Football 101: The Talent Evaluation Process

[Doomsay]

What team have you been following?

I was going to post this after me previous post discussing the past 16 yrs under Jerry since our last SB.

As I see it, there's a clear line in the sand with this franchise post Johnson and that year is 2003. That's when Jerry made the decision that what he had been doing since 1994 was simply not working. Lacewell did a subpar job as a GM and the FO and coaching staff needed a face lift. Shoot, it needed to get ripped up and that's exactly what happened.

And since then we've gone:

2003 10-6 made playoffs
2004 6-10
2005 9-7
2006 9-7 made playoffs
2007 13-3 made playoffs, final 8 team.
2008 9-7
2009 11-5 made playoffs, final 8 team.
2010 6-10
2011 8-8

That's 81-63. A .5625 winning percentage. That's not bad. Not good enough for me. But certainly better than a team with a supposed major handicap that is an impediment to winning.

I believe that we are tied for 6th fewest playoff wins over the past decade in a half. Most of the teams occupying that same cellar are either from smaller market or economically challenged areas. One is a new expansion team and few if any have had the benefit of a franchise QB for an extended time during the period in question. Certainly not one that came so cheaply (in terms of draft picks).

I do agree that 2003 was seemingly an inflection point in this team's prospects. But you have to ask yourself why that was an important date, and whether it really was a point of departure or just an interregnum?

 

[Risen Star]

I think Gailey definitely got a raw deal. But then again, you can say that about any head coach post-Jimmy that came here.

A GM's the head coach's best friend and with friends like Jerry, who needs enemies?

 

[sonnyboy]

I believe that we are tied for 6th fewest playoff wins over the past decade in a half. Most of the teams occupying that same cellar are either from smaller market or economically challenged areas. One is a new expansion team and few if any have had the benefit of a franchise QB for an extended time during the period in question. Certainly not one that came so cheaply (in terms of draft picks).

I do agree that 2003 was seemingly an inflection point in this team's prospects. But you have to ask yourself why that was an important date, and whether it really was a point of departure or just an interregnum?

The issue I have most of all is this idea that Jones and his system is an impediment to winning. Look, I'm the last person to thump my chest over the past 10yrs. One post season win, 2 final 8's is far from exceptional performance.

Hypothetically speaking, it easily could've been 4 post season wins, 3 final 8's, 1 NFC Championship game and a SB loss.

No real stretch here. We win in Seattle in 06 and against the Giants and Packers in 2007, before losing to the Pats in the same year. I believe most would agree that scenario could have just as easily played out as what actually did. And it probably more in line with our regular season performance of that time frame.

But in the final analysis, that too would not have been good enough.

Any way you cut it, this is a highly competitive league and winning is extremely difficult. 2 losing seasons in 10 aint bad.

Whenever a team has a non losing season, that almost always means they were at least in the payoff hunt. You tell me the Cowboys are going to have 8 non losing seasons in the next 10 and I'll jump on that in a NY second.

And take my chances we'll make a couple SB runs in those 8 non losing seasons.

 

[junk]

No, he's the owner and he's probably the best marketing guy in the game.

Yep, he's a good marketer. He should focus on that. He does spend a lot of time on that. Time that a GM should be spending building a football team.

Tell me, how do you reconcile these fantasies about how other owners are involved (suddenly everyone admits this) in football matters, and how they are involved? Do you simply imagine that they let their business get run any way everyone else wants?

Not sure what "get run any way everyone else wants" means. I'm sure every team is different when it comes to the amount of involvement from the owner.

He's the owner. He's the GM, but the GM is merely a title when compared to how other GMs in the NFL operate. They still have to answer to owners. Jerry is involved. I have never said he isn't. But as the GM he is this face that you guys can't get out of your heads.

Here is what I can't reconcile with that stance. If Jerry believes that his GM role is only a title, why did he basically run Jimmy out of town over control of personnel? Why did he state that he felt like he was walking on eggshells when Parcells was around?

If he was just a "figure head", why would he care?

Our top football guy is Tom Ciskowski, like the GMs he answers to the owner. He is absolutely qualified to do his job as evidenced by the fact Indianpolis was thinking of bringing him in to replace Bill Polian, a man once heralded as our only hope, but who now is a moron.

