Can Cowboys build a championship caliber team without a HOF caliber QB?

[PA Cowboy Fan]

You believe Romo and Daks career has been enough for induction into HOF if they won a Super Bowl?

I think if Romo would have won a SB then he'd be in the HOF. Clearly his playoff failures will keep him out.

 

[JoeKing]

You believe Romo and Daks career has been enough for induction into HOF if they won a Super Bowl?

That's hypothetical. They never have been good enough to get it done so, hell no they aren't HoF caliber.

 

[Diehardblues]

That's hypothetical. They never have been good enough to get it done so, hell no they aren't HoF caliber.

I only say that in response to your comment .

 

[JoeKing]

I only say that in response to your comment .

In response to your comment. Yes, if they were better they could have been HoF'ers.

 

[Diehardblues]

In response to your comment. Yes, if they were better they could have been HoF'ers.

And I’d argue if they had as great of teams as Roger and Troy they might have been enough to get it done . Or at least get closer. Yes hypothetical but it’s a fair argument .

Do I believe either would be HOF caliber if they did. Probably not.

 

[JoeKing]

And I’d argue if they had as great of teams as Roger and Troy they might have been enough to get it done . Or at least get closer. Yes hypothetical but it’s a fair argument .

Do I believe either would be HOF caliber if they did. Probably not.

Impossible to disprove. We'll never know what could have been. Your opinion is as good as anyone's.

 

[Diehardblues]

Impossible to disprove. We'll never know what could have been. Your opinion is as good as anyone's.

I’d argue it’s better than most

 

[gimmesix]

No doubt . Having a HOF caliber QB doesn’t guarantee winning . And why they don’t win it every year.

And some HOF QB’s never win it.

What being a HOF caliber QB represents is when they have a great enough team they add to it not take away.

In other words we can determine they arent part of the problem.

I would say even HOF QBs are part of the problem when the team is not good enough. And defining a HOF QB without considering the team around him is impossible.

Look at John Elway. Elway went 14 years not being good enough to get his team over the hump. Critics could point to him having 21 TD passes to 18 interceptions in his first eight playoff seasons as part of the problem. Then, suddenly Denver won back-to-back Super Bowls and Elway is a surefire Hall of Famer. (OK, he would have made it anyway but had no Super Bowl titles to hang his hat on.) Elway didn't suddenly become a different QB — he threw 6 TDs to 3 ints. in the playoffs during those Super Bowl runs. Instead, the team around him got better, particularly giving him a load-sharing running game that was one of the best in the league.

 

[JoeKing]

I’d argue it’s better than most

I would never dispute that, my friend.

 

[gimmesix]

You believe Romo and Daks career has been enough for induction into HOF if they won a Super Bowl?

I believe if Dallas would have won a Super Bowl while Romo was QB, he'd be a Hall of Famer. He had seasons that were good enough and was one of the top passers in the league during his time here, but the team was not good enough.

I think that story is still being written for Dak. I don't expect the team to suddenly improve and get a Super Bowl victory, but we'll see where he ends up.

Reverse of that: I think it's kind of tragic that a player like Eli Manning could possibly end up in the Hall of Fame simply because his team won a couple of Super Bowls. Watching Manning over the years, his name and Hall of Fame shouldn't ever be mentioned in the same breath.

 

[Diehardblues]

I would say even HOF QBs are part of the problem when the team is not good enough. And defining a HOF QB without considering the team around him is impossible.

Look at John Elway. Elway went 14 years not being good enough to get his team over the hump. Critics could point to him having 21 TD passes to 18 interceptions in his first eight playoff seasons as part of the problem. Then, suddenly Denver won back-to-back Super Bowls and Elway is a surefire Hall of Famer. (OK, he would have made it anyway but had no Super Bowl titles to hang his hat on.) Elway didn't suddenly become a different QB — he threw 6 TDs to 3 ints. in the playoffs during those Super Bowl runs. Instead, the team around him got better, particularly giving him a load-sharing running game that was one of the best in the league.

Yes, I’d argue Elway was a HOF caliber before winning 2 SB’s. He was no doubt one of the best of his era before he won a SB. Denver was a consistent contender going to 3 SB’s before finally winning 2.

We’re able to determine other great and HOF caliber talent and career performances without being on a championship team. Why not a QB?

Obviously some are able and why there are QB’s in HOF who weren’t on championship teams.

 

[Diehardblues]

I believe if Dallas would have won a Super Bowl while Romo was QB, he'd be a Hall of Famer. He had seasons that were good enough and was one of the top passers in the league during his time here, but the team was not good enough.

I think that story is still being written for Dak. I don't expect the team to suddenly improve and get a Super Bowl victory, but we'll see where he ends up.

Reverse of that: I think it's kind of tragic that a player like Eli Manning could possibly end up in the Hall of Fame simply because his team won a couple of Super Bowls. Watching Manning over the years, his name and Hall of Fame shouldn't ever be mentioned in the same breath.

No way Romo’s career stats were enough even with a SB ring. He only started 7 full seasons .

Now if he had stayed healthy 15 seasons like Eli becoming top 10 in NFL history in passing yards and TD’s then yes, a SB ring might have been enough .

 

[PAPPYDOG]

When we look back in history the teams which have success without a HOF caliber QB most have done so with Elite defenses . Some needed a generational type #1 defense .

And some still had a QB who was average to above average talent which they didn’t need to carry them . He was enough to move the offense, make big plays when needed and most importantly not give up the ball costing them better opportunities to win.

There’s been several throughout history. Do we think we can build that type of team ? If not then we must find a QB who can carry a less than great team. Unfortunately there’s only maybe a handful or less at anytime.

