honest, upfront way to deal with it.

If Garrett wants to discipline Owens, I think it's well within his power to do so. And if it's not, this isn't a place he would want to work in anyway.

But what kind of coach or leader would let a problem child player run him off from his dream job?

 

[Meat-O-Rama]

Nice article, but we're not pining just for a Super Bowl win. We just want a playoff win to start with. Had this team gone as far as the NFC Championship game and lost, we'd all feel like the team is on the right track. Philly is splaying in it's 5th Conference Championship game in 8 years. I'd take that in a heartbeat, so don't tell me 'Real Football Guys' aren't all that important based solely on the number of rings they've earned. you don't get to the Super Bowl without first winning playoff games, and this team has done neither.

 

[TNCowboy]

Vela's overlooking a key fact: Polian, Fisher, etc have kept their teams perennially in contention.

Since Jimmy Johnson left, Jerry Jones has been unable to do that. To try to equate anything going on with Dallas with the success of those other guys is laughable.

 

[jobberone]

Vela's overlooking a key fact: Polian, Fisher, etc have kept their teams perennially in contention.

Since Jimmy Johnson left, Jerry Jones has been unable to do that. To try to equate anything going on with Dallas with the success of those other guys is laughable.

Well not perenially but more often than we do and with more playoff wins. However, would you rather have 3 SBs in 20 years or 1?

I understand his argument and it does give Jerry the credit he deserves. Both ways. More SBs and more less than satisfactory seasons.

 

[zeromaster]

Has Garrett even talked to Owens on the sidelines during a game? What were fans' impressions of the exchange?

Let's assume that Owens is gone then. Garrett had better produce something closer to 2007 than 2008 in offensive game plans in 2009 or we'll be back to having the same arguments sans Owens.

Oh right, production; it's all on the players. Then what are the coaches for?

 

[wileedog]

But what kind of coach or leader would let a problem child player run him off from his dream job?

All good points Stash - honestly I think we need to know more about what has really happened behind the scenes to make a true judgement.

But I will say this analogy isn't entirely accurate - TO is not just a 'problem child', he is a $9M/year star, media magnet who has a lot of influence with players in the clubhouse.

First thing Bill Parcells did when he walked in the door was show Emmit Smith the way out (which I'm sure Jerry was aghast at). He didn't do that because he thought Dookie Stick Hambrick was a better player, even at that point in Emmits career. He did it because he knew Emmit was a guy who had a lot of influence with the players, and was probably not going to buy into what Parcells was selling.

Sometimes there are people you just can't work with, and no amount of 'leadership' is going to change that. And when those guys can influence other players too, you cut ties.

 

[Stash]

All good points Stash - honestly I think we need to know more about what has really happened behind the scenes to make a true judgement.

No doubt. Amazing how much 'uncredited' information we get and yet nobody is saying anything 'on the record'.

But I will say this analogy isn't entirely accurate - TO is not just a 'problem child', he is a $9M/year star, media magnet who has a lot of influence with players in the clubhouse.

He only has a smuch influence with the players as they let him have. It's monkey-see monkey-do. When they see other players get away with something, they'll do it too. But I've never gotten the impression that Owens was calculating to divide a locker room or rally players to his cause. They're not sheep, they can think for themselves.

First thing Bill Parcells did when he walked in the door was show Emmit Smith the way out (which I'm sure Jerry was aghast at). He didn't do that because he thought Dookie Stick Hambrick was a better player, even at that point in Emmits career. He did it because he knew Emmit was a guy who had a lot of influence with the players, and was probably not going to buy into what Parcells was selling.

Notice Parcells had the power and the guts to do that? Speaks more to Jerry's position of control more than it does to Emmitt the player, right?

Sometimes there are people you just can't work with, and no amount of 'leadership' is going to change that. And when those guys can influence other players too, you cut ties.

And if it's as bad as some think, I honestly don't have a problem with cutting him. But again, I haven't seen these despicable quotes that no one can seem to produce for me.

I also give Owens no credit for influencing grown men to do things they wouldn't normally do.

Players will do as much as coaches and ownership allow them to do.

That's where I feel the true issue lies.

Cut Owens today and you'll have another issue tomorrow.

 

[TNCowboy]

Well not perenially but more often than we do and with more playoff wins. However, would you rather have 3 SBs in 20 years or 1?

I understand his argument and it does give Jerry the credit he deserves. Both ways. More SBs and more less than satisfactory seasons.

Jerry Jones had a real football guy when he won those Super Bowls, which runs contrary to the foolish point Vela is trying to make. He had another football guy who rebuilt the roster for the team we have now. It's when he doesn't have one of those guys - like now - that he has failed.

 

[cowboyed]

Then Vela would be wrong about that.

Stated with typical, limited knowledge aplomb.

 

[wileedog]

Notice Parcells had the power and the guts to do that? Speaks more to Jerry's position of control more than it does to Emmitt the player, right?

And I think that's what Garrett is pushing for here - the power and control to say he can cut one of the most talented players on the team because he wants to. And if he doesn't have that power, he doesn't want to be here.

I'm sure Parcells said something similar to Jerry before he agree to come. Probably even had to clear cutting Emmitt before signing the contract.

Cut Owens today and you'll have another issue tomorrow.

Absolutely true. Owens is not THE problem. The problem is an atmosphere where the inmates run the asylum. Throwing out the lead troublemaker doesn't fix the inherent flaw in the system which allowed that to happen in the first place.

But hey, gotta start somewhere

 

[jobberone]

Jerry Jones had a real football guy when he won those Super Bowls, which runs contrary to the foolish point Vela is trying to make. He had another football guy who rebuilt the roster for the team we have now. It's when he doesn't have one of those guys - like now - that he has failed.

What real football guy? Jimmy Johnson?? Jimmy fell on his face in Miami although he did inherit a tiny bit of an albatross in Marino. I give Jimmy credit but he's no more a genius in football than Jerry is. He's certainly a better football coach.

Jerry needs to bring some stability and consistency to the team. And be more forward thinking. He wants to win now so badly I think he makes impulsive and erroneous decisions at times. For the most part he has learned greatly over the years and has the club in the hunt for a SB.

 

[jwhardin]

If you want to send message to the team, start with TO. You don't have to scream, holler or cuss. It's very simple, this is the way it is and if you don't do it, then you get punished. No problem. TO is a distraction, media magnet. He's a good WR and I think a friendly guy, but I would take Garrett.

 

[Alexander]

'Leaders' don't run.

I don't understand this characterization of Garrett at all.

He's not running. Taking a better opportunity is not running. The only way this makes sense is if he contractually has a "future head coach of the Dallas Cowboys" clause in his hip pocket. I don't know that. Do you?