Cowboys & Marty Ball

[CowboyRoy]

..........

This team isnt going to play Marty Ball....we dont play football like its 1992 anymore the Garrett Era is gone hes not here and McCarthy is a Pass Heavy coach

i expect us to be 60/40 pass run....

Shotty was brought in to improve the run game and be more creative in how we run the ball.

 

[Flamma]

Living in Chief territory, I witnessed first hand his entire tenure at the Chiefs (1989–1998). He won a lot of games but not in January. Effective but not flashy offense making it as far as the Championship game once but lost to the Chargers.

No question he had a conservative style of coaching that rubbed some the wrong way. Not sure how that offense would sell in Dallas. Throw in a few twists for todays game and I can see it being highly effective. That likely falls on McCarthy with a passing game with his fingerprints all over it.

Wasn't he also the coach of that 14-2 Chargers team that lost to the Patriots by grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory? That was sad. I remember someone commenting that Marty was the best regular season coach.

I think the Chiefs lost to the Bills in that championship game in the '93 season. That was actually the 1st ever AFC conference championship game for the Chiefs.

 

[links18]

Living in Chief territory, I witnessed first hand his entire tenure at the Chiefs (1989–1998). He won a lot of games but not in January. Effective but not flashy offense making it as far as the Championship game once but lost to the Chargers.

What year was that? I thought the Chargers beat the Steelers to get into the Superbowl in 1994-95? Did I miss a year?

 

[conner01]

Big Mike is thankfully calling the plays.

And he will influence the scheme
I hope and think he’s not the same coach as in GB
But in GB they threw a lot on first and they passed more than they ran
I like balance and ruing sets up the big chunk passes. Passing early is easier than passing when you have to

 

[CowboysLakerBamaFan]

You couldn't win a SB with Marty Ball even back in the day when the rules weren't begging you to build around explosive passing and going for it on 4th down a large percentage of time....even with the perfect smash mouth back for that era in Okoye.

BUT.. with a QB like Dak that we're chained to, 3 yards...3 yards.... and then a 5 yard pass attempt to a tight end or RB might not be a bad thing. It won't get them to a SB... but that's not happening with Dak anyway. It MIGHT finally at least get them a divisional playoff win for the first time in 3 decades though.

 

[JustChip]

Especially with CD Lamb and Brandin Cooks.

For our run to be effective, we have to be able to pass the ball.

And for the pass to be successful, we have to be able to run.

 

[BermyStar]

funny, when I read this I thought "who the heck is this Marty Ball guy we signed?

I thought it was a Martellus Bennett joke lol

 

[Jarntt]

Dak has only lost 4 games of 103 total when:
Cowboys greater than 100 yards rushing.
Opponent less than 100 yards rushing.

I always hated these stats and suspect they hold true for most teams other than of course teams that are significantly weighted towards running the ball or have running QBs that may run more when losing and/or have great run defenses. Unless you are GB playing us, when you are behind by a lot you need to throw the ball late more often than you otherwise would or you will lose.

 

[Jarntt]

The Cowboys new Offensive Coordinator is Brian Cornelius Schottenheimer.
- Son of Marty...

Marty Ball is a philosophy of football associated with and named after former NFL and UFL head coach Marty Schottenheimer.

In simple terms, it means a focus on the running game, with passing used only to further the running game.

Schottenheimer emphasizes offensive attacks that work as follows:
First down: a rushing play.
Second down: another rushing play.
Third down: a pass attempt.
Fourth down: punt (or field goal, if within range).

Fans (and critics) refer to this scheme as "Run, Run, Pass, Punt" (R2P2). Schottenheimer is considered to be a conservatively-minded coach with a majority of his focus on defense. The term "Marty Ball" is generally considered a pejorative because, at times, Schottenheimer will steadfastly continue to emphasize this form of offensive attack while attempting to hold on to a thin lead or when playing from

I'm not sure what you are getting at. Last I checked we didn't hire Marty Schottenheimer we hired Brian. Marty may have 'passed to further the run', but Brian seems to like to run to set up the PAP. Subtle, but different. And from what we read Seattle fired him because Carroll wanted to run the ball more and be more conservative. I mean, he was our passing game coordinator. You wouldn't have a guy that only wants to run as a passing game coordinator. He also likes to throw down field which is something we all have been calling for more of.

But perhaps you aren't stating that the son is like the father when it comes to Offensive philosophy in which case I'm not following the thread, but withdraw my comment

 

[CowboyFrog]

I would say he is more of the "Run Game coordinator" than OC, we are not going to run the ball much more than last year...how we run the ball and when will be the change.

 

[Big_D]

Having Schottenheimer doesn't mean they're going to run 50 times and throw 15. They just have to be more efficient and not lose the ability to run in key situations.

