Football 101: The Talent Evaluation Process

[Alexander]

That reads like a Three Stooges routine.

It is comical.

Now imagine Jerry Jones then filtering through all of that noise and figuring out what player is better?

No wonder our drafts have been futile. We take a show of hands all led by a man who does not even know what it is he is grading.

"That's Deion stuff!"

 

[Chocolate Lab]

To me, the worst part of that whole exchange was listening to the inane over-the-top comments from Jones and Campo. "That's Deion stuff!"

Yeah, Jerry was (and still is) so fixated on his one big free agent score Deion...

And Campo is such a fish... "I'm with Buchanon!" Then thirty seconds later, "I'm on the fence." So glad he's out of the draft room... No one can convince me he didn't have a big say in the Deangelo Smiths and Mike Mickens and other DB fails of the last few years.

And how about Garrett: "You divorce yourself from reality if you look at both guys [Buchanon and Jammer] and don't think this guy's better. He's like a veteran. Buchanon would be my choice, hands down."

Also, who else thought Zimmer showed the most sense of anyone in this whole exchange? Loved when Ciskowski and Garrett said any football person who watched the tape would come away saying Buchanon was better... And Zim came back with, "I think I'm a football person."

 

[Alexander]

Yeah, Jerry was (and still is) so fixated on his one big free agent score Deion...

And Campo is such a fish... "I'm with Buchanon!" Then thirty seconds later, "I'm on the fence." So glad he's out of the draft room... No one can convince me he didn't have a big say in the Deangelo Smiths and Mike Mickens and other DB fails of the last few years.

And how about Garrett: "You divorce yourself from reality if you look at both guys [Buchanon and Jammer] and don't think this guy's better. He's like a veteran. Buchanon would be my choice, hands down." [URL="http://media.scout.com/media/forums/emoticons/112/doh.gif"] [/URL]

I had never read that article until I just found it.

I like this one too. Here is our owner "educating" everyone.

Jones: "Did you know Deion scored a touchdown one out of every seven times he touched the ball? Will we use our shutdown corner to return punts?"

I cannot stop laughing.

 

[jnday]

Great post, Alex. I'd never seen that.

I am curious how other teams do it. I'd assume it's somewhat similar, but still, what a cluster that sounds like. Way too many cooks in the kitchen. This is what I and others are talking about with Jerry having to sort through all these sales pitches and decide which opinion to believe.

BTW, isn't it funny how head coach Campo likes Buchanon better, but Jerry says to put Jammer above him on the board?

Yeah , that's good stuff . Very good post .

 

[Concord]

After reading that article seems like we should have kept Zimmer around.

:laugh2:

 

[Concord]

Also, who else thought Zimmer showed the most sense of anyone in this whole exchange? Loved when Ciskowski and Garrett said any football person who watched the tape would come away saying Buchanon was better... And Zim came back with, "I think I'm a football person."

After reading that article seems like we should have kept Zimmer around.

:laugh2:

I did. :

 

[DCBoysfan]

Great read thanks for posting.

 

[burmafrd]

and of course the final joke is neither of them were ever all that much, Jammer has been OK but not much more; and as regards Buchanon...

 

[birdwells1]

Well, you have to give him credit for turning the team's financials around. So I definitely don't think it's just a Dallas Cowboys issue. I think the guy is a good business man.

But does it help that he's the owner of this team in particular? Of course it does. I've said it before, Jerry would be an even worse owner/GM on any other team. He'd lose that attraction players feel for the Cowboys. The mystique that clouds their judgement and makes them want to sign on with a team with such a flawed and failed power structure.

Who has this MYSTIQUE helped us sign lately?

 

[Alexander]

Who has this MYSTIQUE helped us sign lately?

It helped Roy Williams get here.:laugh2:

 

[Hostile]

Great post, Alex. I'd never seen that.

I am curious how other teams do it. I'd assume it's somewhat similar, but still, what a cluster that sounds like. Way too many cooks in the kitchen. This is what I and others are talking about with Jerry having to sort through all these sales pitches and decide which opinion to believe.

BTW, isn't it funny how head coach Campo likes Buchanon better, but Jerry says to put Jammer above him on the board?

It didn't sound like a cluster at all. Then again I've sat in film sessions and heard people all around the room voicing comments, so this seems very normal to me.

Yes, other teams will be somewhat similar and probably have almost exact disagreements too. To me the only sad thing is no one thought Ed Reed, who should have been on some of the same film as Buchanon, was our best option in a trade down.

 

[Alexander]

To me the only sad thing is no one thought Ed Reed, who should have been on some of the same film as Buchanon, was our best option in a trade down.

