Cardinals to Listen to offers for Boldin

[Doomsay]

Except for the one season where Roy played in an offense that threw the ball even CLOSE to an many times as the Cardinals do....

I hope Roy can do it because we are stuck with him. I like the way that he blocks and his hands look great. He could have put any doubt of his fitness to be a #1 by producing here in Dallas, at least by the end of season. He didn't look very impressive and has lingering injury issues. I think that it's fair to seriously question his ability to produce consistently as a #1 in a high pressure situation like Dallas.

 

[WoodysGirl]

Cards Want A One And A Three For Boldin
Posted by Mike Florio on April 16, 2009, 11:25 a.m.

ESPN’s Sal Paolantonio reports that the Arizona Cardinals are telling prospective suitors for receiver Anquan Boldin that at least a first-round pick and a third-round pick will be needed to get the deal done.

Per Paolantonio, the Eagles, Giants, Jets, and Ravens have shown interest.

Boldin said recently that he’d love to play for the Dolphins, but it’s unknown whether Miami will get into the mix. Other teams that could (or should) be interested include, in our estimation, the Jaguars, Vikings, Titans, Colts, Chiefs, 49ers, Browns (if they trade Braylon Edwards) and Rams.

We also think that, if any current NFL receiver other than Hines Ward screams out “Pittsburgh Steeler” in the way he plays the game, it’s Boldin. And with Ward possibly inching toward the end of the rope, it might make a lot of sense to add his eventual replacement sooner rather than later.

The Eagles have the most ammunition to get a deal done, with a couple of first-round picks and ten other selections. The Giants have the clearest need, but they’d be better off with a guy with the kind of speed to stretch the field. The Eagles potentially have a player like that in DeSean Jackson. Boldin and Kevin Curtis would provide a formidable duo for the underneath routes. If opposing defense lock onto either of them, Jackson will face single coverage at best

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Please not the Giants or Eagles. ray:

 

[SMCowboy]

I hope Roy can do it because we are stuck with him. I like the way that he blocks and his hands look great. He could have put any doubt of his fitness to be a #1 by producing here in Dallas, at least by the end of season. He didn't look very impressive and has lingering injury issues. I think that it's fair to seriously question his ability to produce consistently as a #1 in a high pressure situation like Dallas.

This is the part that I could not disagree with more. Maybe the reason he didn't produce in Dallas was because he couldn't cut off one foot....

If Roy Williams can put up numbers with Joey Harrington at WR, and Mike Williams and Charles Rogers as the #2 WR, that carries MUCH more weight for me, than what he did when injured as our #3 receiving option.

 

[DallasEast]

Here's a question for CBZ's most [strike]in[/strike]famous Eagles fan lurker: Phoenix-Talon. When is the last time Philadelphia surrendered first- and a third-round picks for a player?

 

[Doomsay]

This is the part that I could not disagree with more. Maybe the reason he didn't produce in Dallas was because he couldn't cut off one foot....

If Roy Williams can put up numbers with Joey Harrington at WR, and Mike Williams and Charles Rogers as the #2 WR, that carries MUCH more weight for me, than what he did when injured as our #3 receiving option.

He only put up #'s that justified the picks we surrendered once in a 5 year career. That doesn't say that much, other than he has potential.

I'm sure he was injured - at what point, who knows? Unfortunately, significant injury has been his pro legacy. Knee, foot ankle & some other non-leg related one (I think). He hasn't earned elite #1 status yet, was injured again last year and still can't make a cut after off-season surgery (understandably). He could very well earn back those draft picks, but the statistics suggest otherwise.

 

[Doomsay]

Dallas doesn't need Bolden.

Can we please let Roy Williams show what he can do healthy and after he has OTA's, mini-camps, training camp, and preseason?

That's fair, but I think that you have to add "remain healthy for a season or 2" to the list.

 

[SMCowboy]

He only put up #'s that justified the picks we surrendered once in a 5 year career. That doesn't say that much, other than he has potential.

He could very well have been injured - at what point, who knows? Unfortunately, significant injury has been his pro legacy. Knee, foot ankle & some other non-leg related one (I think). He hasn't earned elite #1 status yet, was injured again last year and still can't make a cut after off-season surgery (understandably). He could very well earn back those draft picks, but the statistics suggest otherwise.

If you are arguing that the stats Roy Williams has put up to date are not worthy of a #1 and #3 DP, that I would agree with. But this is the NFL, and in the NFL you pay for POTENTIAL just as much as you do for PRODUCTION.

