Cincinnati's Kelly Headed to Notre Dame

[burmafrd]

Biggems, you have a lot of nerve calling ANYONE ELSE opinionated. You admit you have never been to South Bend yet you claim to know they do not have a lot of hotties. You say you have never beenn to other places but claim to know about them. Talk about arrogant. And ignorant. Its also clear you are highly prejudiced against catholics.

 

[Rogah]

THE TOP SCHOOL AT THE HIGHEST LEVEL....since you have been discussing ND this entire thread...this statement can be construed as you saying ND is the be all end all of college football. I did not put words in your mouth, nor did I twist them. Please pay attention to the words you type. Maybe next time, place an S at the end of school, so that way your completely blind homerism for the Golden Domers does not shine through.

Wait a second... what happened to "I'm done with you" and "good day sir"..? Guess you're just another internet tool that announces he is dropping out of a conversation and then doesn't even have the self discipline to follow through..!!

Anyway... I have made it quite clear in multiple posts in this thread there there are about a dozen top flight schools that 99% of coaches aspire to. Notre Dame, Texas, Alabama, Florida. Any attempt by you to detract from that statement is just deliberately misrepresenting my points.

As far as trying to make yourself seem like some supreme intellectual on an internet message board, more power to you. Forgive me for not following the life of Kelly. Quite frankly, I have not found him of any importance or significance to follow his life story. But since you are such an expert on all things Kelly, what is his favorite color....cause I am awfully curious.

There's no shame in not being familiar with the life of Brian Kelly. But you shouldn't spout out about a subject when you are clearly ignorant about the subject you are spouting out on.

You entered this thread by calling Brian Kelly a sellout. Here's a question I know you'll be too chicken to answer: Is Mack Brown a sellout too? Because he screwed over UNC far worse than anything Kelly did to Cincinnati. He left UNC for Texas prior to the bowl season. I live in North Carolina and there are still a lot of hard feelings 10 years later.

Maybe you are just spiteful cause I have made it clear that I despise Notre Dame and you are butt hurt cause I refuse to accept them as anything more than a has been or used to be....and I base this on the last 15+ years or so. Nearly two decades of average is a pretty convincing argument for me.

Ignoring the fact that you have decided to talk like a 6 year old, why would I be upset at those statements when I agree with them? Notre Dame has sucked over the past 15 years, pure and simple. They have had 3 horrible coaches and it shows in the final product. They've been invited to bowls they didn't deserve to go to (which is why they lost something like 7 bowls in a row).

But here's the difference between you and me: You seem to think they've sucked for the past 15 years, therefore they will never be good again. I know that they are no different than Texas or Oklahoma or USC, all of whom had their periods of mediocrity in recent history and all of whom turned it around once they got the right coaching staff in place.

BTW, I understand about being an independent and having all the money to themselves. I still say it would be easier to compete if they were in a Conference, especially the Big East.

How exactly would joining a conference make them more competitive? They are not exactly Bowling Green playing games on Tuesday nights so they can get broadcast on ESPN2. They have all the national attention a school could ever want, they have a full schedule that includes multiple marquee teams and they have some of the best facilities in the nation.

So how exactly would joining a conference make them more competitive? What part of the above equation would they improve by joining the Big East? If anything, they would suffer because then they would have to drop some of their rivalries and lose a lot of control over their own program.

However, they will never join a conference, cause they want all the money for themselves.

They will never join a conference because they gain absolutely nothing by joining a conference but they would lose a lot of control over their own program as well as a lot of money.

Now back to Kelly........this thread was started by someone hoping Kelly would fail at ND. It was never intended as a hypothetical about coaching and so forth. You brought your own agenda to the table and you are all upset cause I didn't play the game the way you wanted me to. You are upset cause I didn't get on my knees and praise ND the way a Muslim praises Allah. Sorry, but it won't happen.

You jumped in and called Brian Kelly a sellout before I even said a single word in this thread. Brian Kelly is no different than 99% of the rest of college coaches, including your beloved Mack Brown. To paraphrase an old saying: Your crap don't smell any sweeter than anyone else's.

 

[Biggems]

Biggems, you have a lot of nerve calling ANYONE ELSE opinionated. You admit you have never been to South Bend yet you claim to know they do not have a lot of hotties. You say you have never beenn to other places but claim to know about them. Talk about arrogant. And ignorant. Its also clear you are highly prejudiced against catholics.

Not prejudice Burma...I just dont care for their beliefs or way of thinking. I do not feel I am better or worse than they are. I just have different religious beliefs and because of that, I will not be a part of a Catholic institution. I would say the same about a Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, or Morman institution. When you are an employee at a religious institution, especially in a high profile role, then you should probably share the basic beliefs of that religious denomination and the institution.....Don't you think?

