News: Cowboys' remedy for defensive line concerns: Rod Marinelli

[CATCH17]

3rd or 4th year of him being here and we still say he is some kind of remedy?


I don't doubt that Marinelli is one of the better DLine coaches in football but i'm waiting for him to turn a jag into a real quality player instead of them maintaining jag status for us.


He's got some real athletes on the DL now even with the suspensions so hopefully we'll finally see someone step up and be better than average.

 

[CATCH17]

Exactly. Marinelli is living off his Super Bowl defense from many years ago. I have not been impressed with him at all. Sure, he sits there and cusses up a storm but this defense is still very subpar. I know he's respected around the league but the chatter that Rod will fix this is being naive. His defenses are underwhelming as much as Rob Ryan's were.

His refusal to blitz at all is frustrating. You can't just sit back all day and let the offense come to you. You have to force the issue at times. When we finally got a little exotic and blitzed in the Washington mnf game last season, we had success. But of course with this staff, if something works, you never go back to it.

A guy like him I love as a position coach but when you're as talent depleted as we are we desperately need a guy that knows other ways to get the job done instead of calling 1 or 2 defenses the whole game out of 2 or 3 personnel groups.

 

[Stash]

I remember all the posts about Zimmer not being a good coach.

As far as the sacks go... Pretty difficult to get sacks when many of your backs 7 show little coverage ability.

It's not like the QB has to hold the ball for any length of time before someone becomes open.

This sure sounds like a get-out-of-jail free card. And the 'chicken or the egg' argument.

Pass rush sucks because the secondary can't cover long enough, pass rush gets a pass.

Secondary sucks because the pass rush can't get there, secondary gets a pass.

End result? It's nobody's fault.

 

[CATCH17]

This sure sounds like a get-out-of-jail free card. And the 'chicken or the egg' argument.

Pass rush sucks because the secondary can't cover long enough, pass rush gets a pass.

Secondary sucks because the pass rush can't get there, secondary gets a pass.

End result? It's nobody's fault.

I think the NFL rules have answered this question for us.

You're still allowed to be physical as a D Linemen. All of the rules favor the WR because the NFL wants points put on the board.

So build and spend your money on the DL and just try to be as solid in the secondary as possible IMO.

 

[AsthmaField]

End result? It's nobody's fault.

Or everybody's

 

[AsthmaField]

I think the NFL rules have answered this question for us.

You're still allowed to be physical as a D Linemen. All of the rules favor the WR because the NFL wants points put on the board.

So build and spend your money on the DL and just try to be as solid in the secondary as possible IMO.

I kind of agree with that.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

This sure sounds like a get-out-of-jail free card. And the 'chicken or the egg' argument.

Pass rush sucks because the secondary can't cover long enough, pass rush gets a pass.

Secondary sucks because the pass rush can't get there, secondary gets a pass.

End result? It's nobody's fault.

Oh the defensive line needs more talent.

But the pass defense has been dreadful for years... safety... ILB... Some issues at CB.

 

[Stash]

Oh the defensive line needs more talent.

But the pass defense has been dreadful for years... safety... ILB... Some issues at CB.

25, 28, and 25 rankings don't speak well of any of Marinelli's charges since he's been here. The names have changed planets, but the results are still ultimately underwhelming.

And right where many of us feared when it was decided to go back to the 4-3 defense.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

25, 28, and 25 rankings don't speak well of any of Marinelli's charges since he's been here. The names have changed planets, but the results are still ultimately underwhelming.

And right where many of us feared when it was decided to go back to the 4-3 defense.

The good news is that he's here for another season!

 

[Stash]

The good news is that he's here for another season!

 

[Sydla]

This sure sounds like a get-out-of-jail free card. And the 'chicken or the egg' argument.

Pass rush sucks because the secondary can't cover long enough, pass rush gets a pass.

Secondary sucks because the pass rush can't get there, secondary gets a pass.

End result? It's nobody's fault.

I was thinking the exact same thing. When people criticize the secondary and how it wasn't really upgraded, we get the deluge of posts saying our guys are fine and only hurt by a lack of pass rush. People point out that the pass rush is not even league average, apparently it's because the secondary isn't doing their jobs.

My conclusion at this point based off these two thought processes? We are not very good in the secondary or the pass rush. That's a double whammy.

 

[LocimusPrime]

• Sometimes you need the right skilled players to "coach up". If "coaching up" made any JAG into a probowl or near probowl type player, then guys like McGee, K. Moore, and Freeman would be starting qbs. Just coach them up right?
• Another argument might assume that some guys aren't coachable or they're not receptive to the coaching techniques. Even if the athlete is a good student and very coachable, there are limits to their physical capabilities, see Beasley or Heath.
• What does Rod gave to work with? Lawrence is a second round pick who seems like a Tony Tolbert/ Anthony Spencer type, more of a Robin than Batman. Irving and Mayeiwa ( spelling) are two practice squad homies. Russell is a 5th rd pick. Charles Tapper is a 4th rd pick. Mike McAdoo was a UDFA signed Ravens then played in the CFL and arena league for Arizona Rattlers. Gregory, as a second round pick, played one game last year prior to sustaining a season ending injury, and most likely will not play at all this year.
• Give Rod some blue chip prospects to work with. Give him two first round DEs, then judge him.
• It took some first rd picks to rebuild the Oline, why not give the same to the D

 

[BAT]

Even Wade Phillips, the best D-Coordinator the game today, needs talent to win. Even the biggest Marinelli boosters have to admit, coaching up scrubs is not going to win any championships. And at the end of the day, isnt that the fraggin goal???

Staying status quo if Romo only has a few years to contend is the height of insanity. Spend some money on the DLine, this is where Marinelli can maximize your buck. For everyone clamoring to see what the young guys can do, let them EARN it via competition. Nothing should be given to these guys, produce first.

