Fixing the secondary will prove difficult this year

[Galian Beast]

Here I am going to speculate on what the Cowboys will do in regards to fixing the secondary and what talk about what I would like them to do.

I think you have to start off with what we're doing regarding what is already on our team.

First is the question of cutting Carr. When do you do it and how do you do it? I see two scenarios.

A) They cut him right away and they open up an additional 6.38 million against the cap. This means we take the brunt of the entire dead money up front.

B) You make him a June 1st cut or you actually cut him during Training Camp before the season starts and keep him on as an insurance policy, which I'm sure he won't be pleased with. It will be interesting to see if he decides to hold out as a result. You gain about 3 million more dollars, but you can't use any of the money until after June 1st in either scenario. Doesn't really help us rebuild our team now.

I'd prefer scenario A. It's a lot less messy and helps us immediately.

The second question is what to do about Morris Claiborne.

If Claiborne signs somewhere, I don't see him signing a long term deal. He is 26 and arguably had his best career, but no one is going to give him big money for it right now. Instead he would be better off playing on a one year deal, and proving that he can be consistent and productive.

I'm going to say 1 year, 2 million dollars. Take it or leave it. My guess is he isn't here next year to be honest. If I'm him, I take that contract else where.

That leaves us with needing to replace two corners (we can't really rely on Scandrick).

I think we need to go expensive on one and cheap on the other, but looking at who is available and the pickings are pretty skimpy, which is probably why Adam Jones' name was floated out there. They might even overpay Claiborne for one year simply to not have to enter this dry market.

I almost want to say that you stand pat with your safeties as is, especially if you can have Jones man one spot. It would be nice to get Jalen Ramsey, but even as it stands, we might need him or Jones if not both of them to play corner....

Both free agency and the draft don't look great for secondary players and it happens to be one of our largest positions of need.

I think they probably learned a big lesson after overpaying Carr in Free Agency. I don't see them giving a ton of money to a #2 corner again.

I think they'll want to stand pat this year, and focus on the defensive line as much as they can. You can probably get a really good tackle early in the second round.

 

[LatinMind]

Here I am going to speculate on what the Cowboys will do in regards to fixing the secondary and what talk about what I would like them to do.

I think you have to start off with what we're doing regarding what is already on our team.

First is the question of cutting Carr. When do you do it and how do you do it? I see two scenarios.

A) They cut him right away and they open up an additional 6.38 million against the cap. This means we take the brunt of the entire dead money up front.

B) You make him a June 1st cut or you actually cut him during Training Camp before the season starts and keep him on as an insurance policy, which I'm sure he won't be pleased with. It will be interesting to see if he decides to hold out as a result. You gain about 3 million more dollars, but you can't use any of the money until after June 1st in either scenario. Doesn't really help us rebuild our team now.

I'd prefer scenario A. It's a lot less messy and helps us immediately.

The second question is what to do about Morris Claiborne.

If Claiborne signs somewhere, I don't see him signing a long term deal. He is 26 and arguably had his best career, but no one is going to give him big money for it right now. Instead he would be better off playing on a one year deal, and proving that he can be consistent and productive.

I'm going to say 1 year, 2 million dollars. Take it or leave it. My guess is he isn't here next year to be honest. If I'm him, I take that contract else where.

That leaves us with needing to replace two corners (we can't really rely on Scandrick).

I think we need to go expensive on one and cheap on the other, but looking at who is available and the pickings are pretty skimpy, which is probably why Adam Jones' name was floated out there. They might even overpay Claiborne for one year simply to not have to enter this dry market.

I almost want to say that you stand pat with your safeties as is, especially if you can have Jones man one spot. It would be nice to get Jalen Ramsey, but even as it stands, we might need him or Jones if not both of them to play corner....

Both free agency and the draft don't look great for secondary players and it happens to be one of our largest positions of need.

I think they probably learned a big lesson after overpaying Carr in Free Agency. I don't see them giving a ton of money to a #2 corner again.

