Crayton......

[goshan]

BZ, I think we know where your bias is...lets go dig up your posts (I would guess more than 40) the last 2 years proclaiming Henson should be the starter right now and claiming his near-term greatness.

I have been consistent in claiming he has a lot of potential and that we should give him several years but that he isn't ready (not near ready).

The bias is clearly in someone's court...and it isn't mine.

I know of no other example in the NFL where fans have looked so silly in terms if expectations and hype far exceeding development and reality for a player. The fact that DH was mentioned in a group of 5-6 players (stars of the team and #1 draft picks) demostrates and evinces this fact.

 

[LaTunaNostra]

The fact that DH was mentioned in a group of 5-6 players (stars of the team and #1 draft picks) demostrates and evinces this fact.

Well, shoot me.

I thought it only fair to include a worthless scrub.

 

[Jimz31]

BZ, I think we know where your bias is...lets go dig up your posts (I would guess more than 40) the last 2 years proclaiming Henson should be the starter right now and claiming his near-term greatness.

I have been consistent in claiming he has a lot of potential and that we should give him several years but that he isn't ready (not near ready).

The bias is clearly in someone's court...and it isn't mine.

I know of no other example in the NFL where fans have looked so silly in terms if expectations for exceeding development and reality for a player. The fact that DH was mentioned in a group of 5-6 players (stars of the team and #1 draft picks) demostrates and evinces this fact.

Sorry LTN and BZ...but Goshen has a point here. There is no way that DH's name should be even close to being named with the players that you mentioned. No way at all. It's like mentioning some other player like Beriault in with those guys....it just doesn't fit....not yet anyway.

 

[goshan]

Tuna your response is fair and I apologize if I jumped on your case.
I am just continually perplexed re: the expectations and attention DH gets when there are plenty of players on the field we should be discussing.

But I understand your point.

 

[blindzebra]

BZ, I think we know where your bias is...lets go dig up your posts (I would guess more than 40) the last 2 years proclaiming Henson should be the starter right now and claiming is near-term greatness.

I have always been consistent in claiming he has a lot of potential and that we should give him several years but that he isn't ready.

The bias is clearly in someone's court...and it isn't mine.

I know of no other example in the NFL where fans have looked so silly in terms if expectations for exceeding development and reality for a player. The fact that DH was mentioned in a group of 5-6 players (stars of the team and #1 draft picks) demostrates and evinces this fact.

Two years,huh?

March 2004 to September 2005 is two years? Must be that unbiased math.

 

[blindzebra]

Sorry LTN and BZ...but Goshen has a point here. There is no way that DH's name should be even close to being named with the players that you mentioned. No way at all. It's like mentioning some other player like Beriault in with those guys....it just doesn't fit....not yet anyway.

So you have to be a star to be a Parcells guy?

Where is that a rule?

 

[goshan]

Ok, more than 40 posts over 1 year and 5 months.
Thanks for the correction.

 

[Jimz31]

So you have to be a star to be a Parcells guy?

Where is that a rule?

Not a star....however, take AB for example. BP was continually saying that NOBODY has a job...EVERYONE has to prove it to me, including LA.

KJ comes in and is automatically given a starting role. He even said it in a PC.

Coincidence? I think not.

You have to prove it to him.....UNLESS you played for him before....screw what you've done in the past, ie. LA....UNLESS you played for him before.

That's what it comes down to and you really can't deny it.

We all KNEW that KJ would be a starter when brought in....noone can deny that. However, prior to him being brought in, the mantra was "Noone has a job yet.".

 

[LaTunaNostra]

Sorry LTN and BZ...but Goshen has a point here. There is no way that DH's name should be even close to being named with the players that you mentioned. No way at all. It's like mentioning some other player like Beriault in with those guys....it just doesn't fit....not yet anyway.

Unfreaking believable.

Remind me never to mention DH's name in the same day as Mother Teresa's, or with Jeffery Dahmer's.

The names were mentioned in a post as BILL's GUYS, a post that also included Dedric Ward's HOF name.

There was no discussion of relative talent. The post had NOTHING to do with talent. Potential, or inevitability.

My point, which would be obvious to anyone I should think, is that EVERY player on this squad is a Parcells Guy now.

Not that every Parcells Guy is ready to start, a Pro Bowler, or a star.

But do let me add Tony Romo's name to that list of Parcells Guys! LMAO!

Is this how it's gonna be now?

