Garrett vs. Lewis what's the difference?

[craig71]

Marvin Lewis had 1 winning season his first 6 years as a head coach. His last 7 he has 6 winning seasons, assuming he wins one game more this year.

So is Lewis a bad coach? I am curious as to why in the modern NFL sometimes coaches get maybe 2-3 seasons to prove themselves then get canned, and really why Lewis wasn't fired after 6 seasons.

Would you fire Lewis right now because he never has won a Superbowl?



2003 45 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 8 8 0 .500
2004 46 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 8 8 0 .500
2005 47 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 11 5 0 .688
2006 48 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 8 8 0 .500
2007 49 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 7 9 0 .438
2008 50 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 4 11 1 .267
2009 51 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 10 6 0 .625
2010 52 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 4 12 0 .250
2011 53 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 9 7 0 .563
2012 54 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 10 6 0 .625
2013 55 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 11 5 0 .688
2014 56 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 10 5 1 .667
2015 57 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 10 8 2 0 .800

Ownership. Some owners seek instant gratification while others are quite patient. Little Danny Snyder would be a good example of an impatient owner that has been quick to pull the plug on coaching staffs. Some would also label Snyder as a meddler. On the other end of the spectrum would be the Stealers. A very patient owner that sticks with a staff come hell or high water while giving the coaching staff complete control of football operations.

Craig

 

[WPBCowboysFan]

You and others want to compare the 70s Bengals to the 70s Cowboys, fine but I am talking about 2005 onward. The Bengals played in a tough division with the Ravens and Steelers, you and everyone else know that.

And what the Bengals have done since 2005 is not up to the standard me, or numerous other Cowboys fans, would settle for or want. And I think you know that. My mention of the 70's and 90's was a reference to the standard I see as the only acceptable standard for the Cowboys. What the Bengals did in the 70's is irrelevant, as is what they've done the last 10 years.

 

[visionary]

Marvin Lewis had 1 winning season his first 6 years as a head coach. His last 7 he has 6 winning seasons, assuming he wins one game more this year.

So is Lewis a bad coach? I am curious as to why in the modern NFL sometimes coaches get maybe 2-3 seasons to prove themselves then get canned, and really why Lewis wasn't fired after 6 seasons.

Would you fire Lewis right now because he never has won a Superbowl?



2003 45 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 8 8 0 .500
2004 46 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 8 8 0 .500
2005 47 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 11 5 0 .688
2006 48 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 8 8 0 .500
2007 49 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 7 9 0 .438
2008 50 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 4 11 1 .267
2009 51 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 10 6 0 .625
2010 52 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 4 12 0 .250
2011 53 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 9 7 0 .563
2012 54 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 10 6 0 .625
2013 55 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 11 5 0 .688
2014 56 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 16 10 5 1 .667
2015 57 Cincinnati Bengals NFL 10 8 2 0 .800

Garrett had had a top 5-7 QB for his entire coaching tenure

Lewis is not that good but he is leagues better than Garrett

 

[noshame]

The difference is the GM, when we had coaches who would stood up to Jerry we did well, and showed improvement.

 

[WPBCowboysFan]

Garrett had had a top 5-7 QB for his entire coaching tenure

Lewis is not that good but he is leagues better than Garrett

Lewis had Carson Palmer for a while. While Carson is no Roger or Troy he's certainly no Ryan Leaf or Quincy Carter either.

I wouldnt want Lewis even if he is better than Garrett because he isnt anywhere close to better enuff.

 

[65fastback2plus2]

marvin is still there because the browns

I am not a Garrett hater-- but at some point, someone needs to be held accountable for the product on the field: GM, coaches, and/or players. We all know the GM isn't going anywhere.

The problem is Romo's age puts the team in a bind. If we fire Garrett and bring in a new system, it will probably take a couple years for Romo to get proficient in it. Honestly, the best choice at this point is to probably do what is most comfortable for Romo. He's our best chance to win and his window is closing quickly. He has 2-3 years left max (and that's IF he stays healthy)-- so keeping him in this system makes some sense.