 

[Biggems]

Wait a second... what happened to "I'm done with you" and "good day sir"..? Guess you're just another internet tool that announces he is dropping out of a conversation and then doesn't even have the self discipline to follow through..!!

Anyway... I have made it quite clear in multiple posts in this thread there there are about a dozen top flight schools that 99% of coaches aspire to. Notre Dame, Texas, Alabama, Florida. Any attempt by you to detract from that statement is just deliberately misrepresenting my points.
There's no shame in not being familiar with the life of Brian Kelly. But you shouldn't spout out about a subject when you are clearly ignorant about the subject you are spouting out on.

You entered this thread by calling Brian Kelly a sellout. Here's a question I know you'll be too chicken to answer: Is Mack Brown a sellout too? Because he screwed over UNC far worse than anything Kelly did to Cincinnati. He left UNC for Texas prior to the bowl season. I live in North Carolina and there are still a lot of hard feelings 10 years later.
Ignoring the fact that you have decided to talk like a 6 year old, why would I be upset at those statements when I agree with them? Notre Dame has sucked over the past 15 years, pure and simple. They have had 3 horrible coaches and it shows in the final product. They've been invited to bowls they didn't deserve to go to (which is why they lost something like 7 bowls in a row).

But here's the difference between you and me: You seem to think they've sucked for the past 15 years, therefore they will never be good again. I know that they are no different than Texas or Oklahoma or USC, all of whom had their periods of mediocrity in recent history and all of whom turned it around once they got the right coaching staff in place.
How exactly would joining a conference make them more competitive? They are not exactly Bowling Green playing games on Tuesday nights so they can get broadcast on ESPN2. They have all the national attention a school could ever want, they have a full schedule that includes multiple marquee teams and they have some of the best facilities in the nation.

So how exactly would joining a conference make them more competitive? What part of the above equation would they improve by joining the Big East? If anything, they would suffer because then they would have to drop some of their rivalries and lose a lot of control over their own program.
They will never join a conference because they gain absolutely nothing by joining a conference but they would lose a lot of control over their own program as well as a lot of money.
You jumped in and called Brian Kelly a sellout before I even said a single word in this thread. Brian Kelly is no different than 99% of the rest of college coaches, including your beloved Mack Brown. To paraphrase an old saying: Your crap don't smell any sweeter than anyone else's.

If you want to call Mack Brown a sellout, I will not argue. However, I will say this. Mack did seem to hit his limit of progression with UNC. It seemed like he reached his ceiling. Now, had he stayed, maybe with the way the rest of the conference began to struggle, maybe he turns UNC into a national power. Who knows. Like I said, I will not argue with you, if you want to call Mack a sellout.

I just feel Kelly had unfinished business in Cincy. I was hoping he would stay. I dont care for Cincy, but it was cool to see them relevant, cause they were an underdog.

I also feel Kelly will not turn ND around. We can argue this till we are both blue in the face, but only time will tell. In 4 years, either you will be correct or I will. If I am wrong, I will admit that I was wrong.

 

[Rogah]

If you want to call Mack Brown a sellout, I will not argue. However, I will say this. Mack did seem to hit his limit of progression with UNC. It seemed like he reached his ceiling. Now, had he stayed, maybe with the way the rest of the conference began to struggle, maybe he turns UNC into a national power. Who knows. Like I said, I will not argue with you, if you want to call Mack a sellout.

Like I said, you were too chicken to answer my question. I am not going to call Mack Brown a sellout nor am I going to call Brian Kelly a sellout. Personally, I have no problem with a guy who leaves a non-football school to take his dream job at a major program. Quite honestly, I would lose respect for a football coach who was content staying at a school where he was constantly in the shadow of the basketball program.

You, however, did call Brian Kelly a sellout and I just wanted to know if you applied your judgement fairly across the board or if it was "different" when your guy did it. And you were too gutless to apply the same standard fairly (just like I knew you would be), instead offering excuses for why Mack Brown was OK when he did it.

I just feel Kelly had unfinished business in Cincy. I was hoping he would stay. I dont care for Cincy, but it was cool to see them relevant, cause they were an underdog.

Which is the exact same situation Mack Brown had at UNC 10 years ago. And he did the exact same thing. Mack Brown didn't win any national championships at UNC so I don't see why one guy "had unfinished business" but the other guy "reached his ceiling." Sounds to me like you think Brian Kelly is a better coach than Mack Brown since you feel one is capable of winning a national championship in Cincinnati, but the other could never aspire to anything higher than an ACC Championship at UNC.

I also feel Kelly will not turn ND around. We can argue this till we are both blue in the face, but only time will tell. In 4 years, either you will be correct or I will. If I am wrong, I will admit that I was wrong.