A year of patrolling the board looking for Henson Heresies? :laugh2:

 

[Bob Sacamano]

I don't agree, I don't think Crayton did enough last year to gain Parcells' trust, after all, he was 7th round pick and didn't exactly light Cowboy's camp on fire, and the long-time Dallas insider said a few weeks ago that Crayton made the biggest jump from 1st year to 2nd that he's ever seen, so I'm guessing that he didn't do enough last year to warrant much playing time, but he sho has this offseason, remember Parcells saying that he wants Crayton to spell Glenn during the regular season? everything works themselves out with Parcells, so I still agree with him in his philosophy that the best player will play, and believe he uses it to the full extent, and really, you think Crayton has done enough to supplant both Key and Glenn? after all, Glenn was having a heck of a TC also, an even better one than Crayton, and Key is well, Key, he turns it on during the regular season and does very well, and he already has Parcells full confidence...

whew lol now you know my thought on your point...

 

[blindzebra]

Not a star....however, take AB for example. BP was continually saying that NOBODY has a job...EVERYONE has to prove it to me, including LA.

KJ comes in and is automatically given a starting role. He even said it in a PC.

Coincidence? I think not.

You have to prove it to him.....UNLESS you played for him before....screw what you've done in the past, ie. LA....UNLESS you played for him before.

That's what it comes down to and you really can't deny it.

We all KNEW that KJ would be a starter when brought in....noone can deny that. However, prior to him being brought in, the mantra was "Noone has a job yet.".

And what does inherited players have to do with players Parcells aquired?

That is apples to oranges.

Sure there is a hierarchy in who are "his" guys.

If he drafts you, you get a pass until you prove you are not one of his guys. See Rogers.

If he coached you and he knows you, you are one of his guys. See Anderson, Glenn and Key.

If you are neither of those things you have to prove you are one of his guys. See Woodson, Williams, Dat, Glover, and Ellis.

Here's a hint, the guys that are still on the roster from the 2002 team our Parcells guys.

 

[Jimz31]

Unfreaking believable.

Remind me never to mention DH's name in the same day as Mother Teresa's, or with Jeffery Dahmer's.

The names were mentioned in a post as BILL's GUYS, a post that also included Dedric Ward's HOF name.

There was no discussion of relative talent. The post had NOTHING to do with talent. Potential, or inevitability.

My point, which would be obvious to anyone I should think, is that EVERY player on this squad is a Parcells Guy now.

Not that every Parcells Guy is ready to start, a Pro Bowler, or a star.

But do let me add Tony Romo's name to that list of Parcells Guys! LMAO!

Is this how it's gonna be now?

A year of patrolling the board looking for Henson Heresies? :laugh2:

Well...I probably wouldn't put his name next to Mother Theresa or Dahmer's either.

However, are you denying that there has been ridiculous postings about the supposed talent that DH has?

I think that is the driving force behind what people are reading into posts.

You see alot of names of guys that have been/are starters and then you have DH in there. If every player on this squad is a BP player, why even point certain people out?

I'm not upset about the issue, so don't get bent out of shape about it.

My thread wasn't even started wanting to even concern DH.

Is this the way threads are going to go again like a couple of years ago? Drifting off into another QB thread?

 

[Jimz31]

And what does inherited players have to do with players Parcells aquired?

That is apples to oranges.

Sure there is a hierarchy in who are "his" guys.

If he drafts you, you get a pass until you prove you are not one of his guys. See Rogers.

If he coached you and he knows you, you are one of his guys. See Anderson, Glenn and Key.

If you are neither of those things you have to prove you are one of his guys. See Woodson, Williams, Dat, Glover, and Ellis.

Here's a hint, the guys that are still on the roster from the 2002 team our Parcells guys.

I would think that ANY coach worth his salt would know what he has in Woodson, Williams, Dat, Glover and Ellis. If a coach is saying that THOSE guys have to "re-prove" themselves over guys that are possibly "over-the-hill", I would say that it AGAIN goes to the point that I was trying to make in my opening post in this thread.

 

[LaTunaNostra]

Not a star....however, take AB for example. BP was continually saying that NOBODY has a job...EVERYONE has to prove it to me, including LA.

KJ comes in and is automatically given a starting role. He even said it in a PC.

Coincidence? I think not.

You have to prove it to him.....UNLESS you played for him before....screw what you've done in the past, ie. LA....UNLESS you played for him before.

That's what it comes down to and you really can't deny it.

We all KNEW that KJ would be a starter when brought in....noone can deny that. However, prior to him being brought in, the mantra was "Noone has a job yet.".

Marco Riveria and Anthony Henry were also automatically given a starting job.

They weren't old Parcells Guys.

We do free agency or trades like the rest of the NFL does.

Past high level play in a free agent is why you sign him. Bad play in a position is why you need him.

Key was elevated over AB. But Key has a skill set we desperately needed, and had a resume of accomplishment.

AB stunk in 03, and had he not, perhaps Key would not have been needed.