However, I'd make some big changes in personnel. We need serious help at CB, S, DT, and LBer. We also need depth at WR, and a young stud at RB. I'd grab a capable vet backup QB and draft Romo's replacement this year and start grooming him.

Tony learns quickly.

You're basically asking tony to play out his career with a ball and chain around one foot (Garrett). I dont think thats the solution either.

 

[Risen Star]

This is the Dallas Cowboys, I thought that was supposed to mean something.

That died in March of 1994.

 

[windward]

He finally got a decent QB, while Garrett has had a decent QB and continuously sucked..

Carson Palmer isn't a decent QB?

 

[Hawkeye19]

marvin is still there because the browns

Tony learns quickly.

You're basically asking tony to play out his career with a ball and chain around one foot (Garrett). I dont think thats the solution either.

I disagree. Tony has flourished overall in this system. Look at his numbers.... He has been an elite QB under Garrett. The problem over his career has consistently been a mediocre to poor defense and injury issues.

For better or worse-- when we signed Tony to the huge deal-- we committed to doing everything we can to win with him at QB. Keeping him in a system where he's so comfortable he's basically an on-field coach would be a good thing.

We let Murray and Callahan walk and trusted Randle to step up. Fail.
We dragged out signing Dez and affected his offseason prep and didn't sign any solid depth at WR. Fail.
We trusted Weeden as a competent NFL backup QB. Fail.

That's all front office. Not even sure how involved Garrett was in all that-- he may in fact just be playing out the hand he's been dealt.

 

[65fastback2plus2]

I disagree. Tony has flourished overall in this system. Look at his numbers.... He has been an elite QB under Garrett. The problem over his career has consistently been a mediocre to poor defense and injury issues.

For better or worse-- when we signed Tony to the huge deal-- we committed to doing everything we can to win with him at QB. Keeping him in a system where he's so comfortable he's basically an on-field coach would be a good thing.

We let Murray and Callahan walk and trusted Randle to step up. Fail.
We dragged out signing Dez and affected his offseason prep and didn't sign any solid depth at WR. Fail.
We trusted Weeden as a competent NFL backup QB. Fail.

That's all front office. Not even sure how involved Garrett was in all that-- he may in fact just be playing out the hand he's been dealt.

Im not convinced that Tony is who he is because of JG. I think Tony would be Tony on almost any team.

 

[Mr Cowboy]

since we're comparing Head coaches, a better comparison would be Mike Tomlin. Similar age and experience prior to getting the HC gig, and both have been OC/HC since about 2007.

Through eight seasons, Tomlin has accomplished many things that have never been done in the team’s storied history. His 82-46 regular-season record (.641) is the best start in franchise history, and he became the youngest head coach in NFL history to both coach in and win a Super Bowl when he led the Steelers to a 27-23 victory over the Arizona Cardinals in Super Bowl XLIII (26 years, 323 days). By winning the Super Bowl in only his second season as a head coach, he also became the fastest to win a Super Bowl title in Steelers history.

Compare..........

 

[Hawkeye19]

Im not convinced that Tony is who he is because of JG. I think Tony would be Tony on almost any team.

Maybe... but there's no way of knowing what Tony would be w/o JG. What we do know is that they gush over each other every chance they get, and that their respect and affection for one another appears by all account to be genuine.

Tony likes the system. Tony produces in this system. The offensive system isn't broken... Tony's collarbone is. And the front office decided to let Murray walk... remember how Tony was campaigning for Murray to stay? IMO-- that one misstep along with letting Callahan walk, really set this offense back from where it was last year.

 

[Amy50632]

since we're comparing Head coaches, a better comparison would be Mike Tomlin. Similar age and experience prior to getting the HC gig, and both have been OC/HC since about 2007.



Compare..........

One guy is able to win games without their star quarterback while the other one can't.

 

[65fastback2plus2]

Maybe... but there's no way of knowing what Tony would be w/o JG. What we do know is that they gush over each other every chance they get, and that their respect and affection for one another appears by all account to be genuine.

