Drafting Zeke was football stupid

KJJ

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Right, you were comparing McFadden to a long list of HOF running backs.

Yep, an average back put up 1,000+ yards/4.6 YPC in 11 games behind the best OL in football. Had he started the other five, he would have went for 1,500+. Had he had Romo or even an average NFL starter he would have surpassed that.

You're making McFadden out to be a great back. You claimed he could have had 1600 yards rushing last season with Romo which would have had him leading the entire league in rushing. lol You proved my point by saying Sammie Smith sucked and not even the great Dan Marino could make him a solid back. I brought up several great backs that had very productive HOF careers with average to bad QB situations and also brought up Jamal Lewis and Chris Johnson who'll never be elected to the HOF that had 2000 yard seasons despite bad QB situations. The Cowboys were looking for a great back which is why they drafted Zeke. We're not going any further until you answer these questions. If you keep dancing, I'll keep asking.

If a QB makes that big a difference to an RBs success then explain how Eric Dickerson, Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, Jim Brown, Earl Campbell and Adrian Peterson had so much production and HOF careers playing with average to bad QBs? If the QB makes the RB, how did Jamal Lewis rush for 2066 yards in 2003 with Kyle Boller and Anthony Wright? Go look at the numbers those QBs put up. If the QB makes that big a difference for a RB how did Chris Johnson rush for 2006 yards with Vince Young and Kerry Collins? Both were terrible!
 

KJJ

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Jesus you two go get a room already ;)

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This is a room.
 

KJJ

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Had he started the other five, he would have went for 1,500+. Had he had Romo or even an average NFL starter he would have surpassed that.

Here's another question do you believe if McFadden started this season he would have the same numbers Zeke has so far? Have fun dancing around that one. lol
 

CalPolyTechnique

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You're making McFadden out to be a great back. You claimed he could have had 1600 yards rushing last season with Romo which would have had him leading the entire league in rushing. lol You proved my point by saying Sammie Smith sucked and not even the great Dan Marino could make him a solid back. I brought up several great backs that had very productive HOF careers with average to bad QB situations and also brought up Jamal Lewis and Chris Johnson who'll never be elected to the HOF that had 2000 yard seasons despite bad QB situations. The Cowboys were looking for a great back which is why they drafted Zeke. We're not going any further until you answer these questions. If you keep dancing, I'll keep asking.

If a QB makes that big a difference to an RBs success then explain how Eric Dickerson, Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, Jim Brown, Earl Campbell and Adrian Peterson had so much production and HOF careers playing with average to bad QBs? If the QB makes the RB, how did Jamal Lewis rush for 2066 yards in 2003 with Kyle Boller and Anthony Wright? Go look at the numbers those QBs put up. If the QB makes that big a difference for a RB how did Chris Johnson rush for 2006 yards with Vince Young and Kerry Collins? Both were terrible!

Nope. I've never once claimed DMac is a great back. Go ahead quote me where I have.

You're just so simple-minded you can't understand the nuance of the argument so you try to put things in easy-to-understand categories "well, he doesn't think McFadden sucks like I do, so he must think he's great..."

I've repeatedly have pointed out that this team's o-line is what greases the wheels of the run game and a good QB is what keeps it running efficiently.

And in true fashion, you deny that you're comparing DMac to HOF RBs and then you turn right around and do it all over again.
 

KJJ

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Nope. I've never once claimed DMac is a great back. Go ahead quote me where I have.

You're just so simple-minded you can't understand the nuance of the argument so you try to put things in easy-to-understand categories "well, he doesn't think McFadden sucks like I do, so he must think he's great..."

I've repeatedly have pointed out that this team's o-line is what greases the wheels of the run game and a good QB is what keeps it running efficiently.

And in true fashion, you deny that you're comparing DMac to HOF RBs and then you turn right around and do it all over again.

You never claimed McFadden is a great back but you're making him out to be a great back, if you think he could have led the league last season with 1600 yards with Romo at QB. This argument is about those who think drafting Zeke was a mistake and you're one of them or you wouldn't be supporting McFadden. Many wanted Ramsey who's looked pretty bad so far. He didn't look good at all for JAX on the Thursday Night game. The title of this thread speaks to what this argument is about. The thread back in August that me and you argued in tells you what this is all about. Now stop diverting and answer the questions.

If a QB makes that big a difference to an RBs success then explain how Eric Dickerson, Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, Jim Brown, Earl Campbell and Adrian Peterson had so much production and HOF careers playing with average to bad QBs? If the QB makes the RB, how did Jamal Lewis rush for 2066 yards in 2003 with Kyle Boller and Anthony Wright? Go look at the numbers those QBs put up. If the QB makes that big a difference for a RB how did Chris Johnson rush for 2006 yards with Vince Young and Kerry Collins? Both were terrible! Do you believe if McFadden started this season he would have the same numbers Zeke has so far?
 

KJJ

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And in true fashion, you deny that you're comparing DMac to HOF RBs and then you turn right around and do it all over again.

