DMN: Football Outsiders - Adam Jones Has Been Dallas' Best CB

[Vinnie2u]

I think he's suggesting that Jerry should've spent the franchise money on Samuel instead of Newman. Pac notwithstanding.

Bingo WG. Jerry needs to learn how to let go of his home grown players .. For example Flozell, Newman, Glenn.

 

[28 Joker]

Jenkins wasn't even starting for 8 games... Pac-man was starting for those 5 or 6 games, with a year off. He was covering the best receiver a team had to throw at him. The same lee-way your giving to Jenkins needs to be given to Pac-man, in fact more, because Pac-man hasn't played any ball for a year... His numbers are freaking ridiculous...He should have at least 5 picks, but he couldn't hold onto the ball... I'd love to see how many people would turn coat if he did...

Listen, I have been one of Pacman's biggest defenders on here when it comes to his play on the field. You can look it up. I defended him from the media when they said he played bad. I knew that wasn't true before I saw these stats. I will tell you this, too.

If Pacman has lost support from people like me, that isn't good for him if Jerry thinks the rookies are doing just fine. He could be a distraction when he comes back. What if he gets in trouble again? Plus, he holds back Jenkins' development. Jerry Jones has to ask himself this question. Who do you trust in the long haul? Who is the safest investment. If he does, Pacman is gone, because Dallas and the rest of the league thinks very highly of Jenkins.

I've changed my mind. You can't depend on him off the field. Where is he right now? Do you really want to hold Mike Jenkins' development back due to a risky player, a player who couldn't stay out of trouble with body guards. In fact, he got into a fight with his own body guard.

I'm not giving Jenkins "lee-way". I have defended the guy from false and vicious attacks by the DMN.

Again, look at Darrell Revis. He played last year and took some lumps early, but look at him now. He is very good.

Dallas gave Mike Jenkins at top 15 grade in the draft. Teams have not picked on him, and they have not had success throwing at him near the sidlelines. He hasn't given up big play. Teams have gone to in-cuts in order to make some throws on him. They have gone at Anthony Henry, at times, when both of them are on the field. Jenkins played very well in the dime where he played on Henry's side. He may not have started all the games, but he has done a good job out there. He has played better with every passing game.

Having said all this, you certainly can still want Pacman, and you can make your case.

 

[khiladi]

Listen, I have been one of Pacman's biggest defenders on here when it comes to his play on the field. You can look it up. I defended him from the media when they said he played bad. I knew that wasn't true before I saw these stats. I will tell you this, too.

If Pacman has lost support from people like me, that isn't good for him if Jerry thinks the rookies are doing just fine. He could be a distraction when he comes back. What if he gets in trouble again? Plus, he holds back Jenkins' development. Jerry Jones has to ask himself this question. Who do you trust in the long haul? Who is the safest investment. If he does, Pacman is gone, because Dallas and the rest of the league thinks very highly of Jenkins.

I've changed my mind. You can't depend on him off the field. Where is he right now? Do you really want to hold Mike Jenkins' development back due to a risky player, a player who couldn't stay out of trouble with body guards. In fact, he got into a fight with his own body guard.

I'm not giving Jenkins "lee-way". I have defended the guy from false and vicious attacks by the DMN.

Again, look at Darrell Revis. He played last year and took some lumps early, but look at him now. He is very good.

Dallas gave Mike Jenkins at top 15 grade in the draft. Teams have not picked on him, and they have not had success throwing at him near the sidlelines. He hasn't given up big play. Teams have gone to in-cuts in order to make some throws on him. They have gone at Anthony Henry, at times, when both of them are on the field. Jenkins played very well in the dime where he played on Henry's side. He may not have started all the games, but he has done a good job out there. He has played better with every passing game.

Having said all this, you certainly can still want Pacman, and you can make your case.

