Dez or Hardy?

[thunderpimp91]

No such thing as too many Coronas.

Who was the 'elite' pass rusher for New England last Superbowl? And do you suppose Russell Wilson might be wishing he'd thrown his last pass to a WR the caliber of, say... Dez Bryant? Could you picture that Patriot DB out-hustling Dez for that short slant?

Yeah... me neither.

eh you can play that game both ways. Maybe if New England had a pass rusher the caliber of Hardy Seattle would have never been in position to win the game to begin with.....and you mean Seattle didn't have a top tier WR and made it all the way to the super bowl? Hows that possible? ....It's all ifs and buts that would change the whole landscape of a team, thus pretty pointless to even discuss.

 

[Jenky]

Name a single super bowl winning team in the past 10 years than had a top 3 WR. I'm not sure there are any.

Harrison and Wayne in the 2006-2007 season

 

[perrykemp]

Harrison and Wayne in the 2006-2007 season

Got me. 9 years ago Harrison was one of the top 3 WRs in the league with none other than Roy Williams.

I stand corrected.

 

[AzorAhai]

I wish people would stop with the whole, "when was the last time" SB stuff. Many different teams win with many different formulas. Just because an elite receiver hasn't won a SB lately doesn't mean anything. So what if the Patriots didn't have an elite pass rusher. Sometimes A+B doesn't equal C. Only 1 team wins the SB every year. Once you get into the playoffs its a crap shoot. A play here or a play there can be the difference. I want as many elite players as possible on my team so they can have the best chance at a SB. I don't care about the last time a team won with a certain type of player in a certain position. I just hope my team can win regardless of any meaningless trends.

 

[thisiscowboyscountry]

If both perform at their probowl levels next year and both demand top dollar, which one do you keep?

I say Hardy cause its do hard to replace his production.

I dont know how you can make this debate even before Hardy puts on a uniform, but I will go with Dez.

 

[MonsterD]

Hardy have to take sack and defense over WR always.

 

[Vanilla2]

Dez and Hardy!

 

[Nation]

Name a single super bowl winning team in the past 10 years than had a top 3 WR. I'm not sure there are any.

Agree 100%. Meant to say most have top pass rushers in comparison to top weapons

 

[BoyzfanfromPGH]

Really? Maybe it's just me but to letting Dez walk would be crazy I question if people who makes these types of thread actually watches a down of football or trolling. Why wouldn't you keep Dez?

 

[Tabascocat]

Which one is gonna cost more? If both stay healthy and have monster years, their required contracts will be huge. I don't see Dallas being able to keep both in that situation without hindrance to other areas.

We saw that an elite edge rusher didn't help much and have yet to have that elite WR since Irvin.

I would probably keep Dez and keep drafting DE's. Bryant is a major distraction to opposing defenses and opens up the offensive gameplan.

 

[Nightman]

Which one is gonna cost more? If both stay healthy and have monster years, their required contracts will be huge. I don't see Dallas being able to keep both in that situation without hindrance to other areas.

We saw that an elite edge rusher didn't help much and have yet to have that elite WR since Irvin.

I would probably keep Dez and keep drafting DE's. Bryant is a major distraction to opposing defenses and opens up the offensive gameplan.

If we can afford a 28m cap hit for Romo and a 13m Franchise tag for Dez this year, we can afford Dez and Hardy on long term deals

 

[Iron_Man]

Can management sign Dez long-term this year so that we can focus on Hardy long-term next year if he performs like we hope? All I have been reading lately is franchise Dez for two years straight and let him walk, why? He has no criminal history, no drug or performance enhancement issues, where the disconnect?

 

[Crad|e]

Dez is going to want Megatron money maybe more and Hardy is going to want close to JJ Watt money..

We should of signed Hardy for at least a two year deal because this season he'll probably miss 4 games or more and will hamper his numbers.

 

[Nightman]

Can management sign Dez long-term this year so that we can focus on Hardy long-term next year if he performs like we hope? All I have been reading lately is franchise Dez for two years straight and let him walk, why? He has no criminal history, no drug or performance enhancement issues, where the disconnect?

I would imagine it more about what Dez wants at this point. If he plays the next 2 years for 28m and is still a Free Agent in 2017 that is a really good deal for him.

If Dallas could sign him for 7/91m with 28m guaranteed they would do it tomorrow.