So is Ciskowski setting the direction of the team? Was pursuing Roy Williams his idea?

There are football guys in charge of the football decisions which he is made aware of, is part of, and ratifies. He's a hell of a lot shrewder than most in here give him credit for. I'd say that he got more football sense than at least 95% of his harshest critics.

They can't get past the title even if you point out where he is NOT making all the decisions and everyone else just nods.

That is probably part of the problem. The GM should be making all the decisions. I think most of the Cowboys major gaffes actually occur when Jerry does inject himself in the process. He doesn't put the time in to be properly informed and makes rash decisions as a result.

I'd be very surprised if the Roy Williams trade didn't have his fingerprints all over it. Alternately, I'd be very surprised if Jerry had much to do with UDFAs. The cameras are off and he just signs bonus checks for the guys the scouts recommend. Dallas does pretty well there.

 

[Hostile]

Yep, he's a good marketer. He should focus on that. He does spend a lot of time on that. Time that a GM should be spending building a football team.

Right, Ciskowski spends that time on building the football team. Chris Hall does. Judd Garrett does. Todd Williams does. Stephen Jones does. The scouts do. Jason Garrett and his staff do. The team is not in any way neglected.

Here is what I can't reconcile with that stance. If Jerry believes that his GM role is only a title, why did he basically run Jimmy out of town over control of personnel? Why did he state that he felt like he was walking on eggshells when Parcells was around?

Wait, I haven't said Jerry believes that. Jerry believes nothing happens without his stamp of approval. But he gives his football people whatever they ask for, want, or need. The boss approves. He's involved.

So is Ciskowski setting the direction of the team? Was pursuing Roy Williams his idea?

It was a Dallas Cowboys idea. Who knows who first floated the idea? Actually I do know but I won't share that. Then it was discussed as a team. When they decided as a team to go get him then Jerry told Todd Williams and Stephen to make it happen, and they did.

That is probably part of the problem. The GM should be making all the decisions. I think most of the Cowboys major gaffes actually occur when Jerry does inject himself in the process. He doesn't put the time in to be properly informed and makes rash decisions as a result.

No GM in the entire NFL makes "all of the decisions." Head Coaches are involved. Owners are involved. Scouting departments are involved. Front Office personnel are involved.

Alternately, I'd be very surprised if Jerry had much to do with UDFAs. The cameras are off and he just signs bonus checks for the guys the scouts recommend. Dallas does pretty well there.

Dare I hope this is going to burgeon into an epiphany?

 

[honyock]

Thanks Hos, I'm late to this thread and just read all 10 pages. Really informative OP. As a fan who gets few peeks into the inner workings of the team, it was great information. And then of course, the bonus of 10 pages of, um, really entertaining reading.

One thing that struck me was that under the structure you describe, it works best with a strong coach with a vision of the kind of team he wants to build. Jimmy and Parcells both had that vision. The others, not so much by my impression. My hope since Garrett was hired has been that he has that kind of vision. (not going into the "does he suck as a coach" debate). I liked what I saw in the 2011 draft, a lot. Whether the players pan out or not, it was the first draft in a while that showed what looked to be a cohesive plan for putting together a team, and patience to take their guys and not reach. I attributed that to Garrett's influence, without really knowing whether that was true or not. My inference from what you described is that it really did have his imprint all over the draft. The next two drafts and FA seasons will really tell the tale, as the team comes out of cap hell and has more flexibility to fill holes through FA and infuse young talent via the draft. How they do that will reflect on Garrett for better or worse. I'm betting (hoping) that it will be for the better.

 

[junk]

Wait, I haven't said Jerry believes that. Jerry believes nothing happens without his stamp of approval. But he gives his football people whatever they ask for, want, or need. The boss approves. He's involved.

So you are saying Jerry is a figurehead, but he doesn't know that?

It was a Dallas Cowboys idea. Who knows who first floated the idea? Actually I do know but I won't share that. Then it was discussed as a team. When they decided as a team to go get him then Jerry told Todd Williams and Stephen to make it happen, and they did.

Please share. It would certainly enlighten us as to how the power structure in Dallas works.

No GM in the entire NFL makes "all of the decisions." Head Coaches are involved. Owners are involved. Scouting departments are involved. Front Office personnel are involved.

