Eagles Trade DB Eric Rowe

[Sydla]

And FWIW, the OL from the Pats is apparently no longer in the trade. So who knows what Philly got.

 

[darthseinfeld]

This is two years in a row the Eagles are smashing the trades numbers, they can't even blame Chip for this mess. Any other franchise would be getting raked over the coals but that first they aquired is giving them a pass. Crazy times.

Roseman is just not a good GM. He is creative, ill give him that. Probably too creative.

They have had the same personell issues the last couple years under Reid that they did with Kelly. Next offseason they will spend a ton in FA amd they will have the same issues under Peterson

Roseman is the new Dan Snyder

 

[Idgit]

Well for one, the GM is fixing Kelly's mistakes. What I don't get is why people can't give them some credit for having a pretty strong offseason.

- Last year we laughed at them for overpaying for Murray and Maxwell and how it was going to kill them. Their new GM not only dumped their salaries but was able to get Miami to let them move up to 8 from 13 by taking on their salaries.

- Some laughed at them for signing Bradford to all that money. They just turned Bradford into a #1 pick and if Minnesota does well this year, that 2nd pick could be a 3rd or even 2nd rounder.

- Some here laughed at them overpaying for Wentz, but through various deals, they basically got all their picks they gave up for Wentz back.

Did they have a perfect offseason? Of course not. But it's foolish IMO to not at least give them credit where credit is due. They've had a pretty successful offseason digging out from under what Kelly did.

This is what I'm talking about. It's not magic. They've got $20MM in dead cap space and some of you guys want to give them credit for digging the hole in the first place and then trying to fill it back up with dirt. You don't ignore the self inflicted damage they did and then complement them for putting a bandage on the head-wound.

And what form did that bandage really take? They signed Sam Bradford to 2 years, $35MM, then traded him. Daniel to a 3 year, $21MM deal with $12MM guaranteed, and then gave up a Maxwell, Kiko Alonzo, #8 pick in 2016, the #77 pick (third round) in 2016, the #100 pick (fourth round) in 2016, a 2017 first-rounder and a 2018 second-rounder to get up take Wentz (4 for $26MM with $17MM guaranteed). Wentz, who wasn't as advertised in camp. Wentz, who's going to be their starter now despite showing few signs that he's actually ready.

Their draft besides Wentz was 'mehh.' Their HC replacement for Kelly was less than 'mehh.' It was 'meh.' They got a break when Bridgewater went down the week before the season opener. To take advantage of that break, they coughed up their starting QB who's deal they just extended. Nobody thinks that's a big deal, but that's a huge deal for a team to deal it's starter the week they're preparing for game one of the regular season.

Their WR corps is bad. They picked up Reuben Randle to fix things and then turned around and cut him.

This thread started with them turning the #47 pick overall in 2015 into a 2018 fourth rounder. Hooray.

Overall, they've taken a 7-9 team, gutted the previous roster, mucked up their cap, mortgaged the future on a question mark, brought in an unispired coach who's claim to fame was his connection with the coach they let walk prior to Chip Kelly who actually knew what he was doing. If Wentz doesn't turn out for them, that team is going to be bad for years to come, and Wentz has a long way to go right now.

If Dallas had done any of these things, much less all of them, you'd be all over the Cowboys for the idiocy, and rightfully so. And we both know it.

 

[BAZ]

What?

This is two years in a row the Eagles are smashing the trades numbers,

 

[Sydla]

This is two years in a row the Eagles are smashing the trades numbers,

I apologize but I am not following. I must have taken my slow pills today. LOL.

 

[Sydla]

This is what I'm talking about. It's not magic. They've got $20MM in dead cap space and some of you guys want to give them credit for digging the hole in the first place and then trying to fill it back up with dirt. You don't ignore the self inflicted damage they did and then complement them for putting a bandage on the head-wound.

And what form did that bandage really take? They signed Sam Bradford to 2 years, $35MM, then traded him. Daniel to a 3 year, $21MM deal with $12MM guaranteed, and then gave up a Maxwell, Kiko Alonzo, #8 pick in 2016, the #77 pick (third round) in 2016, the #100 pick (fourth round) in 2016, a 2017 first-rounder and a 2018 second-rounder to get up take Wentz (4 for $26MM with $17MM guaranteed). Wentz, who wasn't as advertised in camp. Wentz, who's going to be their starter now despite showing few signs that he's actually ready.