 

[xwalker]

I'm not sure what you are getting at. Last I checked we didn't hire Marty Schottenheimer we hired Brian. Marty may have 'passed to further the run', but Brian seems to like to run to set up the PAP. Subtle, but different. And from what we read Seattle fired him because Carroll wanted to run the ball more and be more conservative. I mean, he was our passing game coordinator. You wouldn't have a guy that only wants to run as a passing game coordinator. He also likes to throw down field which is something we all have been calling for more of.

But perhaps you aren't stating that the son is like the father when it comes to Offensive philosophy in which case I'm not following the thread, but withdraw my comment

He was not the passing game coordinator for the Cowboys.

He was a consultant that scouted opponent offenses for Dan Quinn.

 

[JayFord]

Having Schottenheimer doesn't mean they're going to run 50 times and throw 15. They just have to be more efficient and not lose the ability to run in key situations.

thats all i care about is running the ball in key situations something Kellen hasnt grasped the concept of

I couldnt go another year of it being 2nd and 2 and him busting out a trick play i just couldnt

 

[Big_D]

thats all i care about is running the ball in key situations something Kellen hasnt grasped the concept of

I couldnt go another year of it being 2nd and 2 and him busting out a trick play i just couldnt

Or empty backfield. I'm excited to see an offense that will put more thought into those situations. Just seemed like there was no real rhyme or reason to the play calling.

 

[quickccc]

In his defense Marty usually had average QBs with above average RBs. But he usually had good defenses.

- Joe Montana was average ? (2 years under Marty in KC)
- Drew Brees was average ? (4 years under Marty in SD)
- Bernie Kosar was average ? (4 years under Marty in Clev)
- Phillip River was average ? (one year under Marty in SD)

 

[quickccc]

Marty’s son is the OC in name only….so why does everyone think he will be like his dad.
Brian is not the HC and won’t be calling plays. And therefore because his dad never got to a SB is a far cry from what his son and MM plan to do.

At some of the things fans come up with or apply to the Cowboys Situation.

+1

yeh, it's in name only.
Some must be thinking " Like Father, like Son " in this case.

Heck it had been reported that HC Pete Carroll fired young Schott from Seattle because he didn't like what Schott was doing with the Seahawks run game.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...rt-offensive-coordinator-brian-schottenheimer

 

[Jarntt]

He was not the passing game coordinator for the Cowboys.

He was a consultant that scouted opponent offenses for Dan Quinn.

Not for us. For Jacksonville he was the passing game coordinator.

 

[roarr]

The Cowboys new Offensive Coordinator is Brian Cornelius Schottenheimer.
- Son of Marty...

Marty Ball is a philosophy of football associated with and named after former NFL and UFL head coach Marty Schottenheimer.

In simple terms, it means a focus on the running game, with passing used only to further the running game.

Schottenheimer emphasizes offensive attacks that work as follows:
First down: a rushing play.
Second down: another rushing play.
Third down: a pass attempt.
Fourth down: punt (or field goal, if within range).

Fans (and critics) refer to this scheme as "Run, Run, Pass, Punt" (R2P2). Schottenheimer is considered to be a conservatively-minded coach with a majority of his focus on defense. The term "Marty Ball" is generally considered a pejorative because, at times, Schottenheimer will steadfastly continue to emphasize this form of offensive attack while attempting to hold on to a thin lead or when playing from

He's not his father... check out Akoye's breakdown of his scheme

 

[jrumann59]

- Joe Montana was average ? (2 years under Marty in KC)
- Drew Brees was average ? (4 years under Marty in SD)
- Bernie Kosar was average ? (4 years under Marty in Clev)
- Phillip River was average ? (one year under Marty in SD)

Joe Montana was a shell of his former self in Kansas City .
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MontJo01.htm

Bernie was electric from 1985 to 1988
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/K/KosaBe00.htm

Ok one good year from Brees in 2004 and Ok years the other
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BreeDr00.htm

He got to have Rivers for his last season in SD.

I stand by the fact he had average to below average QB play most of his coaching career. Not saying his system doesn't suck but there is a reason he was 3 yards and a cloud of dust type offensive system.

 

[quickccc]

Joe Montana was a shell of his former self in Kansas City .
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MontJo01.htm

Bernie was electric from 1985 to 1988
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/K/KosaBe00.htm

Ok one good year from Brees in 2004 and Ok years the other
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BreeDr00.htm

He got to have Rivers for his last season in SD.

I stand by the fact he had average to below average QB play most of his coaching career. Not saying his system doesn't suck but there is a reason he was 3 yards and a cloud of dust type offensive system.

Those were not "Average" QBs, even at the twilight of Montana's years,

Bernie's best (electric) years were with Marty.

His last year with Rivers they won 14 games en route to a quick playoff exit by the Pats.

These were not Cooper Rushes that Marty was working with.