And as for Roy Williams being injury prone, he definately has been injury prone. But lets not act like he has ever been one to miss very many games. To date Roy Williams games per season have been: 14, 13, 16, 12, 15 (with the only reason he didn't play in 16 this season was because of the trade, he had two bye weeks. Boldin on the other hand has actually missed MORE games in his career than Roy Williams. Roy Williams has only played in 10 fewer games in his career than Boldin, despite playing 1 fewer year in the league.

I am not saying that Anquan Boldin is a bad player, he certainly is a good player. But, all I am saying is that Boldin is really not that much different than Roy Williams.

 

[SMCowboy]

That's fair, but I think that you have to add "remain healthy for a season or 2" to the list.

You could say the same thing for Anquan Boldin as well....

 

[Doomsay]

You could say the same thing for Anquan Boldin as well....

Yes, although unlike Roy he has proven #1 stats. But I agree, he does need to remain healthy, or at least not head-hunted.

 

[Angus]

I believe Roy is going to prove a lot of people wrong this season.

Yes. One way or the other.

 

[Doomsay]

If you are arguing that the stats Roy Williams has put up to date are not worthy of a #1 and #3 DP, that I would agree with. But this is the NFL, and in the NFL you pay for POTENTIAL just as much as you do for PRODUCTION.

And as for Roy Williams being injury prone, he definately has been injury prone. But lets not act like he has ever been one to miss very many games. To date Roy Williams games per season have been: 14, 13, 16, 12, 15 (with the only reason he didn't play in 16 this season was because of the trade, he had two bye weeks. Boldin on the other hand has actually missed MORE games in his career than Roy Williams. Roy Williams has only played in 10 fewer games in his career than Boldin, despite playing 1 fewer year in the league.

Well you can also argue that Roy really didn't play much last season, averaging under 30 yds a game. I think that Boldin has proved more in the NFL and it can be argued that Roy has more potential, and you can pay for potential, but I think that Jerry was paying for the here and now last year.

We'll see who does better this year assuming that Boldin lands with a decent QB. I'll sport a I was wrong about Roy tag if he can last the season and puts up 10 td's and 1100 yds.

 

[RESIN8]

I'm just not sure we need to go out and get another prima donna WR. Let's just draft a guy who goes out and does his job or a guy who's happy to be here and busts his butt to stay here. Guys like Brian Robiskie and Mike Thomas come to mind.

There's so many WR's out there..TO, Braylon Edwards, Ocho Cinco, Plaxico, Antonio Bryant, Bolden, Brannon Marshall, Randy Moss, etc...who have a me-first and me-always attitude. Guys like Larry Fitzgerald and Wes Welker prove it doesn't have to be that way.

I don't see how Roy Williams is not on that list. Didn't he whine his way on to this team? Then he whined about why the Dallas Cowboys traded for him.

 

[SMCowboy]

Yes, although unlike Roy he has proven #1 stats. But I agree, he does need to remain healthy, or at least not head-hunted.

I would disagree that he has posted #1 stats unlike Roy. Everyone discounts Roy Williams stats from 2006 and really even 2007 (if you project Roy Williams numbers in 2007 out over 16 games, his stats would look like 85 catches, 1117 yards).

While I would agree that Roy Williams except for 2006 has yet to post elite #1 WR type of numbers. I do think that he has posted very respectable #1 WR type of numbers. However, if you look at 2006 and 2007, the only two years he has played in an offense like Anquan Boldin has played in in Arizona, Roy Williams numbers are VERY similar to Boldins numbers. Just don't discounts Roy Williams 2006 and 2007 numbers because he played for Mike Martz but hold Anquan Boldin's numbers up when the Cardinal offense actually threw the ball MORE OFTEN each of the last two years than Detroit did in either 2006 or 2007.

 

[Doomsay]

I would disagree that he has posted #1 stats unlike Roy. Everyone discounts Roy Williams stats from 2006 and really even 2007 (if you project Roy Williams numbers in 2007 out over 16 games, his stats would look like 85 catches, 1117 yards).

While I would agree that Roy Williams except for 2006 has yet to post elite #1 WR type of numbers. I do think that he has posted very respectable #1 WR type of numbers. However, if you look at 2006 and 2007, the only two years he has played in an offense like Anquan Boldin has played in in Arizona, Roy Williams numbers are VERY similar to Boldins numbers. Just don't discounts Roy Williams 2006 and 2007 numbers because he played for Mike Martz but hold Anquan Boldin's numbers up when the Cardinal offense actually threw the ball MORE OFTEN each of the last two years than Detroit did in either 2006 or 2007.

OK, with roughly equal passing teams let's see how they both do over the next 2 years. You can say that about any pair of receivers, but the injury/unrealized potential/vastly different passing regimes makes this comparison more interesting IMO.

