Building Through The Draft

[Alexander]

The odds of those 6th and 7th rounders making the 53 are very very slim.

So why would another team take those picks in a trade up?

 

[Stash]

Loomis has been there since last June, I believe. It does not appear that much has changed.

We'll see. If nothing else, I'm optimistic that they've moved another unaligned Garrett out of the job.

 

[Mobinvans]

Draft is only 1 of 3 ways to get players

We suck at 2 of the 3 so we are still losing

 

[KingintheNorth]

Same ole same ole.

Every team drafts. It's not an option to NOT partake in the draft. Fan Boys have bought into this idea that the Cowboys are so good at the draft now that they have an advantage over the other 31 teams who also utilize the draft,

Some teams use the draft to trade for players, Some teams trade up or trade down, but each team is issued 7 picks each year every year regardless. The "just build through the draft" believers are foolish and are making excuses for a front office that either can't or won't utilize free agency or trades to acquire talent.

 

[xwalker]

Which is pretty much equivalent to our #19 snagging that stunner of a GAME sealing T.D. catch in the meaningless end of season game play against Philly,heh?

(Cripes, man! as detestable of the concept of losing to the Eagles is, that resides within me,,,that final game against them should've been conducted with the long term goal concerning the stratagerum of fielding better first string front line fighters capable of defeating their 3rd string spines,,,,SHEESE)

I generally agree, but its a difficult issue. You never want to players to back off and you don't want to make it obvious that you're tanking.

It would be up to the Head Coach to find a way to lose the game by doing something like going for it on 4th down when it was unlikely to work or trying some 60 yard field goals. Garrett wouldn't want to do that because he personally wants to win as many as possible because there was a chance he could get fired. Jerry would have needed to demand that Garrett tank the game but Jerry's aleady deep into a bottle of Johnnie Walker Blue by game time.

I think it would be bad if they players ever thought management tanked the game.

There was a year where they went all-in to win a late season game that ended up cost them several spots in the draft and I was really irritated.

It think it was 2004 and the next to the last game of the season. They would have had a top 10 pick with a loss. Looking back it might have ended up saving them from a bad pick. They took DWare at 11. Most of the top 10 were complete failed picks and the best 2 were Alex Smith and PacMan.

It's funny because I still remember my anger but I had not looked back until now to see just how bad that top 10 turned out.

Nevertheless, you always have to assume that a higher pick is better because it is on average.

 

[tm1119]

I don't think they consciously decided not to improve the team. Me thinks they actually do what way too many do when some aging vet becomes available - they looked at the team after the 2016 season through best-case glasses. Zeke wouldn't get suspended, Dak would repeat his rookie success, Tyron wouldn't get hurt, Green would perform near what he had in the past, etc. The problem is that best-case NEVER, or at least is highly unlikely. That's part of the reason for the NFL being year-to-year. Things come together for a team at a moment in time, it just clicks and they go on a run. It's one of the reasons no team has repeated as NFCE Champ since 2k4 and no Super Bowl lose has returned the following year in a long while. NE is obviously different, but then they have a generational, if not historical, combination at HC and QB.

Yeah I don’t think it was on purpose either...I think it had a lot to do with poor talent evaluation as well. Something a lot of cowboys fans don’t seem to want to admit for some odd reason, I think maybe because it would be a knock on McClay

Nolan Carrol was signed to be an adequate starter/bridge to the rookies
Aging and injury prone Paea was signed to play significant snaps as the starting 1 tech
Byron Bell was signed to either start at LG or at least be a key backup that would play.
Ced Thornton was a disaster
Mayowa was signed like he was some hidden gem
T Will was resigned when it was painfully obvious we needed to upgrade the WR2 spot.

I get that none of these were high price moves but doesn’t change the fact that the moves we have been making aren’t very good.

 

[BlindFaith]

I think about it this way. A successfull draft brings in 3 starters. And amazing draft, 4.

You have 22 starters

Our philosophy doesn't add up

You are looking at that from a single season approach. Teams aren't built in a single year.

Let's take even just the course of 5 years. And even just use 3 starters from each. That's 15 right there. 4 gives you 20.

Then you resign the guys who play out their rookie contracts. That's how you should build your team. And it's much cheaper than paying for high priced FAs.

Now, if of all the guys you drafted you are missing a must have top 5 positional player (QB, LT, Rush End, CB and I would say Safety) then you need to aquire one, if the chance comes up. Even if that may mean over paying slightly.

 

[4th_and_short]

Same ole same ole.