I think they'll want to stand pat this year, and focus on the defensive line as much as they can. You can probably get a really good tackle early in the second round.

If you fix the passrush the secondary will fall in line. Wish people would understand this

 

[The Natural]

If you fix the passrush the secondary will fall in line. Wish people would understand this

Well supposedly all those "rushmen" were supposed to fix the pass rush last year.

 

[Galian Beast]

If you fix the passrush the secondary will fall in line. Wish people would understand this

The Natural made my point. I do think fixing the line helps the secondary, but it is also a two way street.

The point of my OP is that trying to fix the secondary now will be costly and probably ineffective, it will be more conducive to success to keep focus on the defensive line.

Ndemichke would be a great pick up in the second round if he is still there.

I would like to see us bring Hardy back, but I'll speak to that more in my next thread.

 

[NorthwestDallas40]

I tend to disagree. In today's NFL, three-step drops and quick passes from the shotgun are the norm. You need good CBs to defeat that. You saw what Brady did to us: passes underneath to Edelman and Gronk all day and our CBs were not even in the picture. Sadly, this was the norm for the last decade. And the stats bear this out: we have consistently ranked in the bottom of the league in passes defensed and INTs. This means that our CBs just are not close to the ball. No pass rusher can help this. We need a revamped secondary first and foremost, IMO.

 

[Galian Beast]

I tend to disagree. In today's NFL, three-step drops and quick passes from the shotgun are the norm. You need good CBs to defeat that. You saw what Brady did to us: passes underneath to Edelman and Gronk all day and our CBs were not even in the picture. Sadly, this was the norm for the last decade. And the stats bear this out: we have consistently ranked in the bottom of the league in passes defensed and INTs. This means that our CBs just are not close to the ball. No pass rusher can help this. We need a revamped secondary first and foremost, IMO.

I think if you look back at that game against the Patriots, we were able to hang in there in the first half due to the pass rush. Once they took care of the rush, the game got out of hand.

 

[texbumthelife]

I still can't help but laugh at offering a one year $2 M deal. That's absurd. He shouldn't even consider it.

 

[NorthwestDallas40]

I think if you look back at that game against the Patriots, we were able to hang in there in the first half due to the pass rush. Once they took care of the rush, the game got out of hand.

Yea, exactly, they started throwing underneath to protect Brady from the rush and he carved us up. We could not stop it because our corners cannot cover.

I agree the rush and coverage help each other. But our coverage is so below par that I think that should be overhauled first.

 

[Galian Beast]

I still can't help but laugh at offering a one year $2 M deal. That's absurd. He shouldn't even consider it.

Newman played on a 2.25 million dollar contract last year. Much better than Claiborne at this point.

 

[Galian Beast]

Yea, exactly, they started throwing underneath to protect Brady from the rush and he carved us up. We could not stop it because our corners cannot cover.

I agree the rush and coverage help each other. But our coverage is so below par that I think that should be overhauled first.

How?

 

[NorthwestDallas40]

How?

I'd pass on Janoris Jenkins or Prince Amukamura, and I'd sign Casey Hayward to an affordable deal. His first two years, he was highly ranked cover corner by PFF. He got hurt and played poorly in year three, when he was supplanted by Sam Shields. But he was a former high draft pick and is a good coverage guy. I'd start him and OScan on the outside and Byron Jones and Church at S's. Then, I would draft another CB in the top 3 rounds to eventually serve as a nickel CB (but to play outside while OScan plays inside). Of course, I would take Ramsey at #4 if he is available and we decide not to pick a QB.

 

[Galian Beast]

I'd pass on Janoris Jenkins or Prince Amukamura, and I'd sign Casey Hayward to an affordable deal. His first two years, he was highly ranked cover corner by PFF. He got hurt and played poorly in year three, when he was supplanted by Sam Shields. But he was a former high draft pick and is a good coverage guy. I'd start him and OScan on the outside and Byron Jones and Church at S's. Then, I would draft another CB in the top 3 rounds to eventually serve as a nickel CB (but to play outside while OScan plays inside). Of course, I would take Ramsey at #4 if he is available and we decide not to pick a QB.