 

[Tabascocat]

If we can afford a 28m cap hit for Romo and a 13m Franchise tag for Dez this year, we can afford Dez and Hardy on long term deals

I know that they can afford both of them but would that be a detriment to the overall team or not. Romo and Smith are still relatively high on the books for 2016 with Fred and Martin coming shortly thereafter. The cap will rise however

Just don't want to see them hand-cuffed with significant wiggle room for FA's.

 

[AzorAhai]

I know that they can afford both of them but would that be a detriment to the overall team or not. Romo and Smith are still relatively high on the books for 2016 with Fred and Martin coming shortly thereafter. The cap will rise however

Just don't want to see them hand-cuffed with significant wiggle room for FA's.

Thats a very good thing to take note of. Martin is 4 years off and Frederick 3. You definitely have to take into account paying those guys in the future. However, they are interior OL so they won't command a Tyron deal or anywhere close for that matter. I think they may have to move some stuff around, but by the time Frederick and Martins cap numbers go up to pose any sort of issue, Romo will probably be sitting in Jerry's suite or on his couch on Sundays.

 

[Nightman]

Thats a very good thing to take note of. Martin is 4 years off and Frederick 3. You definitely have to take into account paying those guys in the future. However, they are interior OL so they won't command a Tyron deal or anywhere close for that matter. I think they may have to move some stuff around, but by the time Frederick and Martins cap numbers go up to pose any sort of issue, Romo will probably be sitting in Jerry's suite or on his couch on Sundays.

4 years is an eternity when talking about contracts and the salary cap. You can't plan that far in advance with any precision.

If they are still close and still have Romo they need to stay proactive in the next couple years.

 

[muck4doo]

I found the Dez Bryant abuse video. It is 5x worse than Rice:

 

[AzorAhai]

4 years is an eternity when talking about contracts and the salary cap. You can't plan that far in advance with any precision.

If they are still close and still have Romo they need to stay proactive in the next couple years.

Pretty much. By the time Martin and hopefully Lawrence are set for pay days, the team will probably be on a rookie QB with rookie pay. Fred will probably get extended in 2 years, but his cap hit should be manageable, even if Dez, Tyron and Hardy are in 8 figure cap hit territory seeing as Romos more than likely going to be retired by the time his cap number becomes a problem. 4-5 years from now is when you would have to worry about Fred, Martin and Lawrence if he pans out and how the cap would look. I think Dez, Hardy and Crawford are all doable this offseason, especially since I don't think Hardy gets anything close to Watt or Suh money. Maybe Revis like money with less guaranteed, but thats a big maybe.

 

[ccb04]

Easy answer would be to keep both...just don't know how easy it would actually be. Dez was drafted a Cowboy, and is simply one of the most productive offensive weapons in the league. Hardy might be a 1-year rental, who was available & financially feasible, only because of his legal issues. Between 2012 & 2013, he produced the 3rd most sacks in the league. Both command extra attention from the opposition...which benefits others.

As far as the Pats, they don't have an 'elite' pass rusher, but have a few solid/versatile guys in their front 7 that can create pressure/get home. LB Hightower (6 sacks), LB Collins (4 sacks), DE Jones (6 sacks), DE/LB Ninkovich (8 sacks). And they've now added Jabaal Sheard to the mix. They also had elite secondary players in Revis & McCourty. They do have an elite pass catcher in Gronk.

Seattle has run the ball over 50% of the time. They traded for an elite pass catcher in Graham & signed another solid DL player in NT Ahtyba Rubin. They utilize a rotation of pass rushers...and like the Pats, none of them had over 8 sacks.

I think Crawford & Lawrence will continue to ascend, and hopefully they keep adding pieces to that when they have the opportunity...particularly via the draft. Hardy is signed to a 1-year deal...and IIRC, Mincey has 1-year left on his deal.

As far as Hardy this season, he could potentially provide Marinelli with a very similar DL to what he had in Chicago in 2012, when the Bears finished with a league leading 44 takeaways...were 3rd in scoring D...top 10 vs. the Run & Pass.

Bears 2012 DL & their sacks: Idonije/Wootton (both had 7 sacks), Melton (7 sacks), Paea (2.5), Peppers (11.5)

Boys 2015 DL: Lawrence/Mincey, Crawford, Brent, Hardy