That is an argument I am not going to get into. But I will say that this is far and away Notre Dame's best hire of the post Lou Holtz era. They were morons for hiring Charlie Weis, a guy with absolutely zero head coaching experience and absolutely zero college recruiting experience.

Oh, and I notice you had no answer for my question about how joining a conference would make them more competitive.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

ND is Kelly's dream job. So why wouldn't he drop Cinncy to go to where he wants to be ? That's like get upset at a college player for leaving school early for the NFL....can't have it both ways guys.

 

[Biggems]

Like I said, you were too chicken to answer my question. I am not going to call Mack Brown a sellout nor am I going to call Brian Kelly a sellout. Personally, I have no problem with a guy who leaves a non-football school to take his dream job at a major program. Quite honestly, I would lose respect for a football coach who was content staying at a school where he was constantly in the shadow of the basketball program.

You, however, did call Brian Kelly a sellout and I just wanted to know if you applied your judgement fairly across the board or if it was "different" when your guy did it. And you were too gutless to apply the same standard fairly (just like I knew you would be), instead offering excuses for why Mack Brown was OK when he did it.
Which is the exact same situation Mack Brown had at UNC 10 years ago. And he did the exact same thing. Mack Brown didn't win any national championships at UNC so I don't see why one guy "had unfinished business" but the other guy "reached his ceiling." Sounds to me like you think Brian Kelly is a better coach than Mack Brown since you feel one is capable of winning a national championship in Cincinnati, but the other could never aspire to anything higher than an ACC Championship at UNC.
That is an argument I am not going to get into. But I will say that this is far and away Notre Dame's best hire of the post Lou Holtz era. They were morons for hiring Charlie Weis, a guy with absolutely zero head coaching experience and absolutely zero college recruiting experience.

Oh, and I notice you had no answer for my question about how joining a conference would make them more competitive.

At least Mack gave it nearly a decade before he left. Kelly split after 3 years, and did so before the Bowl game. At least if you are going to split town, coach the bowl game and then leave. Finish the job before you go to the new one. I am upset with Brown for doing the same to UNC. He should have coached the Gator Bowl before leaving for Texas. If you are going to sell out, finish the job first.

I am not sure, but I believe the reason coaches leave so soon is to get a jump on recruiting and to set up their staff. With the NCAA adding more games to the schedule, up to as many as 14 now, they may have to do something about shifting the recruiting period a few weeks later, as to allow coaches to complete the bowl season, at least.

I will agree with you that Kelly is a better hire than the other guys...but I still do not feel he will get it done.

Since their basketball programs got so much better since joining the Big East, it seems that the football program would also benefit.

 

[Rogah]

At least Mack gave it nearly a decade before he left. Kelly split after 3 years, and did so before the Bowl game. At least if you are going to split town, coach the bowl game and then leave. Finish the job before you go to the new one. I am upset with Brown for doing the same to UNC. He should have coached the Gator Bowl before leaving for Texas. If you are going to sell out, finish the job first.

I think it just naive to think a coach is going to get his dream job, but be willing to wait 6 weeks before getting started. Kelly hasn't done anything we haven't seen countless times in the past.

I am not sure, but I believe the reason coaches leave so soon is to get a jump on recruiting and to set up their staff. With the NCAA adding more games to the schedule, up to as many as 14 now, they may have to do something about shifting the recruiting period a few weeks later, as to allow coaches to complete the bowl season, at least.

"Recruiting season" is pretty much 365 days a year these days.

I will agree with you that Kelly is a better hire than the other guys...but I still do not feel he will get it done.

Well ya know, those "other guys" actually had a few decent seasons since Holtz left. I seem to remember a couple 10-2 regular seasons, so it really wouldn't take much to get to that next level.

Since their basketball programs got so much better since joining the Big East, it seems that the football program would also benefit.

You're comparing apples and oranges. The fact that you think a basketball schedule and season even remotely compares to football is weak. Newsflash: A basketball team will play about 35 regular season games per year. You need to be in a conference to fill up your schedule - not to mention in order to have a conference tournament to go to.

Notre Dame football is not even remotely comparable to Notre Dame basketball.

 

[Cover 2]

Everybody thought Weis was a great coach the day he was hired there too.

Kelly's actually proven something at the college level unlike Weis. I'm not guaranteeing he'll be a success, but he has a better chance than Weis.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

Everybody thought Weis was a great coach the day he was hired there too.

The only problem with this notion is that Kelly has gotten it done at a college level. You've seen him be a HC before. This was Weis first HCing job. Kelly will also have a lot of connection in the area the recruiting should also be stronger. Since he stayed in the mid west. Kelly is known and players that would of gone to Cinncy to play for Kelly may decide to go to ND now.

 

[Doomsday101]

I wonder if ND had never been any good if Catholics would feel the need to be fans. I'm a Babtist but I have no urge to be a Baylor fan.