Of course people have input. But your GM should be that guy that is there day in and day out leading that group of people and formulating the path forward for the franchise.

Dare I hope this is going to burgeon into an epiphany?

Not really. I'm still not sure what your point is. What I've gathered so far, is that you believe that Jerry is a figurehead, he doesn't know it, all the real work is really done by other people and the guy leading player personnel is either Tom Ciskowski or Jason Garrett depending upon which post of yours I read and the point you are trying to make at that time.

I think Jerry periodically interjects himself at random times in the process and does so without having done the homework to really make an informed decision. I think he checks out during the UDFA phase, so the worker bees get to do their job without interference and things turn out all right.

Bottom line, Jerry isn't a talent evaluator. He never has been. He has no background or training in it. Compare his bio to other successful GMs in the league. I suspect most could be summarized as "spent many years honing his craft before being promoted to GM" while Jerry's would say "Bought team, made self GM"

 

[birdwells1]

No, he's the owner and he's probably the best marketing guy in the game.

Tell me, how do you reconcile these fantasies about how other owners are involved (suddenly everyone admits this) in football matters, and how they are involved? Do you simply imagine that they let their business get run any way everyone else wants?

It's mind boggling how limited in scope that is.

He's the owner. He's the GM, but the GM is merely a title when compared to how other GMs in the NFL operate. They still have to answer to owners. Jerry is involved. I have never said he isn't. But as the GM he is this face that you guys can't get out of your heads.

Our top football guy is Tom Ciskowski, like the GMs he answers to the owner. He is absolutely qualified to do his job as evidenced by the fact Indianpolis was thinking of bringing him in to replace Bill Polian, a man once heralded as our only hope, but who now is a moron.

It is amazing how the goalposts move for you guys.

There are football guys in charge of the football decisions which he is made aware of, is part of, and ratifies. He's a hell of a lot shrewder than most in here give him credit for. I'd say that he got more football sense than at least 95% of his harshest critics.

They can't get past the title even if you point out where he is NOT making all the decisions and everyone else just nods.

The Dallas Cowboys were the most popular team in the NFL when jj bought them, since then the league has grown and so has the Cowboy's popularity. To me that doesn't make JJ a marketing genius now if he could make Jacksonville or Cleveland national teams I'd be impressed but not with the boys.

That's kind of like the new CEO of McDonalds bragging about how they are number 1 in restaurant sells under his watch.

 

[Alexander]

I think Jerry periodically interjects himself at random times in the process and does so without having done the homework to really make an informed decision.

This is the biggest problem, without question. If he were completely involved and simply made bad decisions across the board, that is one thing. It is the arbitrary way he picks and chooses his spots.

When he does decide to break out of the insane brainstorming personnel model in use with twenty voices all at once and gets more of a personal involvement, we get Roy Williams. He does not override the scouts and coaches very often, but when he does, it is usually apparent.

I think he checks out during the UDFA phase, so the worker bees get to do their job without interference and things turn out all right.

I think he checks out after the first couple of rounds of the draft or until he realizes he can't do anymore "shrewd" wheeling and dealing.

Bottom line, Jerry isn't a talent evaluator. He never has been. He has no background or training in it. Compare his bio to other successful GMs in the league. I suspect most could be summarized as "spent many years honing his craft before being promoted to GM" while Jerry's would say "Bought team, made self GM"

He is not from a football family like Mike Brown. He did not coach like Al Davis. But his level of involvement is like them.

He has no refined eye or vision for evaluating talent. What he has is a patchwork understanding of what a talented football player is. This limited perspective is gathered from his experiences. He got a little from Davis, a little from his formative days when we had an excellent scouting department when he first bought the team, a little from Bill Parcells. The problem is that he still has no vision and simply goes with the last thing that impressed him. He is not consistent because he simply cannot be. That is all due to his inability (nor commitment) to be a full time talent evaluator. How someone cannot see how that is an issue is beyond me.

And if this nonsense that he is simply a "figurehead" and everyone is deluded by the meaningless title, why not just strip it from himself and give it to Ciskowski?

Fact is he would never do that because he wants the mandate to pick and choose when he wants to pretend to be the general manager. It is all about his insecurity and his manic desire to be accepted as the one who has the "final say". He has made that very evident.