Every team drafts. It's not an option to NOT partake in the draft. Fan Boys have bought into this idea that the Cowboys are so good at the draft now that they have an advantage over the other 31 teams who also utilize the draft,

Some teams use the draft to trade for players, Some teams trade up or trade down, but each team is issued 7 picks each year every year regardless. The "just build through the draft" believers are foolish and are making excuses for a front office that either can't or won't utilize free agency or trades to acquire talent.

Our All-Pro linemen came through the draft, as did the Pro Bowl RB behind them. Our ROTY QB came from the draft. Our sack leader was drafted. Pro Bowl LB through the draft. The entire secondary revamped through the draft.

I am fine with the team’s approach through drafting because they have hit on some successful players. The issue stems from not having enough turnover in some positions. We lock ourselves into contracts with aging players instead of finding new talent to replace them. We’re a year too late on most moves that should be made and that’s why we aren’t able to bring in those one or two key FAs to bolster the roster. Money and sentiment keeps players like Witten in the starting lineup long after their snaps should be reduced.

Don’t knock the draft though, that’s something Dallas has actually done well recently.

 

[BlindFaith]

Our All-Pro linemen came through the draft, as did the Pro Bowl RB behind them. Our ROTY QB came from the draft. Our sack leader was drafted. Pro Bowl LB through the draft. The entire secondary revamped through the draft.

I am fine with the team’s approach through drafting because they have hit on some successful players. The issue stems from not having enough turnover in some positions. We lock ourselves into contracts with aging players instead of finding new talent to replace them. We’re a year too late on most moves that should be made and that’s why we aren’t able to bring in those one or two key FAs to bolster the roster. Money and sentiment keeps players like Witten in the starting lineup long after their snaps should be reduced.

Don’t knock the draft though, that’s something Dallas has actually done well recently.

Sums it up nicely.

 

[diefree666]

ideally you want 2/3 of your starters to have come from the draft. As has been pointed out the best drafting reams barely average 3 starters a year and its up and down.

You have to fill the rest with FA and trades. That is how the Pats, Packers and Steelers do it and they have been the most consistent winners over the last 10 years.

 

[kskboys]

Well, like Stephen Jones said.

"You're trying to project them from one system to the other. That can be difficult."

This talent acquisition thing is hard, folks.

6-4/309 is the wrong build for NT. Very very few guys can play low enough at that height/weight ratio to play NT.

 

[kskboys]

So why would another team take those picks in a trade up?

Right?

 

[cowboyec]

I prefer they build thru the draft.
I remember when JJ went the other way....signing f/a's and throwing picks away for WR Roy Williams.....Joey Galloway.

I dont mind looking for bargins in f/a.....just read the lables more carefully.

 

[xwalker]

6-4/309 is the wrong build for NT. Very very few guys can play low enough at that height/weight ratio to play NT.

I looked at about 10 NT types past and present.

The average appears to be about 6-3.

Haynesworth 6-6
Ngata 6-4
Poe 6-3
Jay Ratliff 6-4
Several at 6-2ish

Maybe 6-4 Nick Golden Cock Hayden should have found a way to get shorter...

 

[LocimusPrime]

For reference

 

[Cowpolk]

You're becoming tiresome.....do you just cut and paste the same post over and over.

Shoe me a duplicate I will wait

 

[Verdict]

They could trade all of their 4th round and later picks and it would get them from #19 to #17.

That's what people fail to realize. Moving up is usually costly. I would be ok trading back from #19 if the grade isn't there and load up on 2nd and 3rd round picks.

 

[Verdict]

The draft is 80 percent of the team. If you don't draft well you are pretty much ****ed.

Having said that, free agency and trades are also important. It is best to wait for a player who clearly helps your team and sign him or dumpster dive where a miss costs you nothing.

 

[Mobinvans]

Drafting is only like 1/5 of the game

Coaching, free agency, trades, GM...

 

[jterrell]

Love this kind of analysis and in general it shows teams who win are doing it via consistency.
Good drafting is step 1.
No team has ever won yet without having really good players on the roster they have drafted.
If you draft well you keep the GM in place and that is important.
FA is step 3 or 4 in the process.
Trades are more rare and harder to categorize as important.
Trades generally happen when you have turned over the GM duties and the org has changed their position on players in house OR team has switched from winning to rebuilding or vice versa.
If you happen to have a spare starting QB then yes that comes into play too.

But what I'd really argue here is all this data is dated. With new cap and supplemental pick rules what succeeded last decade or even last year may be very different soon.