Their draft besides Wentz was 'mehh.' Their HC replacement for Kelly was less than 'mehh.' It was 'meh.' They got a break when Bridgewater went down the week before the season opener. To take advantage of that break, they coughed up their starting QB who's deal they just extended. Nobody thinks that's a big deal, but that's a huge deal for a team to deal it's starter the week they're preparing for game one of the regular season.

Their WR corps is bad. They picked up Reuben Randle to fix things and then turned around and cut him.

This thread started with them turning the #47 pick overall in 2015 into a 2018 fourth rounder. Hooray.

Overall, they've taken a 7-9 team, gutted the previous roster, mucked up their cap, mortgaged the future on a question mark, brought in an unispired coach who's claim to fame was his connection with the coach they let walk prior to Chip Kelly who actually knew what he was doing. If Wentz doesn't turn out for them, that team is going to be bad for years to come, and Wentz has a long way to go right now.

If Dallas had done any of these things, much less all of them, you'd be all over the Cowboys for the idiocy, and rightfully so. And we both know it.

We should probably separate a few things. Kelly was the cause of a lot of this stuff. He signed Murray and Maxwell and traded McCoy for Alonso and drafted Rowe. He's no longer there. All I am commenting on is that their current GM has done a pretty good job of trying to unwind all the junk Kelly piled up. It wasn't Roseman who mucked up their cap, it was Kelly. But note, their cap situation based on Spotrac is close to ours. So if they mucked up their cap, so have we.

I think you are being a bit disingenuous here. I think you were one of the ones calling them stupid for signing up Maxwell to a huge contract and others. So you can't say they were dumb for signing him then try to rip them for trading him a year later. And again, they haven't lost all that much in moving up for Wentz now that they moved Bradford for a 1st rounder. Further, didn't you say the Eagles weren't going to be good this year anyway? So what's it matter that they just traded their starter in Bradford? They weren't going to win anything anyway.

Are they a good team? Nope. But given the situation Kelly put them in, I think the GM has done a decent job of trying to dig out of that hole. Certainly it comes down to Wentz. If he busts they have to go back to the drawing board on finding a QB. But is that any different than us if Prescott fails? Romo's shelf life appears to be getting shorter and shorter.

And you are wrong about what I would say about the Cowboys if they did some of this stuff. Do you forget, I was one of the ones who said they would have been fine if they had moved up to #2 to take Wentz? So no, if the Cowboys had given up a first rounder and some other picks to get Wentz and then somehow recouped a couple of those picks in a later deal, I'd think the Cowboys did a pretty good job. I was also one of the ones saying they should have spent money in free agency on guys like Ayers at DE or Mario Williams at DE.

 

[BAZ]

I apologize but I am not following. I must have taken my slow pills today. LOL.

Last year they traded three or four players, this year it's like five or something, they crazy.

 

[Idgit]

We should probably separate a few things. Kelly was the cause of a lot of this stuff. He signed Murray and Maxwell and traded McCoy for Alonso and drafted Rowe. He's no longer there. All I am commenting on is that their current GM has done a pretty good job of trying to unwind all the junk Kelly piled up. It wasn't Roseman who mucked up their cap, it was Kelly. But note, their cap situation based on Spotrac is close to ours. So if they mucked up their cap, so have we.

I think you are being a bit disingenuous here. I think you were one of the ones calling them stupid for signing up Maxwell to a huge contract and others. So you can't say they were dumb for signing him then try to rip them for trading him a year later. And again, they haven't lost all that much in moving up for Wentz now that they moved Bradford for a 1st rounder. Further, didn't you say the Eagles weren't going to be good this year anyway? So what's it matter that they just traded their starter in Bradford? They weren't going to win anything anyway.

Are they a good team? Nope. But given the situation Kelly put them in, I think the GM has done a decent job of trying to dig out of that hole. Certainly it comes down to Wentz. If he busts they have to go back to the drawing board on finding a QB. But is that any different than us if Prescott fails? Romo's shelf life appears to be getting shorter and shorter.

And you are wrong about what I would say about the Cowboys if they did some of this stuff. Do you forget, I was one of the ones who said they would have been fine if they had moved up to #2 to take Wentz? So no, if the Cowboys had given up a first rounder and some other picks to get Wentz and then somehow recouped a couple of those picks in a later deal, I'd think the Cowboys did a pretty good job. I was also one of the ones saying they should have spent money in free agency on guys like Ayers at DE or Mario Williams at DE.