 

[MapleLeaf]

I do. I thought at the time those were stupid hires, and in retrospect as well. I do think Gailey got a bit of a raw deal in only getting 2 years. I'd rather have had him for 5 and skipped Campo completely.

But then, I'd rather have diarrhea than either of them.

...a new year, letting stupid hires fade in the past and avoiding diarrhea.:beer2:

 

[MapleLeaf]

a strong coach with a vision of the kind of team he wants to build. Jim

competent mgmt skills.

Sadly not all coaches are capable just like not all business mgrs are capable.

 

[Alexander]

The Dallas Cowboys were the most popular team in the NFL when jj bought them, since then the league has grown and so has the Cowboy's popularity. To me that doesn't make JJ a marketing genius now if he could make Jacksonville or Cleveland national teams I'd be impressed but not with the boys.

That's kind of like the new CEO of McDonalds bragging about how they are number 1 in restaurant sells under his watch.

Good point. But he does work hard to keep the franchise at the forefront in terms of brand recognition. But that is for selfish reasons, not for the love of the franchise or respect for what came before him.

His "marketing genius" is more about making himself money and remaining profitable. That is how it needs to be looked at. He is a smart businessman. No one is denying that. And that is how he runs the team and always has.

He takes pride in his investment, but that kind of pride does not show in relation to the promotion of what the franchise is about and has always been about. He has zero interest in the history of the Cowboys. That is fairly self-evident if you look at the disparity on how he addresses our history.

 

[Randy White]

Now, children, pay very very very close attention:


Steelers president Art Rooney II "overruled" coach Mike Tomlin on keeping former OC Bruce Arians, according to CBSSports.com's Mike Freeman.

As far as we know, the move is unprecedented for a coach of Tomlin's success level. It's an accepted practice for NFL head coaches to maintain control over their own staff. In one sense, though, it's far from shocking. Ben Roethlisberger reportedly stepped in to save Arians' job two years back.

Rooney has been stumping for a return to the Steelers' ground-game roots and more pocket discipline from Big Ben.

http://www.rotoworld.com/playernews/nfl/football


Class dismissed..

 

[Hostile]

Good point. But he does work hard to keep the franchise at the forefront in terms of brand recognition. But that is for selfish reasons, not for the love of the franchise or respect for what came before him.

His "marketing genius" is more about making himself money and remaining profitable. That is how it needs to be looked at. He is a smart businessman. No one is denying that. And that is how he runs the team and always has.

He takes pride in his investment, but that kind of pride does not show in relation to the promotion of what the franchise is about and has always been about. He has zero interest in the history of the Cowboys. That is fairly self-evident if you look at the disparity on how he addresses our history.

The entire NFL has made more money since he showed the way. Look at how franchise values have escalated through the roof.

 

[Risen Star]

The Dallas Cowboys were the most popular team in the NFL when jj bought them, since then the league has grown and so has the Cowboy's popularity. To me that doesn't make JJ a marketing genius now if he could make Jacksonville or Cleveland national teams I'd be impressed but not with the boys.

That's kind of like the new CEO of McDonalds bragging about how they are number 1 in restaurant sells under his watch.

Well, you have to give him credit for turning the team's financials around. So I definitely don't think it's just a Dallas Cowboys issue. I think the guy is a good business man.

But does it help that he's the owner of this team in particular? Of course it does. I've said it before, Jerry would be an even worse owner/GM on any other team. He'd lose that attraction players feel for the Cowboys. The mystique that clouds their judgement and makes them want to sign on with a team with such a flawed and failed power structure.

 

[Hostile]

Please share. It would certainly enlighten us as to how the power structure in Dallas works.

Okay, I never do this kind of request but in this case I am going to. Roy Williams' agent was the one who first broached the subject by calling the Dallas Cowboys to say that Roy was at the end of his contract and open to a trade to Dallas, his favorite team. That call was to Jerry. Jerry brought the idea before the entire staff. From there, the team discussed it. Eventually the deal was made. I reported in September of 2007 that I expected this deal to happen. Obviously he failed to have the impact here they hoped.

No, I am not guessing.

Of course people have input. But your GM should be that guy that is there day in and day out leading that group of people and formulating the path forward for the franchise.

