Dak’s 1st year starting vs. Mahomes

[Aviano90]

At least we got Taco. Mahomes is even better than a seasoned Romo. Really impressed with the dude.

 

[Cowboyz88]

Go back to see what I said about Pat when he declared for the draft…I was all over this and other boards saying that Mahomes had the "it" factor that no other Tech QB ever has.

Lots of fans painted him as another Tech "system QB."

I believe that more than anything, HE IS THE REASON Mayfield left Tech. The Heisman winner knew he couldn't beat out Pat in Lubbock, so he bolted for OU. Of course, it worked out for both, but Mahomes is the real deal.

I would've loved for him to have the star on his helmet.

 

[CT Dal Fan]

I think everybody forgets Dak was the 135th overall pick and the Chiefs traded up to get Mahomes in the top 10.

Dak is who he is. The Cowboys have to surround him with a strong supporting cast. They can still win with him. That's how the Browns almost beat the Saints today. Would anybody want Tyrod Taylor over Drew Brees?

 

[MrPeanutbutter]

Last year they were coming off a season in which Dak set rookie passing records. It would have been stupid to change things up at that point.

Sorry, I mean this past offseason. Not like 2017.

 

[OmerV]

Lol your eyes are lying to you


You did not see Dak perform like this in his rookie season

You didn’t bother reading the OP either did you? I didn’t say Dak performed at the same level as Mahomes is now.

 

[irishline]

It matters. No one else better available for our situation over last 2yrs. Plus our preseason was not used to prepare, it was scouting.

You can't force greatness, it reveals itself 2nd half today!

Well then I wish it would have revealed itself sometime during the 2nd half of last season so we could have made the playoffs...

Here's to hoping.

 

[percyhoward]

According to NextGen stats Dak's time to throw was 2.88 seconds as a rookie - 4th from the slowest. Last Sunday it was 3.1 seconds - 4th from the slowest.

Dak never got the ball out quickly, he just had ridiculously good protection.

https://cowboyszone.com/threads/dak-is-not-a-franchise-qb.414325/page-7#post-8414221

 

[Aviano90]

Where was this guy after Aikman?

 

[JDSmith]

Where was this guy after Aikman?

In diapers?

 

[Aviano90]

In diapers?

Man. I finally have QB envy. Can you imagine Zeke running being Mahones.

 

[cwbyfn88]

Screw him. He is the reason I'm getting blown out in fantasy. Brady did me dirty. Shoulda started Matty ice

 

[Diehardblues]

Im watching the Chiefs and Steelers, and what I’m seeing with Mahomes is similar to what we saw from Dak in 2016 in that there is no overthinking - just drop back and throw to the open man rather than holding the ball while surveying the whole field looking for something better. It helps Mahomes that his arm is stronger than Dak’s, but the quick decision and getting the ball out of his hands is a big key. Dak will never have the big arm, but I think he can still be very effective if he doesn’t try to overthink and do too much - like in 2016.

Are we going to be left with always using the reference to 2016 season with Dak?

At some point that could become a faint memory.

For me watching Mahomes or a Darnold illustrates what we don’t have and are a smart 1st round pick away from .

Insert a QB with their talent level with our running game and much improved defense we become instant serious contenders.

 

[Diehardblues]

Look what LA Rams became with a solid defense and great running game became inserting a talented 1st round QB.

Look what the Eagles became with a great defense inserting a talented 1st round QB.

Often we talk about these 1st round bust who go to crappy teams but when they go to average teams basically just needing a better Qb we often see immediate turn arounds.

 

[OmerV]

Are we going to be left with always using the reference to 2016 season with Dak?

At some point that could become a faint memory.

For me watching Mahomes or a Darnold illustrates what we don’t have and are a smart 1st round pick away from .

Insert a QB with their talent level with our running game and much improved defense we become instant serious contenders.

2016 (or better) is what you want to see from Dak, and we are only one year removed from it, so yes, it is naturally the reference. It won't always be obviously, but when looking at the best of Dak and worst of Dak over 2 years why wouldn't we point to the best of Dak as the goal?

 

[Diehardblues]

2016 is what you want to see from Dak, and we are only one year removed from it, so yes, it is naturally the reference. It won't always be obviously, but when looking at the best of Dak and worst of Dak over 2 years why wouldn't we point to the best of Dak as the goal?

The results from 2016 is what we want to see.

Near the end of 2016 we begun seeing some of the symptoms we are still seeing today which better defenses were exposing.

The teams winning wave masked many of his weaknesses. Without the winning he’s more exposed. While Monday’s nights game was better than last week against a better defense and team overall probably wasn’t enough to win.

Our offense is limited against the better teams. That’s not a winning ingredient to eventually get to where we want to be IMO.

 

[OmerV]

The results from 2016 is what we want to see.

Near the end of 2016 we begun seeing some of the symptoms we are still seeing today which better defenses were exposing.

