Cowboys' first-team defense to start drills

[LouBrown]

Based on projecting players

You would never project a third-rounder to start right away over two existing starters.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Anything is better than Dallas was! That wasn't my point; it doesn't prove that Winters is starting material.

What did you see when you saw him play?

 

[TheSport78]

You would never project a third-rounder to start right away over two existing starters.

You can when your starters are Overshown and Winters.

 

[TheSport78]

What did you see when you saw him play?

From what I saw of Winters last year, I wasn’t particularly impressed. He’s definitely athletic and can run, but the actual LB play was pretty inconsistent. I thought his instincts/read-and-react were a step slow, he’d get caught out of position or washed out against the run, and his tackling wasn’t consistent enough for someone relying that much on speed. He can flash when he’s kept clean and allowed to chase, but I didn’t see a guy who consistently diagnosed plays and made an impact. Maybe Dallas can get more out of the athleticism, but right now I see him more as a rotational/special teams LB than someone I’d want starting.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

From what I saw of Winters last year, I wasn’t particularly impressed. He’s definitely athletic and can run, but the actual LB play was pretty inconsistent. I thought his instincts/read-and-react were a step slow, he’d get caught out of position or washed out against the run, and his tackling wasn’t consistent enough for someone relying that much on speed. He can flash when he’s kept clean and allowed to chase, but I didn’t see a guy who consistently diagnosed plays and made an impact. Maybe Dallas can get more out of the athleticism, but right now I see him more as a rotational/special teams LB than someone I’d want starting.

It’s not that I want him starting. It’s that he’s started in the nfl lol. Barham playing 5 snaps and being anointed.

 

[TexasHillbilly]

It's laughable they they just handed the starting LB jobs to Overshown and Winters.

Overshown is very good and sneaky fast. Only problem is he cannot stay healthy. He keeps having these season ending injuries.

 

[LouBrown]

You can when your starters are Overshown and Winters.

Sure, if you don't want to base it on anything.

 

[J-man]

Gentleman, why argue about who is better or should be starting? The truth is (or should be), that we want all of these guys to be "starter" worthy. We want all of them to be very good at their specific jobs, which are in fact very different from each other. We need guys who can cover well, tackle well, stop the run and blitz well. Some guys are better in coverage, some better at tackling, some are run stuffers and some are better at blitzing. There is not one single player in the history of the world that could do everything on defense. You have to cover all the bases. What opposing offenses are doing will determine who's on the field, and when. And we want all of them to be ready willing and able to do their jobs when called upon. Having guys who can do what's needed, whatever is needed, whenever it's needed is what makes a great team.

 

[BobSacamano]

Ogbonnia is our third DL in the 3-4 front. We won't be in the 3-4 that often because this is a passing league. However, Parker said that we are a 3-4 base defense so this is the starting group.

The only one I question with this group is Hooker. To me, if we are running two safeties, the second safety should be Downs. But like with Barham, that may be a transition that happens over the first half of the season.

Hooker will start but will gradually see those starter snaps reduced throughout the season. Only natural.

 

[BobSacamano]

By your logic, Kenneth Murray was a starter last year. Is he starting material?

His logic looks and sounds better than yours.

 

[TheSport78]

Sure, if you don't want to base it on anything.

That’s your opinion, and I disagree with it.

 

[TheSport78]

His logic looks and sounds better than yours.

Bob, I learned a long time ago not to take criticism seriously from people I’d never ask for advice in the first place.

 

[TheSport78]

Overshown is very good and sneaky fast. Only problem is he cannot stay healthy. He keeps having these season ending injuries.

19 games played since 2023 is very good? It wasn’t like he was lighting it up when healthy either. Wow, he had a pick six vs Drew Lock on Thanksgiving. Talk about anointing players; a majority of the fanbase has propped up Overshown, but aren’t willing to do the same for Barham.

 

[LouBrown]

That’s your opinion, and I disagree with it.

Fact: Winters and Overshown have played NFL snaps.

Non-fact: Barham is a dawg

 

[TheSport78]

Fact: Winters and Overshown have played NFL snaps.

Non-fact: Barham is a dawg

You’re arguing against something I never said. I didn’t say Winters hasn’t played NFL snaps. I said I watched him play those snaps and wasn’t impressed with what I saw. That’s literally a player evaluation.

And obviously calling Barham a “dawg” is an opinion/projection. The fact that Winters has NFL experience doesn’t automatically make him a better player or prospect than someone who doesn’t. If your argument is that Winters is better, tell me what you actually like about his play instead of just pointing out that he’s played NFL snaps.

 

[LouBrown]

You’re arguing against something I never said. I didn’t say Winters hasn’t played NFL snaps. I said I watched him play those snaps and wasn’t impressed with what I saw. That’s literally a player evaluation.

And obviously calling Barham a “dawg” is an opinion/projection. The fact that Winters has NFL experience doesn’t automatically make him a better player or prospect than someone who doesn’t. If your argument is that Winters is better, tell me what you actually like about his play instead of just pointing out that he’s played NFL snaps.

Doesn't matter. You are saying that Barham would be a better starter right now even though he has not played NFL snaps.

You can't make an argument that Barham is better because he hasn't played lol.

 

[TheSport78]

Doesn't matter. You are saying that Barham would be a better starter right now even though he has not played NFL snaps.

You can't make an argument that Barham is better because he hasn't played lol.

Bro, it’s literally a projection. I’m not arguing that Barham has proven he’s a better NFL player. I’m saying I believe he would be the better starter based on what I’ve seen from Barham versus what I’ve already seen from Winters in the NFL.

By your logic, you can never project a rookie to beat out a veteran because the veteran automatically wins the argument by having NFL snaps. That’s obviously ridiculous. Every depth-chart projection, draft evaluation and preseason roster battle involving a rookie would be meaningless.

Winters having NFL snaps tells us he has experience. It doesn’t tell us he’s good. In fact, those snaps are part of the reason I’m not high on him.

 

[LouBrown]

Bro, it’s literally a projection. I’m not arguing that Barham has proven he’s a better NFL player. I’m saying I believe he would be the better starter based on what I’ve seen from Barham versus what I’ve already seen from Winters in the NFL.

By your logic, you can never project a rookie to beat out a veteran because the veteran automatically wins the argument by having NFL snaps. That’s obviously ridiculous. Every depth-chart projection, draft evaluation and preseason roster battle involving a rookie would be meaningless.

Winters having NFL snaps tells us he has experience. It doesn’t tell us he’s good. In fact, those snaps are part of the reason I’m not high on him.

Good thing we aren't talking about other rookies.

You are talking about a third-round pick who played Edge last year being so much better than veteran ILBs that they would be "compromising" wins if he doesn't start lol.

Your logic is dumb.

 

[BobSacamano]

Bob, I learned a long time ago not to take criticism seriously from people I’d never ask for advice in the first place.

Not critiquing. Just making an observation but thanks for the insight.

 

[TheSport78]

Good thing we aren't talking about other rookies.

You are talking about a third-round pick who played Edge last year being so much better than veteran ILBs that they would be "compromising" wins if he doesn't start lol.

Your logic is dumb.

Calling my argument “dumb” isn’t a counterargument. It’s what you resort to when you don’t actually have one.

You’ve had multiple chances to tell me what Winters does well and still haven’t managed it. At this point, you’re just documenting your inability to defend your own position.