I know you have defended the play of Pac-man and I'm not harping on Mike Jenkins either. I'm just commenting on how freakin' baller AJ is as a football player. Pac-man has been our best CB by far. Remember, when you bring stats like this:"Accordng to Joyner's 8 games graded, he was. 6.4 YPAIt is Anthony Henry's play that has gone ignored by the Dallas media."Besides the fact Joyner, I believe has great numbers for Pac-man, one should also remember:Mike Jenkins wasn't playing the best receiver for a majority of those games. He wasn't guarding the primary target of the QBs. Pac-man was and his numbers, like I said, are flat-out ridiculous. And he hasn't played in a year. If only he caught the ball.... There is no disputing the fact that Pac-man Jones plays serious football. High-level football, not just average CB play. He isn't getting burned, he is defending the pass, and holding receivers in check...

 

[AdamJT13]

AdamJT13 told me that Football Outsiders counts throws where you are the closest defender, but Joyner does his work based off if you are directly targeted.

To me, Joyner's work is more reliable and should be more valid. Just because a corner is the nearest guy, that doesn't make him automatically responsible for a given play. Direct targets are easier to measure. It decreases the subjectivity, and that should increase your chances of being valid.

On the other hand, if you completely blow the coverage, it might not count against you in Joyner's stats. And Joyner's numbers tend to be more lenient for zone cornerbacks.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

IDK about these stats....

 

[28 Joker]

On the other hand, if you completely blow the coverage, it might not count against you in Joyner's stats. And Joyner's numbers tend to be more lenient for zone cornerbacks.

That is a good point.

 

[Nors]

?

Thats how bad our corner play has been....

 

[jimmy40]

. Maybe we shouldn't let Pac-man Jones work at Mcdonald's either...

I agree.

 

[28 Joker]

I know you have defended the play of Pac-man and I'm not harping on Mike Jenkins either. I'm just commenting on how freakin' baller AJ is as a football player. Pac-man has been our best CB by far. Remember, when you bring stats like this:"Accordng to Joyner's 8 games graded, he was. 6.4 YPAIt is Anthony Henry's play that has gone ignored by the Dallas media."Besides the fact Joyner, I believe has great numbers for Pac-man, one should also remember:Mike Jenkins wasn't playing the best receiver for a majority of those games. He wasn't guarding the primary target of the QBs. Pac-man was and his numbers, like I said, are flat-out ridiculous. And he hasn't played in a year. If only he caught the ball.... There is no disputing the fact that Pac-man Jones plays serious football. High-level football, not just average CB play. He isn't getting burned, he is defending the pass, and holding receivers in check...

You are right. Joyner had Pacman at 5.9 YPA. That is great. You can make a strong case for Pacman based on his play on the field this year. The problem is the "big picture" with him and the talented option waiting in the wings. Plus, Pacman's momentum has been stopped. He isn't playing.

Now, it looks like Jenkins' momentum is going to be stopped if he sits behind Henry. I'm not the coach for sure, but I would have taken this bye week and installed Jenkins at Henry's spot. Henry could still play the dime.

 

[T-NMan-41]

:skins: Like I have been saying all along Adam Jones is a premier cornerback I hope Roger "Stalin" Goodall will stop hammering The Cowboys and let Adam back in the fold. If you watch the dvd of the games you will see that he was getting better and better each game. He has a natural instinct for the ball . There were about 3-5 plays he just missed an interception on by a split second, at least 2 maybe 3 would have been returned for TDS . Had he made all of those interceptions, You guys would have a contract on Goodalls Head . If he has his act together let him back in he has served his time, and we need his nastyness on defense and explosiveness on k-returns.....................

 

[Seven]

The amusing thing is, it is the very attitude of Pac-man that allows him to get INTs shut-down players and play better than the rest of the DBs... He is aggressive, contrary to the philosophy that Wade, or whoever, is promoting here as a defensive coach...
His skills overcome the limitations imposed by the coaching...

Say what?

Well put, CL.