Tony likes the system. Tony produces in this system. The offensive system isn't broken... Tony's collarbone is. And the front office decided to let Murray walk... remember how Tony was campaigning for Murray to stay? IMO-- that one misstep along with letting Callahan walk, really set this offense back from where it was last year.

i dunno...this thanksgiving game, the last one, the game vs. minny...these blowouts tell me the system has always been broken. we almost NEVER blow an opponent out.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I think it would be difficult for any coach to come in here and do much better than Garrett has this season.

Between the devastating injuries to key offensive personnel, the fumbling of the back-up QB spot (I can blame Garrett a little for this, but as Jerry admitted, his fingers were in that 'pie') and the historic lack of turnovers on defense... I can't see any coach succeeding in Dallas in 2015.

The team suffered incredible bad luck this year.

Some may not want to acknowledge the luck-factor but it was there.

I've never seen so many pick-sixes in all my life... combined with the amazing ability for this defense to not be able to get a turnover. And then you had the Harris KO-return TD as icing on the cake.

There are some days when it doesn't pay to get up... this was a season where it didn't pay to get up.

 

[Dave_in-NC]

Maybe... but there's no way of knowing what Tony would be w/o JG. What we do know is that they gush over each other every chance they get, and that their respect and affection for one another appears by all account to be genuine.

Tony likes the system. Tony produces in this system. The offensive system isn't broken... Tony's collarbone is. And the front office decided to let Murray walk... remember how Tony was campaigning for Murray to stay? IMO-- that one misstep along with letting Callahan walk, really set this offense back from where it was last year.

Get ready for the look at Murray in Philly crowd. But I agree.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Get ready for the look at Murray in Philly crowd. But I agree.

Murray would not have made one-iota of difference in the overall record.

He would have gained a few more yards, but he would have coughed the ball up a few more times too.

Murray was getting "used-up" the last 1/4 of last season. You could see it!

And I've watched enough of the Eagles this year to tell that he doesn't have the "fire in the belly" this season. Getting a $42 mil contract will do that combined with toting the ball as much as he did last season.

 

[Hawkeye19]

i dunno...this thanksgiving game, the last one, the game vs. minny...these blowouts tell me the system has always been broken. we almost NEVER blow an opponent out.

By no means am I saying that JG is a "great" or even "good" HC... I am just saying changing the one thing that consistently has been performing well is not the solution. The offense may not be the best in football, but it's far from being the biggest problem area.

When is the last time we've had a top 10 defense-- let alone a top 15? 2007? 1st round bye. Last year we were #2 in turnovers, and Romo went 12-4 and we nearly had the 1st round bye again. Incidentally, both those years we also had devastating rushing attacks.

IMO-- this season fell apart for 3 reasons:

1. Injuries
2. We took a big step back in the OL and ground game.
3. Once again-- an underperforming defense

 

[Hawkeye19]

Get ready for the look at Murray in Philly crowd. But I agree.

Apples and oranges. Murray doesn't fit the scheme in Philly-- anybody can see that. But he definitely fits this scheme.

No one would have expected him to break 1800 yards this year-- but his presence would have helped in terms of continuity up front and I think if we cut Randle and added McFadden-- we'd be pretty stout at RB.

Spilled milk I guess-- but regardless, we need to draft Ton's successor this year and start grooming him, add a capable vet backup QB-- and draft a RB in one of the first 3 rounds.

 

[Blackspider214]

He finally got a decent QB, while Garrett has had a decent QB and continuously sucked..

And we can pretty much end this thread here. Garrett was given a team with a very good QB. Just had drafted Dez. We had talent. We were in the midst of a successful little timeframe from 2006 until he took over. And nothing but mediocrity with last year being an outlier.

He's a terrible coach. Bottom of the league. Romo makes up so much for how inept he is. Our offensive playbook and "scheme" is that of a big picture coloring book. It's ridiculous.

Why people can't seem to realize this is beyond me. He's year 5 into this and still has no idea how to manage the clock, timeouts or when to challenge. He's a joke. But he's a yes man to Jerry and been around this franchise since he was young so Jerry won't kick him to the curb like he did Wade.