Looking at Roy's past, I don't think that Jerry made the right decision. Had Roy played-out the rest of the season in Detroit with similar results that he put up here, I don't think that we'd be throwing the check book at him, or at least we'd still have our high draft picks. You can call it hindsight- but I didn't think that it was rational last season to not wait until 2009 before signing him at a minimum.

 

[SMCowboy]

Well you can also argue that Roy really didn't play much last season, averaging under 30 yds a game. I think that Boldin has proved more in the NFL and it can be argued that Roy has more potential, and you can pay for potential, but I think that Jerry was paying for the here and now last year.

I would certainly agree that Jerry Jones stupidly did think that Roy Williams was going to be a big help last year. Anyone with a brain would have known that that was NOT going to be the case. WR's simply do NOT go to a brand new offense with new terminology and a new QB that they have no timing with, and produce right away.

You say that Boldin has proven more in the NFL than Roy Williams. Well, I averaged out both Roy Williams and Anquan Boldin's stats for two years. Roy Williams for 2006 and 2007 (his only two years in an offense that throws the ball even close to as often as Arizona) and Boldin's last two years. Here are the cumlitive numbers.
Roy Williams: 167 catches, 2427 yards, 14 TD's
Anquan Boldin: 212 catches, 2521 yards, 26 TD's

While Boldin does have 45 more catches than Roy Williams he only has 94 more yards. And Roy Williams had Jon Kitna throwing to him, while Anquan Boldin had a future HOF QB in Kurt Warner throwing to him. All in all if you compare who else was on each offense, the difference in numbers is not all that drastic, IMHO. Anquan Boldin would give you more of a high reception guy, while Roy Williams will give you alot more big plays.

 

[Doomsay]

I would certainly agree that Jerry Jones stupidly did think that Roy Williams was going to be a big help last year. Anyone with a brain would have known that that was NOT going to be the case. WR's simply do NOT go to a brand new offense with new terminology and a new QB that they have no timing with, and produce right away.

You say that Boldin has proven more in the NFL than Roy Williams. Well, I averaged out both Roy Williams and Anquan Boldin's stats for two years. Roy Williams for 2006 and 2007 (his only two years in an offense that throws the ball even close to as often as Arizona) and Boldin's last two years. Here are the cumlitive numbers.
Roy Williams: 167 catches, 2427 yards, 14 TD's
Anquan Boldin: 212 catches, 2521 yards, 26 TD's

While Boldin does have 45 more catches than Roy Williams he only has 94 more yards. And Roy Williams had Jon Kitna throwing to him, while Anquan Boldin had a future HOF QB in Kurt Warner throwing to him. All in all if you compare who else was on each offense, the difference in numbers is not all that drastic, IMHO. Anquan Boldin would give you more of a high reception guy, while Roy Williams will give you alot more big plays.

Roy certainly has more excuses coming from Detroit, let's see how he does without any excuses. Clear #1 position, top passing & scoring QB and a good running balance to keep DB's honest.

 

[SMCowboy]

OK, with roughly equal passing teams let's see how they both do over the next 2 years. You can say that about any pair of receivers, but the injury/unrealized potential/vastly different passing regimes makes this comparison more interesting IMO.

Looking at Roy's past, I don't think that Jerry made the right decision. Had Roy played-out the rest of the season in Detroit with similar results that he put up here, I don't think that we'd be throwing the check book at him, or at least we'd still have our high draft picks. You can call it hindsight- but I didn't think that it was rational last season to not wait until 2009 before signing him at a minimum.

If Roy finishes up the year in Detroit, he definately doesn't post anywhere NEAR as bad of numbers as he did in Dallas. If he finished up the year in Detroit, he would have played in an offense that he knew with QB's that he had a chance to work with all season. If you average out Roy Williams stats for the 5 games he was in Detroit over a 16 game schedule, he would have posted: 54 catches, 742 yards. Not horrible stats for the #2 WR in a run heavy offense.

 

[DFWJC]

A team like Jacksonville could really use him....they have nothing at WR.

 

[SMCowboy]

And just for the record, I do like Anquan Boldin as a WR alot as well. I personally feel that both Boldin and Roy Williams are #1B type WR's. Boldin gives you more catches but Roy Williams gives you more yards per catch.

With Anquan Boldin you just have to understand and accept that if you put him in a regular NFL offense that is even somewhat committed to running the football, that you are very likely to get a 80-90 catch, 900-1100 yard season. With Roy Williams in the same offense you would probably get 60-70 catches and 900-1100 yards. The difference in my opinion, is that with Roy Williams you have a guy who has yet to play up to his true potential. But with Anquan Boldin I believe you have a guy who is playing up to if not exceeding his potential.