I'm pretty sure khiladi states that Adam parted the Red Sea, freed the slaves and solved world hunger. All of this in between jail stints, beating women, questioning on 10 different occassions for some pesky little federal offense issues and crippling a man. Don't know about you, but I think that's pretty impressive............. Even better, he's offered a 13th chance and STILL blows it. Hell, the great Charlie Manson couldn't pull that off. We got us a bonified super-hero here.

 

[Seven]

:skins: Like I have been saying all along Adam Jones is a premier cornerback

...............and an outstanding citizen. Adam for president of the Humane Society!! Screw the lives he's ruined. I want to win football GAMES. All in the name of being a transparent entity of a teams success!!

BTW - What is "all along"? 6 months?

I hope Roger "Stalin" Goodall will stop hammering The Cowboys and let Adam back in the fold.

Stalin? Let's put this into perspective. Adam mames people. Goodell tries to keep Adam from doing such. You got your roles reversed here, pal. "Stalin" never, EVER tried to help anyone. Horible, horrible example you tried to feed us.


OTOH - What's that make Jerry?

If you watch the dvd of the games you will see that he was getting better and better each game.

DVD? Already?


Too bad it wasn't that he got better and better at functioning as a normal human being. I'd love to see that "DVD". (Just as non-existent as Adam displaying basic interaction skills.)

He has a natural instinct for the ball . There were about 3-5 plays he just missed an interception on by a split second,

But he didn't cause he's got stone hands. Why? Cause he's been out of football for being an *******. Reality 101.

at least 2 maybe 3 would have been returned for TDS . Had he made all of those interceptions,

Prove it. Please stop with all the fiction to try and make Adam look like, at very best, a football player. Cause of right now he ain't even that.

BTW - What is TDS? A new found cure for ***holeism?

If he has his act together

There ain't enough acts in Othello for Adam to get a clue.

He has served his time

And screwed that up as well. Now he has more. How many chances do you think his teammates are willing to wager? Do you really think they rely on Adam? Next.

we need his nastyness on defense

Odor is not relevent here.

and explosiveness on k-returns.....................

Wish we had a smiley that yaked from laughing so hard. This statement should be grounds for such.



in honor of Homer of the year.

 

[Seven]

That is irrelevant. It is the job of the system to do what you claim the NFL should be doing... That system declared him not-guilty...

I've never seen, heard nor read where a jury deemed him innocent. I believe the Las Vegas PD is still investigating the incident. You got proof?

 

[DallasDomination]

I Hope He comes back... He will be our best Cb in the long run.

 

[Dave_in-NC]

I've never seen, heard nor read where a jury deemed him innocent. I believe the Las Vegas PD is still investigating the incident. You got proof?

Ouch!

 

[SultanOfSix]

I've never seen, heard nor read where a jury deemed him innocent. I believe the Las Vegas PD is still investigating the incident. You got proof?

Isn't that the point of the system though? Innocent until proven guilty.

 

[khiladi]

Well put, CL.


I'm pretty sure khiladi states that Adam parted the Red Sea, freed the slaves and solved world hunger. All of this in between jail stints, beating women, questioning on 10 different occassions for some pesky little federal offense issues and crippling a man. Don't know about you, but I think that's pretty impressive............. Even better, he's offered a 13th chance and STILL blows it. Hell, the great Charlie Manson couldn't pull that off. We got us a bonified super-hero here.

Jut admit it... It isn't that hard and I know he gets on your nerves... He's a great football player... Was playing better than any CB on our team, includign Newman, Mr. Newman, the great CB who never ever gets INTs, even when he has not had a year off...

Adam Jones has great closing speed and is aggressive, and that is what compensates for Wade and his 15 yards off the CB scheming... The numbers support his play by far... When he is giving up 5 YPC, everybody else is giving up at least 2 yards more than he is... That happens for a reason..