The teams winning wave masked many of his weaknesses. Without the winning he’s more exposed. While Monday’s nights game was better than last week against a better defense and team overall probably wasn’t enough to win.

Our offense is limited against the better teams. That’s not a winning ingredient to eventually get to where we want to be IMO.

Week 13 against the Giants was the only bad game Dak had toward the end of 2016. Even so, I didn't say 2016 was perfect, but again, Dak was highly effective that season, so we naturally would hope to see something closer to that than his worst moments, and again, it's natural to point to that as more what we hope to see.

Talking about last week is a different topic than the topic of 2016, but I agree his 2018 has not been what we want to see, although we saw some pretty strong signs of it headed the right way in Week 2. In Week 1 there wasn't anything positive except his connections with Beasley.

 

[Diehardblues]

Week 13 against the Giants was the only bad game Dak had toward the end of 2016. Even so, I didn't say 2016 was perfect, but again, Dak was highly effective that season, so we naturally would hope to see something closer to that than his worst moments, and again, it's natural to point to that as more what we hope to see.

Talking about last week is a different topic than the topic of 2016, but I agree his 2018 has not been what we want to see, although we saw some pretty strong signs of it headed the right way in Week 2. In Week 1 there wasn't anything positive except his connections with Beasley.

I thought he was more exposed against Vikings and Eagles too while we did win those games in 2016.

I just don’t see us becoming a consistent elite team in conference with Dak. We can be competitive but when I look at some of the elite teams in conference we have one major element that’s missing. A greater QB. Sorry but that’s how I see it.

 

[OmerV]

I thought he was more exposed against Vikings and Eagles too while we did win those games in 2016.

I just don’t see us becoming a consistent elite team in conference with Dak. We can be competitive but when I look at some of the elite teams in conference we have one major element that’s missing. A greater QB. Sorry but that’s how I see it.

Against the Vikes he definitely had a low yardage total - but he didn't make mistakes and had a good completion %, a TD and no INTs. Not what would be called a strong game, but not really a bad one. It was basically enough.

As for the Eagles, he had a lower than usual completion % in Week 7 (49%) but had 287 yards, 2 TDs and 1 INT, so solid, but not one of his top games. The second time against the Eagles, he barely played - it was the last game of the year and home field advantage was guaranteed in the playoffs. In any case, sure there were some games not as good as others, as there will be for every QB, but overall, again, we are still looking for something from Dak much closer to his overall 2016 performance than 2017. Maybe he will never be that or better, but that's certainly a better standard to look for than the second half of 2017 and the start of 2018.

 

[Diehardblues]

Against the Vikes he definitely had a low yardage total - but he didn't make mistakes and had a good completion %, a TD and no INTs. Not what would be called a strong game, but not really a bad one. It was basically enough.

As for the Eagles, he had a lower than usual completion % in Week 7 (49%) but had 287 yards, 2 TDs and 1 INT, so solid, but not one of his top games. The second time against the Eagles, he barely played - it was the last game of the year and home field advantage was guaranteed in the playoffs. In any case, sure there were some games not as good as others, as there will be for every QB, but overall, again, we are still looking for something from Dak much closer to his overall 2016 performance than 2017. Maybe he will never be that or better, but that's certainly a better standard to look for than the second half of 2017 and the start of 2018.

I understand but my point remains without the winning wave the symptoms were there in 2016 that is being more exposed in 2017 and 2018.

Perhaps it will take more time for the honeymoon to fade for everyone?

Unfortunately I think this is what Dak is and has always been. One big problem in the comparisons is 2016 we actually had a better offense not only on OL but in recievers plus Dak and Zeke were an unknown quantity .

NFL defenses have a way of sniffing out and exposing weaknesses. It’s up to the talent to overcome and make them pay. Up until now Dak has struggled overall in doing so.

Without the memory of 2016 winning wave we’re basically left with a QB that probably wouldn’t be starting too many other places.

I’m trying to think where that might be? Buffalo, Cleveland . Maybe NY. Look around the league. Who all are you benching for Dak?

 

[OmerV]

I understand but my point remains without the winning wave the symptoms were there in 2016 that is being more exposed in 2017 and 2018.

Perhaps it will take more time for the honeymoon to fade for everyone?

Unfortunately I think this is what Dak is and has always been. One big problem in the comparisons is 2016 we actually had a better offense not only on OL but in recievers plus Dak and Zeke were an unknown quantity .

NFL defenses have a way of sniffing out and exposing weaknesses. It’s up to the talent to overcome and make them pay. Up until now Dak has struggled overall in doing so.

Without the memory of 2016 winning wave we’re basically left with a QB that probably wouldn’t be starting too many other places.

I’m trying to think where that might be? Buffalo, Cleveland . Maybe NY. Look around the league. Who all are you benching for Dak?

You can't separate Dak from the winning in 2016 as if he wasn't a big part of the reason they were winning. Obviously winning masks a lot of things, but outside of a couple of games there really wasn't much to mask with Dak in 2016. Aside from the winning, he statistically had a strong season in 2016.