I don't separate them the way you do. It's more reasonable to hold them responsible for all of their various decisions. But the list I provided above included gaffes from both the last few offseasons and this current one. Either way, they've been all over the place, made a lot of bad decisions, hamstrung their team, and now they're trying to make things right again. And it's yet to be seen whether they're doing that or making things worse by gambling too many picks on too long a longshot. As far as I'm concerned, they're in the worst position of any of the NFCE teams for the foreseeable future.

There's nothing disingenuous for criticizing both a decision to enter into a bad contract and a separate decision to bail from that contract after one season. I'm not ripping them for the trades--they were lucky to find somebody to unload the bad contracts onto. I'm saying they both entered into a bunch of bad contracts *and* showed that they lacked any semblance of a workable long-term plan by then bailing on those deals the next season. Both criticisms are fair.

But you're right: I shouldn't have suggested you'd blast the Cowboys for overpaying for a chance to draft Wentz. I remember clearly you were strongly in favor of Dallas making that dangerous unnecessary gamble. And in PHI's case, they didn't have an actual franchise guy on the roster when they made the moves, so at least the moves made more sense than if we had sold the farm to move up the two spots it would have taken to land Wentz.

 

[LandryFan]

I apologize but I am not following. I must have taken my slow pills today. LOL.

You're not alone.

 

[Sydla]

I don't separate them the way you do. It's more reasonable to hold them responsible for all of their various decisions. But the list I provided above included gaffes from both the last few offseasons and this current one. Either way, they've been all over the place, made a lot of bad decisions, hamstrung their team, and now they're trying to make things right again. And it's yet to be seen whether they're doing that or making things worse by gambling too many picks on too long a longshot. As far as I'm concerned, they're in the worst position of any of the NFCE teams for the foreseeable future.

There's nothing disingenuous for criticizing both a decision to enter into a bad contract and a separate decision to bail from that contract after one season. I'm not ripping them for the trades--they were lucky to find somebody to unload the bad contracts onto. I'm saying they both entered into a bunch of bad contracts *and* showed that they lacked any semblance of a workable long-term plan by then bailing on those deals the next season. Both criticisms are fair.

But you're right: I shouldn't have suggested you'd blast the Cowboys for overpaying for a chance to draft Wentz. I remember clearly you were strongly in favor of Dallas making that dangerous unnecessary gamble. And in PHI's case, they didn't have an actual franchise guy on the roster when they made the moves, so at least the moves made more sense than if we had sold the farm to move up the two spots it would have taken to land Wentz.

So you want to criticize them for signing average players to bad contracts but then they should be criticized for not having a long term plan built around those average players? Huh?

 

[Idgit]

So you want to criticize them for signing average players to bad contracts but then they should be criticized for not having a long term plan built around those average players? Huh?

Hmmm. I criticize them for signing bad deals in the first place, and I criticize them for bailing on contracts after a single year because that's further evidence how bad the decision was to begin with and because there are generally implications with cutting contracts sooner rather than later. Pretty straightforward.

Is it weird as a Cowboys fan to be defending a bunch of obvious mistakes the Eagles front office has made here, recently? That would feel weird to me.

 

[Sydla]

Hmmm. I criticize them for signing bad deals in the first place, and I criticize them for bailing on contracts after a single year because that's further evidence how bad the decision was to begin with and because there are generally implications with cutting contracts sooner rather than later. Pretty straightforward.

Is it weird as a Cowboys fan to be defending a bunch of obvious mistakes the Eagles front office has made here, recently? That would feel weird to me.

So again, criticize them for signing average players to bad contracts and then criticize them again for realizing they were dumb deals and working to get out from under them. Trading those guys isn't worthy of criticism. It's proof they were idiots a year ago, sure, but actually moving Maxwell and Alonso was a pretty shrewd move by them.

It's not weird to defend the Eagles at all. I try to not to look at things through blue and silver glasses where everything every other team does is stupid and wrong and everything we do is great. I think the Commanders have had two pretty good offseasons as well. Giants? Ehhhh........ I think they overpaid for some of their FAs.

PS - Their cap pain is fairly minimal. They took their pain this year but even as of today, they have like $11MM in cap space according to Spotrac and we have $14MM. Next year they are projected to have as much cap room as we will.