There's no comparison to McFadden and those backs and that's exactly what I've been pointing. lol Those backs got it done with average to bad QB situations and some didn't even have great OL's. The Cowboys drafted Zeke because they're looking for that kind of back someone that's special. McFadden is an average back and what he produced last season behind arguably the best OL in football was what any average back could have done. Now stop diverting and answer the questions. If a QB makes that big a difference to an RBs success then explain how Eric Dickerson, Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, Jim Brown, Earl Campbell and Adrian Peterson had so much production and HOF careers playing with average to bad QBs? If the QB makes the RB, how did Jamal Lewis rush for 2066 yards in 2003 with Kyle Boller and Anthony Wright? Go look at the numbers those QBs put up. If the QB makes that big a difference for a RB how did Chris Johnson rush for 2006 yards with Vince Young and Kerry Collins? Both were terrible! Do you believe if McFadden started this season he would have the same numbers Zeke has so far?
 

CalPolyTechnique

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There's no comparison to McFadden and those backs and that's exactly what I've been pointing. lol Those backs got it done with average to bad QB situations and some didn't even have great OL's. The Cowboys drafted Zeke because they're looking for that kind of back someone that's special. McFadden is an average back and what he produced last season behind arguably the best OL in football was what any average back could have done. Now stop diverting and answer the questions. If a QB makes that big a difference to an RBs success then explain how Eric Dickerson, Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, Jim Brown, Earl Campbell and Adrian Peterson had so much production and HOF careers playing with average to bad QBs? If the QB makes the RB, how did Jamal Lewis rush for 2066 yards in 2003 with Kyle Boller and Anthony Wright? Go look at the numbers those QBs put up. If the QB makes that big a difference for a RB how did Chris Johnson rush for 2006 yards with Vince Young and Kerry Collins? Both were terrible! Do you believe if McFadden started this season he would have the same numbers Zeke has so far?

Pure genius.

Thanks for pointing out DMac is not comparable to any of the list HOF running backs.

Any other random and irrelevant thoughts for me?
 

KJJ

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Pure genius.

Thanks for pointing out DMac is not comparable to any of the list HOF running backs.

Any other random and irrelevant thoughts for me?

The fact he's not comparable is exactly why we used the 4th overall pick on Zeke because we're looking for a back that may end up being comparable to those backs. We were looking for a "special" back and we may have found one. Morris is only averaging 3.8 behind our great OL because the back matters! Let's see if you'll answer this question or continue to dance. If you had a do over, would you stay with McFadden as the starting RB and use the 4th overall pick on another position or would you have drafted Zeke? Let's see if your tune has changed since August when we had that big argument. :)
 

Supercowboy1986

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I just saw this thread. You a Ramsey guy?

As we sit 0-1 after one week there will be tons of consternation and angst.

Twill is still not very savvy, we still don't move Dez around to get him open, the defense still can't get stops when it counts. All legit.

But my biggest gripe is the issue which I think matters most long-term: Front Office.

This team looks just about ready to tank again for the 2nd year in a row. If it does the coaching staff doesn't matter because they'll all be gone. TWill is gone regardless imho. We will be drafting mostly defense for a couple seasons.

My biggest issue is the guys in charge of building for the 5 year and 10 year plans. I have solidly supported Will McClay and Stephen Jones. Now I am left scratching my head.

We looked to be doing so very well in the front office decision-making area. But the gambles on guys haven't paid off and the best decision we have made (letting Demarco Murray walk and repalcing him for nickels) was confusingly destroyed by using a top 5 pick and 5m a year at RB one year later. That was quite simply a stupid decision. Epically stupid. Basically insane and ignorant of this past decade of NFL football.

And last Sunday was a prime example. Let's say we win the game 22-20 after a good Dak drive and great Bailey kick.... It STILL would have been a really stupid football move.

Why? Alfred Morris who is making peanuts was the best RB Sunday.
Why part 2? With the game on the line we had to PASS the ball and we used Lance Dunbar at RB.
Why part 3? This team wins games on late Tony Romo drives. We KNOW that. He leads the league in 4th quarter comebacks.

RBs are not consistent over long periods so you get one, find his best form, ride him tilt he wheels fall off, rinse and repeat. You do NOT spend big money 1. because then you can't pay everyone else: See Minnesota. 2. they do not last and it cost to move on: See Demarco to Philly and virtually every other FA back that makes over 5m per year.
But the biggest cardinal sin of all is you DO NOT DRAFT RB top 5.
You do NOT win that way.
No one has in forever.
Todd Gurley is a true stud but the Rams are atrocious garbage dumpsters on offense.

You can not outsmart NFL history. Doesn't work that way.

Dallas over-committed resources to arguably the least critical position on the offense. (we played 3 players at the position on Sunday)
And we are about 5 players short on the roster.
All because we drafted druggies or wasted picks. --Gregory, J. Smith, Lawrence all recent high opicks and all absent.

And with the best ammunition we've had in over a decade we drafted a gosh dang RB.....
We looks real pretty wearing cut off shirts and all but he is a RB and he means little to overall success.
You do not run to win in the NFL. You run to keep people honest.
And if you are going to run to win, you need the best defense in football.
We have one of the worst.
The front office plan makes zero sense.
And that worries me because Jerry is just a figurehead with regards to personnel but Stephen is here for the long haul.
 

Manwiththeplan

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For the love of god, can we let this thread die? How long do we feel the need to rub everyone's nose in this?
 

drawandstrike

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"Football Stupid" has helped propel us to 11-1.

Just wait until this team has an actual top 5 defense with a pass rush to go with this offense....
 
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