Can't answer that if it make you feel any better I tend to pull for Boston College as well. However I pull for Texas over all others.

 

[Doomsday101]

Personally, I think a strong Notre Dame football team would be very healthy for college football overall. I just don't understand the haters. They are the Dallas Cowboys of the college ranks. If you love college football, you should want ND to be at least respectable.

ND is a team that people love to hate. They are a school of rich tradition and I have no doubt they will find their way back to the top. Hopefully Kelly can get the job done for them.

 

[Rogah]

ND is a team that people love to hate. They are a school of rich tradition and I have no doubt they will find their way back to the top. Hopefully Kelly can get the job done for them.

I agree. That's why I call them the Dallas Cowboys of college football

 

[Doomsday101]

I agree. That's why I call them the Dallas Cowboys of college football

Very true. As I said I'm a Longhorns fan and have been since Darrell Royal was the HC but I have also supported ND and would like to see them back in the elite group of college football

 

[Biggems]

I root for ND on a few occasions....when they play USC and in the movie Rudy....though I am actually rooting for Rudy, not ND.

ND was the first college football team I remember watching. It is the first song I remember hearing. However, I have never been a fan of their sports teams.

Since I grew to like Syracuse as a kid, mainly to spite my older brother, who was a Georgetown fan, I grew to despise ND even more when they joined the Big East Conference in basketball.

As far as football goes, they definitely have one of the top 10 most prestigious histories and traditions in college football, along with USC, Texas, Michigan, Alabama, Oklahoma, Nebraska, Ohio St, Penn St. and Tennessee. The updated records as of right now are below (championship count starts in 1936 when the AP Poll came to be)

1. Michigan 877-304-38 (3 Championships)
2. Texas 845-320-34 (4 Championships)
3. Notre Dame 837-291-42 (8 Championships)
4. Nebraska 836-341-41 (5 Championships)
5. Ohio St. 818-308-53 (7 Championships)
6. Alabama 812-316-43 (8 Championships)
7. Penn St. 811-351-43 (2 Championships)
8. Oklahoma 795-305-53 (7 Championships)
9. Tennessee 783-332-55 (6 Championships)
10. USC 773-307-54 (8 Championships)

I can respect their history, but I dont have to like them or root for them.

When it comes to college football my allegiance begins with Texas. I am a Horns fan for life. I also like Alabama, Georgia, Stanford, Syracuse, and Army. George Teague turned me into a Bama fan. That man was beast in college. Herschel Walker turned me into a Georgia fan. The Cal/Stanford game turned me into a Stanford fan. I liked Syracuse cause of the basketball team and cause of Moose. My dad was in the Army, so I have always rooted for Army, unless they play Texas.

 

[trickblue]

I wonder if ND had never been any good if Catholics would feel the need to be fans. I'm a Babtist but I have no urge to be a Baylor fan.

You do know it's "Baptist"...

 

[Rogah]

As far as football goes, they definitely have one of the top 10 most prestigious histories and traditions in college football, along with USC, Texas, Michigan, Alabama, Oklahoma, Nebraska, Ohio St, Penn St. and Tennessee. The updated records as of right now are below (championship count starts in 1936 when the AP Poll came to be)

What are you, an Eagles fan? The only number that matters to me is total championships so i would say Notre Dame is in the top-2, not just the top-10.

 

[jimmy40]

You do know it's "Baptist"...

sorry, I was drinking, but don't tell anyone.

 

[Biggems]

What are you, an Eagles fan? The only number that matters to me is total championships so i would say Notre Dame is in the top-2, not just the top-10.

Im a Cowboys fan, my argumenative fellow poster. National Championships are subjective....different teams win depending on what poll you look at. The AP has one winner, the Coaches another, the Harris another, and so on. Now with the BCS it is an even bigger cluster. Look at this year. Texas or Bama will win the BCS title, meanwhile BSU or TCU will be undefeated, and possibly Cincy. So there could be 3 undefeated teams at Bowl's end, and yet Texas/Bama are crowned the Champs. Last year, a 1 loss Florida team wins the BCS title, while an undefeated Utah is left high and dry. About 5 years ago, an undefeated Auburn got hosed out of a National Championship chance. If there was a playoff and only 1 concrete winner could be crowned, than I would agree with you that Championships should be above everything else. However, D-1 College Football is the one venue where your stance can be debated.

You have to look at National Championships, Total Wins, Winning Percentage, and overall length of competativeness. The 10 teams I have listed have excelled in all 4 areas and are thus the cream of the crop.

 

[Biggems]

If Michigan continues to falter the way they have in the last few seasons....and Texas can continue to win 10-12 games a year, within 4-5 years, they could pass Michigan and move into the top spot for all-time wins for a D-1 college football program.