Garrett's offense

[OmerV]

Kitna said something that I have been trying to get across in some of these threads. It seems some think Garrett has created his own offense that is different than all others, and he will protect his baby at all costs. This is often used as a reason to believe Moore will be handcuffed.

Kitna's words …

”At the younger levels, the greatest thing is you have to learn how to teach and communicate really well,” Kitna said. “There’s really no new plays, it’s how you call them, how you dress them up and when you call them that’s important.”

Bottom line is it doesn't take a major overhaul, or a dramatic departure from everything the Cowboys have done in the past to make a big difference, yet it seems many fans think that it does. I remember reading after the Rams game that the majority of the plays the Rams run were also in the Cowboys playbook, but the difference was the Rams disguised them better with motion and misdirection.

 

[glimmerman]

Kitna said something that I have been trying to get across in some of these threads. It seems some think Garrett has created his own offense that is different than all others, and he will protect his baby at all costs. This is often used as a reason to believe Moore will be handcuffed.

Kitna's words …

”At the younger levels, the greatest thing is you have to learn how to teach and communicate really well,” Kitna said. “There’s really no new plays, it’s how you call them, how you dress them up and when you call them that’s important.”

Bottom line is it doesn't take a major overhaul, or a dramatic departure from everything the Cowboys have done in the past to make a big difference, yet it seems many fans think that it does. I remember reading after the Rams game that the majority of the plays the Rams run were also in the Cowboys playbook, but the difference was the Rams disguised them better with motion and misdirection.

I don’t expect a whole new playbook. I am assuming different looks and motion will be it. And like he said it’s when the plays are called. The order or situational playcalling that will change.

 

[GMO415]

The lambs studied our defense and knew when to run the plays to counter it.

 

[charron]

Kitna said something that I have been trying to get across in some of these threads. It seems some think Garrett has created his own offense that is different than all others, and he will protect his baby at all costs. This is often used as a reason to believe Moore will be handcuffed.

Kitna's words …

”At the younger levels, the greatest thing is you have to learn how to teach and communicate really well,” Kitna said. “There’s really no new plays, it’s how you call them, how you dress them up and when you call them that’s important.”

Bottom line is it doesn't take a major overhaul, or a dramatic departure from everything the Cowboys have done in the past to make a big difference, yet it seems many fans think that it does. I remember reading after the Rams game that the majority of the plays the Rams run were also in the Cowboys playbook, but the difference was the Rams disguised them better with motion and misdirection.

Garretts offense has also been one of the best in the league under romo and is still pretty good with Dak. The concepts are really good, get down field, get the qb easy completions, few plays behind the line of scrimmage etc. Better playcalling with a few more route combinations will change how people view the offense but the scheme is solid and has been solid for years. Most people don't even know what scheme we run they just read that it's predictable, like you can't predict anyother team by simply watching tape.

 

[MojaveJT]

I think most people are wanting more creativity. Things to keep the defense on their toes. Not the, “we’ll impose our will even though you know what we’re doing” mentality.

 

[Sydla]

Garretts offense has also been one of the best in the league under romo and is still pretty good with Dak. The concepts are really good, get down field, get the qb easy completions, few plays behind the line of scrimmage etc. Better playcalling with a few more route combinations will change how people view the offense but the scheme is solid and has been solid for years. Most people don't even know what scheme we run they just read that it's predictable, like you can't predict anyother team by simply watching tape.

Garrett's offense "worked" in 2016 when everything was perfect. He had the best OL in football and a QB who was on fire as a rookie and no real injuries. When this team didn't have the ideal conditions in 2017 and 2018, the offense scuffled and was pretty blah. They seem to have a mentality we will impose our will on you as opposed to keeping defenses on their toes. And that might work when you have a dominant, healthy OL and a TB tearing teams apart. But when there are chinks in that armor, the offense can look pretty shabby.

When was the last time you saw people gushing over the game plan and game called by the Cowboys? Think back to that Rams game in the playoffs. After the game there were two things that were repeatedly noted from that game. One, once again, the offense was fairly predictable and the Rams claimed they had good ideas what we were trying to do on offense, especially in the run game based on formations, etc. And it showed. They shot down Elliott.

Two, the Rams made some fairly significant changes on offense with formations and motion to get our LBs moving prior to the snap to get them out of position. They also adjusted some blocking schemes to take advantage of our telegraphing our stunts.

I can't remember the last time this coaching staff got that kind of praise for being adaptable, etc. Sure, all teams are predictable on offense. But some are more predictable than others and some work hard to mask what they are doing. We don't seem to be one of those teams.