Again, you're hung up on a title. Ciskowski is there "day in and day out," and is focused on getting the team the pieces it needs. So is Todd Williams. So is Judd Garrett. So are Chris Hall and the rest of the Scouts. So are Jason Garrett and his staff. It is an orchestra, not a one man band.

 

[Alexander]

Old SI article (written the year before Bill Parcells arrived).

This gives a great indication of how things were then. I doubt it has changed much.

Corner Market

The Cowboys' staff had some heated discussions when deciding how to rank two top-notch cover men, Phillip Buchanon and Quentin Jammer




On April 9, in the offices of the Dallas Cowboys, 17 of the team's coaches, scouts and executives gathered to dissect the best cornerbacks in the 2002 draft. This was a vital day because the Cowboys' position of biggest need was cornerback. Here's how Dallas analyzed one of those options, 5'9?", 186-pound Phillip Buchanon.

Assistant director of college scouting Tom Ciskowski: "Next player, Phillip Buchanon from Miami, Florida; 4.37 on grass; vertical jump 33; hand 7�; arm 29�. Early-out junior. [Ciskowski begins reading the ratings of Buchanon from those assembled in the room.] Ireland 1.00 [meaning Buchanon is the 10th-best player in the draft], Warfield .85 [between eighth and ninth], Ciskowski .60 [sixth], Hess 1.00, [secondary coach Clancy] Pendergast .80 [eighth]. Jeff, go ahead."


National scout Jeff Ireland: " Fort Myers, Florida. Good kid. No problems off the field. Very cocky. Gym-rat type. Great body control, burst. Rare balance and foot quickness. Not a sure tackier, but he will assert himself. Very tough for a little guy. High motor. Quick route recognition and awareness. Does get bounced around by bigger wide receivers, but he's hard to separate from. As a cover corner, you can match him with the best receiver and he'll mark him all day long. Can mirror abrupt double moves. The only real weakness is he's short. He does get outjumped, and he is suspect in run-support. Very sudden as a returner. Excellent ball skills. We'd get a double whammy because of the return skills. This kid is better than [ Texas corner Quentin] Jammer right now, but I still like Jammer better because of the upside. A top 10 player."


Ciskowski: "I love this guy. He competes like Michael Irvin and is a better kid. He thinks he's Deion Sanders. In his mind he's not 5'10". His intangibles are so incredible. You hear about the size. You remember when we picked Russell Maryland, they said he lacked this or lacked that? Emmitt was too short, too slow. Michael Irvin was too slow. They were just football players, like this kid. He's a backoff corner and a press corner, and he can play in the nickel. No doubt he would start for us from Day One. Kevin Smith [a Cowboys first-round choice in 1992], who we all know could play, was seven eighths of an inch taller than Buchanon. Here's seven eighths. [Ciskowski points to the draft board, where he has drawn two parallel lines about an inch apart.] The real world for us is Steve Spurrier spreading you out, the Rams spreading you out. We don't have a corner who can match up with their best receiver."


[Chairs swivel to the big video screen to watch a tape of Buchanon's workout in Miami, then his highlight tape.

After watching the quickest 20-yard cone shuttle of draft-eligible players, Cowboys owner Jerry Jones says, "That's Deion stuff."

After seeing a relentless Buchanon pursuit on a corner blitz, coach Dave Campo says, "That is a great play!" After a punt return for a touchdown, Campo says, "This guy's a little Deion. What vision."

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1025631/4/index.htm

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Great post, Alex. I'd never seen that.

I am curious how other teams do it. I'd assume it's somewhat similar, but still, what a cluster that sounds like. Way too many cooks in the kitchen. This is what I and others are talking about with Jerry having to sort through all these sales pitches and decide which opinion to believe.

BTW, isn't it funny how head coach Campo likes Buchanon better, but Jerry says to put Jammer above him on the board?

 

[Risen Star]

That reads like a Three Stooges routine.

 

[Alexander]

Great post, Alex. I'd never seen that.

I am curious how other teams do it. I'd assume it's somewhat similar, but still, what a cluster that sounds like.

BTW, isn't it funny how head coach Campo likes Buchanon better, but Jerry says to put Jammer above him on the board?

To me, the worst part of that whole exchange was listening to the inane over-the-top comments from Jones and Campo. "That's Deion stuff!"