 

[Sydla]

• Sometimes you need the right skilled players to "coach up". If "coaching up" made any JAG into a probowl or near probowl type player, then guys like McGee, K. Moore, and Freeman would be starting qbs. Just coach them up right?
• Another argument might assume that some guys aren't coachable or they're not receptive to the coaching techniques. Even if the athlete is a good student and very coachable, there are limits to their physical capabilities, see Beasley or Heath.
• What does Rod gave to work with? Lawrence is a second round pick who seems like a Tony Tolbert/ Anthony Spencer type, more of a Robin than Batman. Irving and Mayeiwa ( spelling) are two practice squad homies. Russell is a 5th rd pick. Charles Tapper is a 4th rd pick. Mike McAdoo was a UDFA signed Ravens then played in the CFL and arena league for Arizona Rattlers. Gregory, as a second round pick, played one game last year prior to sustaining a season ending injury, and most likely will not play at all this year.
• Give Rod some blue chip prospects to work with. Give him two first round DEs, then judge him.
• It took some first rd picks to rebuild the Oline, why not give the same to the D

Because we don't have 3-4 years to draft high round DEs if they plan on winning any time soon. 3-4 years is Romo's window.

It's the conundrum of the "plan". They know Romo's window to win a SB is probably 3 seasons, maybe 4. They have to contrast that with this desire to show fans they are trying to stay young and not sign aging players. It's two contrasting thought processes. They should have spent more money on defense IMO. They should be out there grabbing a guy like Freeney who is a short term solution for little money that doesn't put any crimps on future plans for the team. When Mario Williams was available, at $8MM per year with the ability to cut him for $2MM in dead money in 2017 was probably a move they should have explored.

They simply cannot fix all their problems through the draft in Romo's remaining viable years. There simply isn't enough time to draft high and develop elite players to fill needs say at CB, one of the S spots, DE, etc. Essentially, they are just going to have to get lucky on guys like Tapper, etc.

 

[bigdnlaca]

Even when the Cowboys were 12-4, his defenses gave up TD late in games.

Last year, he would bring blitzes in the first quarter and then just send 4 for the rest of the game. By that time, opposing offenses know what to expect from him.
I think the Cowboys need to blitz more on passing downs and 2nd half for them to have a chance to be effective this year.

 

[LocimusPrime]

Because we don't have 3-4 years to draft high round DEs if they plan on winning any time soon. 3-4 years is Romo's window.

It's the conundrum of the "plan". They know Romo's window to win a SB is probably 3 seasons, maybe 4. They have to contrast that with this desire to show fans they are trying to stay young and not sign aging players. It's two contrasting thought processes. They should have spent more money on defense IMO. They should be out there grabbing a guy like Freeney who is a short term solution for little money that doesn't put any crimps on future plans for the team. When Mario Williams was available, at $8MM per year with the ability to cut him for $2MM in dead money in 2017 was probably a move they should have explored.

They simply cannot fix all their problems through the draft in Romo's remaining viable years. There simply isn't enough time to draft high and develop elite players to fill needs say at CB, one of the S spots, DE, etc. Essentially, they are just going to have to get lucky on guys like Tapper, etc.

Right on. That's why I personally would have liked for them to use the Broncos approach. Using both draft and free agency to build a great defense.

 

[CCBoy]

The line 2 years ago had just 28 sacks, good for 28th in the league. Who exactly was proved wrong about what?

(cough...cough) I guess with this, one is also ignoring the 12 win season with nothing more than walking dead put into the defensive line...yea, pretty weak and inflammatory alright.

 

[CCBoy]

Right on. That's why I personally would have liked for them to use the Broncos approach. Using both draft and free agency to build a great defense.

I thought it was already shown that the defensive side of the ball, over the past three off seasons, has added much more than on the offensive side of ball. Which is it now?

This was already posted on site:

Is our D really that poor?
People need to get off of this myth.

Last year the Giants D were as historical bad as our 2013 D when we trotted out what, 18 different DL. But yet we hear how good they are and will be.
How about the Rams, with 7 #1 draft picks on that Defense...where did they finish last year...oh, #13.....3...THREE places in front of us.....

Give these players a chance and see how they develop. Yes we all know we still need defensive help...but they aren't as bad as many make it to be.
___________________________________________________

But just four off seasons ago, the defense was franchise low and without a functional defensive line.

The team can't be lied about, when the fact is that they have attempted with quite a bit of available resources to address the defense.

I don't buy off with the burn barrel 'high grounds.'

 

[LocimusPrime]

I thought it was already shown that the defensive side of the ball, over the past three off seasons, has added much more than on the offensive side of ball. Which is it now?

You did but Elway did it better. He added top tier defensive free agents. A couple of those FAs that he added are/were pro bowlers. I don't believe we did that here. Wait let me check that list........no I don't see any.

But to be fair, you are correct that have invested draft resources to the D side. That much is true. Free agency wise they haven't done much.

 

[CCBoy]

You did but Elway did it better. He added top tier defensive free agents. A couple of those FAs that he added are/were pro bowlers. I don't believe we did that here.

Seek medical assistance when shooting yourself in the foot. I guess Their franchise QB didn't just retire to structural failure, and they aren't also paying for the very best offensive line in the NFL. There are trade offs for roster cash flows.

Myself, I don't feel that Sean Lee or Orlando Scandrick are being underpaid...but I'm quite happy with Tony Romo, Dez Bryant, Elliott, and a top shelf offensive line. Never mind a Hall of Fame level tight end...

Finally, there are two players who may end up being Pro Bowl players, in Scandrick and Jones. Church can now play a true strong safety...and there are two NFL level cornerbacks in Carr and Claiborne. Not as dire as is being cried about on site.