He isn't my Moses, he isn't a hero I look up, neither was Michael Irvin, Tony Romo for that matter, Greg Ellis and every other NFL player who cheats on their wives, aka Eirc Williams, cocaine snorting Matt Jones, steroid pumping McAllister and so on and so forth... Oh, why not include Clint Eastwood in the list of womanizing individuals... I know he doesn't play football but since your all about 'character' and he's in your avatar...

This is a football forum, not a religious forum for character development...

 

[khiladi]

I've never seen, heard nor read where a jury deemed him innocent. I believe the Las Vegas PD is still investigating the incident. You got proof?

You got proof he was ever convicted guilty, especially after how much time since the incident? Pretty incompetent police staff, don't you think, if they are still investigating...

 

[Seven]

That is irrelevant. It is the job of the system to do what you claim the NFL should be doing... That system declared him not-guilty...

Isn't that the point of the system though? Innocent until proven guilty.

I claimed him neither. Khiladi has obviously given him a free pass. Unfounded as it is.

You got proof he was ever convicted guilty, especially after how much time since the incident?

I never once claimed him guilty. I do reiterate what this clown HAS done. And I'll be going off of the guy that now resides in a wheelchair over the word of a spoiled little brat who doesn't want to go to jail.

You are the one who boldly stated he was declared not guilty. You need to provide the credentials that would substantiate your claim. I have claimed nothing. You on the other hand, did. Again, I ask you for proof of your allegation.

Pretty incompetent police staff, don't you think, if they are still investigating...

WTH does THIS have to do with anything? You are making it very obvious that straws are being grasped at here.

While we're at it. Who shot JFK? Just where is Jon Bonet Ramsey?

 

[Seven]

Jut admit it... It isn't that hard and I know he gets on your nerves... He's a great football player... Was playing better than any CB on our team, includign Newman, Mr. Newman, the great CB who never ever gets INTs, even when he has not had a year off...

Great football Player..........

Dude, He's a midget. A spoiled, self-absorbed mamma's boy. Period.

Adam Jones has great closing speed and is aggressive, and that is what compensates for Wade and his 15 yards off the CB scheming...

You read this somewhere? Or make it up all by yourself?

You're spewing now, dude. We've all heard this before.

Blah, blah-blah, blah............

The numbers support his play by far... When he is giving up 5 YPC, everybody else is giving up at least 2 yards more than he is... That happens for a reason.

"BY FAR!!?" 5 to 7 or 3 to 5 or.........however you want to spin it is as weak as it gets. C'mon, dude. We're talkin "2". HUGE differential........you can comtinue down the path of embellishing your points but I gotta tell ya, you're starting to make me laugh.

He isn't my Moses, he isn't a hero I look up, neither was Michael Irvin, Tony Romo for that matter, Greg Ellis and every other NFL player who cheats on their wives, aka Eirc Williams, cocaine snorting Matt Jones, steroid pumping McAllister and so on and so forth... Oh, why not include Clint Eastwood in the list of womanizing individuals...

Now, now, now. You forgot: Woman beating, law breaking, people maming, law breaking, 13 chance gettin', law breaking, non functioning, law breaking, spoiled little mama's boy, law breaking, give me what I want or I'll throw another tantrum, law breaking, body guard fightin', law breaking booze hound. Too stupid to realize that maybe, just maybe he shouldn't drink.

Did I get at least 12 "law breaking's" in there? Cause that'd be the DIFFERENCE between your afore mentioned athlete's as opposed to the midget. Well, besides shooting people. : (May want to jot down that little nugget for later.)
Gotta make sure the slow one's get it. Read somewhere reiteration is the ticket..............

I know he doesn't play football but since your all about 'character' and he's in your avatar

I apologize for this and God forgive me.


Are you really this stupid? Seriously.


We have real life and we have the mooovies? Actors? "Action...........Cut"? Am I helping at all here?

Take it slow. Let it sink in.

This is a football forum, not a religious forum for character development...

It is indeed a foot-ball forum with every topic under the sun. Try and keep up! It's fun!!!