BTW, tho Key didn't have to beat anyone out as we desperately needed a possession receiver, Glenn most certainly had to beat out AB.

 

[blindzebra]

I would think that ANY coach worth his salt would know what he has in Woodson, Williams, Dat, Glover and Ellis. If a coach is saying that THOSE guys have to "re-prove" themselves over guys that are possibly "over-the-hill", I would say that it AGAIN goes to the point that I was trying to make in my opening post in this thread.

The thread evolved past that thanks to the attempted high jacking.

I agree that Parcells plays favorites, but last I checked when has one of his "old" Parcells guys knocked a league proven player down the depth chart?

If Key over, a year under Parcells Bryant, is the best you can do, I don't think you proved your point.

 

[Jimz31]

Marco Riveria and Anthony Henry were also automatically given a starting job.

They weren't old Parcells Guys.

We do free agency or trades like the rest of the NFL does.

Past high level play in a free agent is why you sign him. Bad play in a position is why you need him.

Key was elevated over AB. But Key has a skill set we desperately needed, and had a resume of accomplishment.

AB stunk in 03, and had he not, perhaps Key would not have been needed.

BTW, tho Key didn't have to beat anyone out as we desperately needed a possession receiver, Glenn most certainly had to beat out AB.

This year, there has been no talk of "Nobody has a job.". Probably because reporters asked him about that comment last year....so no, it doesn't hold true with Rivera and Henry.

Again, this is going off on a tangent that the original post never meant it to go to.

 

[LaTunaNostra]

The thread evolved past that thanks to the attempted high jacking.

I agree that Parcells plays favorites, but last I checked when has one of his "old" Parcells guys knocked a league proven player down the depth chart?

If Key over, a year under Parcells Bryant, is the best you can do, I don't think you proved your point.

Is OGBOGU starting?

Did Ward?

Did we see how fast Ryan Young was out when his knee failed?

Richie Anderson when he hedged on a surgery?

Adrian Murrell used and tossed aside?

Bill has never, but NEVER played one of 'his guys' to the detriment of a BETTER player.

Is Aaron Glenn gonna start?

 

[Jimz31]

The thread evolved past that thanks to the attempted high jacking.

I agree that Parcells plays favorites, but last I checked when has one of his "old" Parcells guys knocked a league proven player down the depth chart?

If Key over, a year under Parcells Bryant, is the best you can do, I don't think you proved your point.

Well, honestly, to hear the talk of DH's talent by some people, you would think that the guy was the next coming of you know who.

I still hear people saying he wasn't given the opportunity.

Now, here is my point. How do we not know that?

IF BP would have sat VT for the remainder of the year after week 12 or 13 or whatever, could it have kicked DH into gear? We'll never know now BECAUSE OF THAT BIAS TOWARDS BP'S "BOYS" IN THE SKILLED POSITIONS.

THat playing time at the end of that crappy year could have been very valuable for DH, now, is it possible that it did more harm than good? BP showing his lack of trust after ONE HALF.

Again, this is my point. WHEN WILL WE FIND A FRANCHISE QB? Could it not be entirely POSSIBLE that BP's ways are holding the team OVERALL back?

Does anybody HONESTLY believe that we have our future QB on this roster right now?

Yes, I know that some will still hold fast to that pipe dream, but, let's get realistic.

 

[LaTunaNostra]

This year, there has been no talk of "Nobody has a job.". Probably because reporters asked him about that comment last year....so no, it doesn't hold true with Rivera and Henry.

Again, this is going off on a tangent that the original post never meant it to go to.

Ferg, Marco, Key, etc all the FAs brought in to start do indeed have to prove they deserve to. They might have been brought in to start, but they can quickly lose that status. They have to keep proving it, too.

Had Key sucked in camp last season, shown he could not do the possession role, he'd have been benched.

Fergy was specifically brought in to be the starting nose.

But he won't, because due to his injury and Glover's play this summer, La'Roi deserves the job.

 

[Jimz31]

Is OGBOGU starting?

Did Ward?

Did we see how fast Ryan Young was out when his knee failed?

Richie Anderson when he hedged on a surgery?

Adrian Murrell used and tossed aside?

Bill has never, but NEVER played one of 'his guys' to the detriment of a BETTER player.

Is Aaron Glenn gonna start?

Where is our franchise QB? Why is it he insists on players like VT and Bledsoe?

Again, I'm talking about the betterment of our TEAM in the FUTURE....NOT necessarily about one player over another, although that CAN play into it.

If we don't take a QB in the first round next year, it will be THAT much longer before we have a team that can get it done when the running game isn't working.

Having said all of that, I still think Bledsoe is going to have a pretty good year this year.