Which scenario better suits our organization?

The last 3 playoff losses have proven that our # 1 problem is at the QB position.
Cut ties with Dakchoka and go find yourself a QB who can handle the load esp in the playoffs talent-wise.
Why are you trying desperately to make a dilemma when it's as simple as apple pie?
The Chiefs and Rams made the move even though both of their starting QBs at the time were better than Dak.
Have NO fear the Cowboys will still be here when Dak departs.
Jeez man get a grip will you!

 

[Diehardblues]

The last 3 playoff losses have proven that our # 1 problem is at the QB position.
Cut ties with Dakchoka and go find yourself a QB who can handle the load esp in the playoffs talent-wise.
Why are you trying desperately to make a dilemma when it's as simple as apple pie?
The Chiefs and Rams made the move even though both of their starting QBs at the time were better than Dak.
Have NO fear the Cowboys will still be here when Dak departs.
Jeez man get a grip will you!

Everyone wants a HOF caliber QB but unfortunately there’s only a handful to go around at any particular time.

The rest of the league must find something less than that to build around . The better they are of course the better your chances are to build around .

Getting rid of Prescott doesn’t guarantee anything . Much like having a greater QB doesn’t guarantee anything.

We’ve had some great QB’s in our history ( better than Romo or Prescott) who couldn’t win a championship either , with arguably greater teams than we’ve had this era.

 

[VaqueroTD]

No.
This organization lacks the triangle to success position holders to accomplish post season success.
Wrong GM.
Wrong HC
Wrong QB.

I've discussed in detail overcthe years how I believe an elite HC paired with an elite QB could "possibly" achieve improved postseason success even with the current GM.

The masses all then do the standard as long as GM is in charge we are stuck in the mud.

I will always counter that an elite QB, and especially an elite QB paired with an elite HC, could drastically alter this team's direction even in spite of Jerry.

Some few agree with Mr.
Others stick to the not as long as Jerry is GM chorus.

Opinions vary.

 

[Diehardblues]

Do we think this owner and GM would be capable of building a championship team around QB’s like McMahon, Theisman, Griese, Flacco, Johnston, Dilfer, Simms, Hostetler, Williams, and Eli to name a few off the top of my head who aren’t HOFamers.

 

[DandyDon1722]

I believe if Dallas would have won a Super Bowl while Romo was QB, he'd be a Hall of Famer. He had seasons that were good enough and was one of the top passers in the league during his time here, but the team was not good enough.

I think that story is still being written for Dak. I don't expect the team to suddenly improve and get a Super Bowl victory, but we'll see where he ends up.

Reverse of that: I think it's kind of tragic that a player like Eli Manning could possibly end up in the Hall of Fame simply because his team won a couple of Super Bowls. Watching Manning over the years, his name and Hall of Fame shouldn't ever be mentioned in the same breath.

Exactly right but here’s the thing. Eli was the benefactor of two of the greatest defensive playoff runs in NFL history. Even more than Dilfer with the Ravens.

They were a poor to average defense during the regular season but in their two SB runs they averaged giving up 14PPG. In today’s NFL that’s insane.

Add to that he got away with some INT’s that were flat out dropped and won the NFC Championship game against the 49ers on not one but TWO fumbled punts that led to scores. Never in NFL history had that happened.

Without question the luckiest QB in the Super Bowl era.

Feel free to use this. I crush Giants fans about Eli but of course they end with “Yeah okay but we won them.” Deep down they know the truth about him.

 

[StarLord]

So in the last 10 years, these QBs have won a Superbowl: Mahomes, Brady, Manning, Stafford, and Foles.

20% of the QBs that have won a SB in the decade are non-HoFers. You more or less need a HoFer. It's possible but unlikely to win otherwise.

 

[PAPPYDOG]

Everyone wants a HOF caliber QB but unfortunately there’s only a handful to go around at any particular time.

The rest of the league must find something less than that to build around . The better they are of course the better your chances are to build around .

Getting rid of Prescott doesn’t guarantee anything . Much like having a greater QB doesn’t guarantee anything.

We’ve had some great QB’s in our history ( better than Romo or Prescott) who couldn’t win a championship either , with arguably greater teams than we’ve had this era.

What's this HOF talk and hogwash?
How about a QB who simply doesn't hand out gifts to the opposing teams with his interceptions or one that can score more than 20 pts vs the Niners?
Trying to confuse the masses again and hidden in the background is your Dak agenda.
It's broke at QB and it needs to be fixed.......
Your preaching just keep Dak at 50 + million (Yes he cares about the money LOL) and using better QB of the past who never won an SB is another example of trying to cover up the PROBLEM.
What is the PROBLEM boys and Girls?
DAKCHOKA............................The End.

 

[Diehardblues]

No.
This organization lacks the triangle to success position holders to accomplish post season success.
Wrong GM.
Wrong HC
Wrong QB.

I've discussed in detail overcthe years how I believe an elite HC paired with an elite QB could "possibly" achieve improved postseason success even with the current GM.

The masses all then do the standard as long as GM is in charge we are stuck in the mud.

I will always counter that an elite QB, and especially an elite QB paired with an elite HC, could drastically alter this team's direction even in spite of Jerry.

Some few agree with Mr.
Others stick to the not as long as Jerry is GM chorus.

Opinions vary.

I’d agree those quantities could improve playoff success even with Jethro & Son.

But would it be enough to go all the way?

The way this organization is ran is our greatest obstacle to overcome . I believe even with those two greater quantities it would still be difficult to overcome teams of similar strength because of our culture under this ownership.

We’d need to have totally the best team overall like we did n 95. Remember we arguably had the best team in 94 too but the toxic atmosphere was too much to overcome .