 

[Idgit]

So again, criticize them for signing average players to bad contracts and then criticize them again for realizing they were dumb deals and working to get out from under them. Trading those guys isn't worthy of criticism. It's proof they were idiots a year ago, sure, but actually moving Maxwell and Alonso was a pretty shrewd move by them.

It's not weird to defend the Eagles at all. I try to not to look at things through blue and silver glasses where everything every other team does is stupid and wrong and everything we do is great.

PS - Their cap pain is fairly minimal. As of today, they have like $11MM in cap space according to Spotrac and we have $14MM.

I can imagine it'd be hard to put on the blue and silver glasses when the green and silver ones fit so nicely.

You can say you try to be objective all you want, but your post history makes it clear you're more prepared to be more critical of a team that's had a lot more stability here recently than your are a division rival who's made a lot of really questionable calls and had a ton of organizational dysfunction and upheaval during the same period.

Bad decisions are bad decisions, no matter which team makes them. If I'd ever even remotely implied 'everything every other team does is stupid and wrong' or that 'everything we do is great' I might be able to see where you're coming from. For my part, I criticize the Cowboys for the things they do I think are short-sighted (neglecting the defense, not addressing QB2 seriously in the offseason, over drafting RBs with a top pick), and I criticize the Eagles for the stupid contracts, overcommitting to the wrong QBs, giving up too much to get an unproven player, overpaying for a high-mileage RB who was never a fit for what they want to do on offense.

 

[Sydla]

I can imagine it'd be hard to put on the blue and silver glasses when the green and silver ones fit so nicely.

You can say you try to be objective all you want, but your post history makes it clear you're more prepared to be more critical of a team that's had a lot more stability here recently than your are a division rival who's made a lot of really questionable calls and had a ton of organizational dysfunction and upheaval during the same period.

Bad decisions are bad decisions, no matter which team makes them. If I'd ever even remotely implied 'everything every other team does is stupid and wrong' or that 'everything we do is great' I might be able to see where you're coming from. For my part, I criticize the Cowboys for the things they do I think are short-sighted (neglecting the defense, not addressing QB2 seriously in the offseason, over drafting RBs with a top pick), and I criticize the Eagles for the stupid contracts, overcommitting to the wrong QBs, giving up too much to get an unproven player, overpaying for a high-mileage RB who was never a fit for what they want to do on offense.

My commentary on the Eagles has been specific to one thing. What they've done this offseason. That's it. All I have said is I think they have had a pretty successful offseason trying to dig out from under some of the dumb moves Kelly made. You seem to think I am somehow giving them a pass for what they did the previous couple of offseasons. I am not. Kelly made some really boneheaded decisions whether that be drafting a guy like Marcus Smith or trading away McCoy or overpaying for Murray or making Maxwell one of the highest paid CBs in football. Dumb decisions. Really dumb decisions.

Now given all of that, I think it's downright strange to then criticize them for moving their bad contracts, being able to recoup some picks they gave up to get their franchise QB (and yes I understand you think Wentz is likely a bum). Frankly, I think it's a minor miracle they were able to not only dump a bad contract on the Dolphins but then get them to swap first round picks with them. I think it's a miracle (and some luck as well) they could turn Bradford into a first round pick. But they did it. And given the absolutely brain dead things Kelly did, to be able to be able to unwind some of his damage is worthy of some praise.

And your green and silver goggles comment is hilariopus. If anything, the team I think has been the best in the offseason the last couple of years had been the Commanders, and have said so in other threads........... not the Eagles. I think their GM is the best in the division.

 

[Idgit]

My commentary on the Eagles has been specific to one thing. What they've done this offseason. That's it. All I have said is I think they have had a pretty successful offseason trying to dig out from under some of the dumb moves Kelly made. You seem to think I am somehow giving them a pass for what they did the previous couple of offseasons. I am not. Kelly made some really boneheaded decisions whether that be drafting a guy like Marcus Smith or trading away McCoy or overpaying for Murray or making Maxwell one of the highest paid CBs in football. Dumb decisions. Really dumb decisions.