Ed Reed was not much of an option as you can see that everyone had Roy Williams on the brain.

 

[Hostile]

Ed Reed was not much of an option as you can see that everyone had Roy Williams on the brain.

All around the NFL, and early on, the guy validated his draft position. Please don't try to deny that. We are talking about hindsight here, there's no need for sanctimony.

I find it interesting that Ciskowski was right in a sense. Buchanon has more INTs (20 to 18), has scored 5 Pick 6's to zero, has forced more fumbles (8 to 6), recovered more (12 to 6), but that Jammer has proven to be the better tackler as was prophesied due to his size (560 to 348). Buchanon also has a sack, Jammer doesn't. Jammer has started 145 games to 81.

Buchanon also scored on 3 Punt Returns and returned Kicks, but Jammer has never done either.

 

[Alexander]

All around the NFL, and early on, the guy validated his draft position. Please don't try to deny that. We are talking about hindsight here, there's no need for sanctimony.

Early on? As in what? The first two years of his career?

By 2005, it was clear Ed Reed was a better safety for the state of the game. He had an MVP trophy on his shelf by that point.

 

[cowboyeric8]

Early on? As in what? The first two years of his career?

By 2005, it was clear Ed Reed was a better safety for the state of the game. He had an MVP trophy on his shelf by that point.

What are tomorrow's lottery numbers?

 

[Trendnet]

What are tomorrow's lottery numbers?

Better yet. What are the lottery numbers two years from now?

well maybe not "Better yet". I'd rather have tomorrows.

 

[daschoo]

All around the NFL, and early on, the guy validated his draft position. Please don't try to deny that. We are talking about hindsight here, there's no need for sanctimony.

I find it interesting that Ciskowski was right in a sense. Buchanon has more INTs (20 to 18), has scored 5 Pick 6's to zero, has forced more fumbles (8 to 6), recovered more (12 to 6), but that Jammer has proven to be the better tackler as was prophesied due to his size (560 to 348). Buchanon also has a sack, Jammer doesn't. Jammer has started 145 games to 81.

Buchanon also scored on 3 Punt Returns and returned Kicks, but Jammer has never done either.

not got time to read the op just now but will be sure to later, just wanted to say i noticed your sig and would be ecstatic if we picked up d'qwell jackson. one of my favourite random players for the last couple of year. be great to see him with the star on his helmet

 

[Hostile]

Early on? As in what? The first two years of his career?

By 2005, it was clear Ed Reed was a better safety for the state of the game. He had an MVP trophy on his shelf by that point.

Name one scouting service that had him ahead of Roy Williams. Show me where if both were on the board he would have gone first. That is early on. Hindsight is 20/20 vision. Impress me with some foresight.

 

[junk]

I don't think it is just player evaluation with respect to the draft that is an issue either.

I think Jerry tends to over value guys that the team drafted and sign them to contracts larger than their play warrants. You could question any of the recent contracts (Sensabaugh, Ratliff and Scandrick).

They obviously overvalued Roy Williams after botching that trade (initiated by his agent no less...... ) and signed him to an unreasonable contract. Consider this: Roy Williams was in his fifth season with Detroit and had 1 1,000+ yard season when Dallas traded for him. He had never had a double digit TD season. Dallas rewarded him with a 5 year/45 million dollar contract with $20 million guaranteed. He would have been a free agent after the year and, if Dallas really wanted him, could have signed him then. No long term vision.

I think the whole owner/GM thing creates a culture in Dallas that isn't conducive to winning. Average performance will get you a contract extension. Players know they can step above the coach and go directly to the GM/owner.

I know some on here claim that a GM doesn't have anything to do with winning. I don't get that.....more talent makes winning easier. This team obviously hasn't been built to be good enough to win lately. However, I don't know how you can dismiss that the only times Dallas has improved under Jerry has been when he had coaches with a strong personnel background.

 

[Hostile]

I know some on here claim that a GM doesn't have anything to do with winning. I don't get that.....more talent makes winning easier.

I agree, and the Scouting Department is providing us with talent. Prediction: the absolutely lame response will be about the 2009 Draft, completely ignoring all other recent years.

This team obviously hasn't been built to be good enough to win lately.

I think it is damn close to being a contender for many years.

However, I don't know how you can dismiss that the only times Dallas has improved under Jerry has been when he had coaches with a strong personnel background.

Who exactly is dismissing that? Hell, in the first post I said that we need Jason Garrett to be the strongest voice in the room for the Draft because the players have to fit his system.

Maybe if people could try (I know that requires effort and I am sorry) to digest the entire OP instead of thinking one line at a time?