I think you underestimate how much these guys are going to get in free agency.

What is an affordable deal to you?

 

[TonyS]

I thought our corners were built for man coverage and Marinara's scheme didn't fit their skillsets. When I see them giving WRs 15+ yds on 3rd and 5, it makes me think someone is telling them to do that. Could they be better than we give them credit for?

 

[gmoney112]

I'd pass on Janoris Jenkins or Prince Amukamura, and I'd sign Casey Hayward to an affordable deal. His first two years, he was highly ranked cover corner by PFF. He got hurt and played poorly in year three, when he was supplanted by Sam Shields. But he was a former high draft pick and is a good coverage guy. I'd start him and OScan on the outside and Byron Jones and Church at S's. Then, I would draft another CB in the top 3 rounds to eventually serve as a nickel CB (but to play outside while OScan plays inside). Of course, I would take Ramsey at #4 if he is available and we decide not to pick a QB.

Hayward was ranked so highly because he was never a #1. PFF doesn't take into account who they're actually covering. Don't get me wrong, he's an above average corner and if we get him for a good price I'm all for it.

No idea what the OP is talking about, this draft is pretty deep at corner. You have decent guys in the 3-4 this year. If William Jackson falls to 34, which I'm starting to doubt, he'd be an excellent addition to Byron in the secondary.

It's hard to fix the secondary, if you want to be cheap. If you're willing to throw some cash and a solid draft pick at it, we can go a long way.

Yes, it all starts up front, but it ends in the back. How many competitive teams have garbage back there? Patriots paid Revis during their SB run, Seahawks have a legit #1 and the best safety duo in the NFL, Panthers have Norman and safeties that are well respected, Denver is stacked at CB and have at least one legit safety in Ward.

Byron is going to be a great safety, if only for the fact he's incredibly athletic and smart.

I'd sign two corners in FA and target a legitimate guy in the draft. I'd probably resign Mo as insurance even though I wouldn't be happy about it. I wish Tillman hadn't gotten hurt, for a million bucks he'd be awesome insurance.

 

[NorthwestDallas40]

I think you underestimate how much these guys are going to get in free agency.

What is an affordable deal to you?

High echelon CBs are paid $13-14M a year (Revis, Peterson, Sherman & Franchise tagged). Carr is currently earning $10M a year. I would be fine with cutting Carr and paying Hayward $8-9M a year. And then drafting a CB in top 3 rounds that we'll get for 4 years at about $700K a year.

 

[conner01]

I think you underestimate how much these guys are going to get in free agency.

What is an affordable deal to you?

I think fans really don't get what guys are gonna get paid. Just look at what the Eagles and Broncos did with their qb's
That's some huge contracts for the caliber of player and while qb's are different I suspect 2 mil a year won't get you a CB much better than the kids we brought in late last year. Salaries are going up a cross the board.
I don't like Mo myself but he is well worth trying to keep and I would draft a CB, maybe another late. But I suspect out first 2 picks are going to come down to two of these positions, RB, DE and DT maybe a QB if someone falls so that means 3rd rnd or trade back up to the second for a CB and while I think there are 5 or so good CB prospects in this draft I don't see any of them falling to the third. If we trade down at 4 and add another second that could be a spot to get a guy

 

[rockj7]

If you fix the passrush the secondary will fall in line. Wish people would understand this

So in your theory Seattle's front 7 made their secondary.

 

[demirji22]

We have Scandrick who is our best corner and hopefully will come back healthy and i would like to go after the following :
Casey Hayward from Green Bay
Janoris Jenkis from St Louis
Adam Jones from Cincinatti
Prince Amukamara from NYG

 

[Frozen700]

Get rid of Carr and MO and you already made improvements

 

[NEODOG]

Draft Ramsey
Sign JJenkins
Re sign MO

It's not that difficult to accomplish.... Take a flyer on Killibrew if available in 3rd