Now given all of that, I think it's downright strange to then criticize them for moving their bad contracts, being able to recoup some picks they gave up to get their franchise QB (and yes I understand you think Wentz is likely a bum). Frankly, I think it's a minor miracle they were able to not only dump a bad contract on the Dolphins but then get them to swap first round picks with them. I think it's a miracle (and some luck as well) they could turn Bradford into a first round pick. But they did it. And given the absolutely brain dead things Kelly did, to be able to be able to unwind some of his damage is worthy of some praise.

And your green and silver goggles comment is hilariopus. If anything, the team I think has been the best in the offseason the last couple of years had been the Commanders, and have said so in other threads........... not the Eagles. I think their GM is the best in the division.

I've probably agreed with you in those other threads about the Commanders. If he manages his addiction properly, Scott McCloughan is a force to be reckoned with.

We can agree to disagree on the Eagles' performance here. Setting aside the my original post on the topic which you replied to explicitly was not referring to just this offseason, they still overpaid to extend a bad QB, overpaid for his backup, hired a uninspiring HC to replace the disastrous situation they created for themselves the prior offseason, and then sold the farm to bring in a player who's not really ready to start. And then they elevated him to a starting position when they didn't have to.

The trade with MIN was 100% lucky and only happened because they'd gotten themselves jammed up with too many QB resources in the first place. I agree that they got the better end of the deal, as any team would have in that circumstance. They got bailed out the same way Dallas got bailed out for mishandling their QB2 problem this offseason.

 

[Stash]

I thought back in that draft, Rowe would have made a good safety candidate. Philly tried him at CB and he just never took to the position. Going to be interesting to see what the magician in New England can do with him.

Make us regret not acting on him is my guess.

And yet JJ Wilcox sticks around...

 

[Idgit]

Make us regret not acting on him is my guess.

And yet JJ Wilcox sticks around...

I liked Rowe coming out.

It's a bummer we didn't hit gold with Kavon Frazier this year. Had he shown a bit more, he should have been able to bump JJ off the roster. That was a position at cutdowns where I thought we'd very likely bring in a veteran and replace Wilcox to save some money. Still kind of surprised we didn't.

 

[Stash]

Well for one, the GM is fixing Kelly's mistakes. What I don't get is why people can't give them some credit for having a pretty strong offseason.

- Last year we laughed at them for overpaying for Murray and Maxwell and how it was going to kill them. Their new GM not only dumped their salaries but was able to get Miami to let them move up to 8 from 13 by taking on their salaries.

- Some laughed at them for signing Bradford to all that money. They just turned Bradford into a #1 pick and if Minnesota does well this year, that 2nd pick could be a 3rd or even 2nd rounder.

- Some here laughed at them overpaying for Wentz, but through various deals, they basically got all their picks they gave up for Wentz back.

Did they have a perfect offseason? Of course not. But it's foolish IMO to not at least give them credit where credit is due. They've had a pretty successful offseason digging out from under what Kelly did.

I can give them credit. While they obviously made a huge mistake in giving Chip Kelly the power he had, they're doing what they can to rectify it - and quickly. While it was a mistake in the first place, and Kelly gutted the team of talent, Roseman has quickly taken plenty of steps to turn negatives into positives. Moves I never thought he could get done. And he's already done it multiple times.

And I'm not color-blinded, so I can give credit where credit is due.

That said, I like Rowe the player and wish we'd have been the team to have traded for him.mand we'll see how this deal do up working out for them.

But the others for Maxwell, Alonzo, Murray, and now Bradford? Yeah, they did much better on all of them than anyone could have expected and deserve credit for it.

 

[Stash]

I liked Rowe coming out.

It's a bummer we didn't hit gold with Kavon Frazier this year. Had he shown a bit more, he should have been able to bump JJ off the roster. That was a position at cutdowns where I thought we'd very likely bring in a veteran and replace Wilcox to save some money. Still kind of surprised we didn't.

You and me both brother!


I still can't figure this 53-man roster out. The only assumption I can make is that Bisaccia is being given way too much leeway over the roster for special teams.

 

[Idgit]

You and me both brother!


I still can't figure this 53-man roster out. The only assumption I can make is that Bisaccia is being given way too much leeway over the roster for special teams.

They made some weird choices. Swanson making it, for one. Rod Smith made no sense to me unless it's purely for STs. With Keith Smith, at least you know they think he can play LB, too, so between that and FB and Teams he makes sense. They must think with him and Wiber having position flex they have the luxury of keeping a couple of players they really like at positions where we have an abundance of talent. There were definitely some head-scratchers going on.