 

[OmerV]

Garrett's offense "worked" in 2016 when everything was perfect. He had the best OL in football and a QB who was on fire as a rookie and no real injuries. When this team didn't have the ideal conditions in 2017 and 2018, the offense scuffled and was pretty blah. They seem to have a mentality we will impose our will on you as opposed to keeping defenses on their toes. And that might work when you have a dominant, healthy OL and a TB tearing teams apart. But when there are chinks in that armor, the offense can look pretty shabby.

When was the last time you saw people gushing over the game plan and game called by the Cowboys? Think back to that Rams game in the playoffs. After the game there were two things that were repeatedly noted from that game. One, once again, the offense was fairly predictable and the Rams claimed they had good ideas what we were trying to do on offense, especially in the run game based on formations, etc. And it showed. They shot down Elliott.

Two, the Rams made some fairly significant changes on offense with formations and motion to get our LBs moving prior to the snap to get them out of position. They also adjusted some blocking schemes to take advantage of our telegraphing our stunts.

I can't remember the last time this coaching staff got that kind of praise for being adaptable, etc. Sure, all teams are predictable on offense. But some are more predictable than others and some work hard to mask what they are doing. We don't seem to be one of those teams.

All of what you are talking about isn't "Garrett's offense", it's how the offense is used. Two teams can have identical offenses, but if one does a better job of building a game plan, or disguising plays or making in game adjustments, the results can be very different. That's my point, and the point Kitna was making.

 

[conner01]

The lambs studied our defense and knew when to run the plays to counter it.

Way to predictable
Just a different person calling plays helps with that some but adding different looks and motion will help too

 

[_sturt_]

Kitna said something that I have been trying to get across in some of these threads. It seems some think Garrett has created his own offense that is different than all others, and he will protect his baby at all costs. This is often used as a reason to believe Moore will be handcuffed.

Kitna's words …

”At the younger levels, the greatest thing is you have to learn how to teach and communicate really well,” Kitna said. “There’s really no new plays, it’s how you call them, how you dress them up and when you call them that’s important.”

Bottom line is it doesn't take a major overhaul, or a dramatic departure from everything the Cowboys have done in the past to make a big difference, yet it seems many fans think that it does. I remember reading after the Rams game that the majority of the plays the Rams run were also in the Cowboys playbook, but the difference was the Rams disguised them better with motion and misdirection.

I agree with all of this.

And I would not be one of those who ever thought Garrett had a different offense.

He does have, like most any HC would, his own offensive philosophies that, in turn, dictate (a) what plays he believes in and (b) when certain plays should be called versus others.

I believe those things will remain pretty static in the 2019 Garrett offense.

And I believe what's left for Garrett's OC and offensive assistants, then, is mainly the "how you dress them up" component.

Having said that, my inclination is that Moore's going to be able to persuade Garrett to take a chance on a few select plays that weren't in the Linehan era playbook.

 

[Diehardblues]

Kitna said something that I have been trying to get across in some of these threads. It seems some think Garrett has created his own offense that is different than all others, and he will protect his baby at all costs. This is often used as a reason to believe Moore will be handcuffed.

Kitna's words …

”At the younger levels, the greatest thing is you have to learn how to teach and communicate really well,” Kitna said. “There’s really no new plays, it’s how you call them, how you dress them up and when you call them that’s important.”

Bottom line is it doesn't take a major overhaul, or a dramatic departure from everything the Cowboys have done in the past to make a big difference, yet it seems many fans think that it does. I remember reading after the Rams game that the majority of the plays the Rams run were also in the Cowboys playbook, but the difference was the Rams disguised them better with motion and misdirection.

Garretts offense with Linehan calling the plays produced a top 10 offense for several years.

It’s probably more about the execution and talent.

And why a new offensive scheme or at least a variation might be better suited for the current skill sets we have.

 

[Sydla]

All of what you are talking about isn't "Garrett's offense", it's how the offense is used. Two teams can have identical offenses, but if one does a better job of building a game plan, or disguising plays or making in game adjustments, the results can be very different. That's my point, and the point Kitna was making.

How the offense is used is still part of the offense. It's preposterous to argue that it's not, at least in part, "Garrett's offense".

At it's core, teams all use the same plays. It's how, when and where teams use these basic plays that make all the difference. The Cowboys have never been known in recent years for their creativity or ability to mask what they are doing. I've, personally, never argued that Garrett's offense was just a gaggle of plays that Garrett developed and only we ran. My criticism of Garrett (and frankly, I think many detractors here) and this offense has always been they just were never very creative in game plans and how they deployed plays.

Everyone runs curls and comeback routes. We seemingly do it at a higher rate than most. Everyone runs off tackle run plays. But others seemingly do a better job with formations and motion to do it.

That's all part of "Garrett's offense".

 

[jazzcat22]

It seemed it was run Zeke from the 1 yard line to the other 20 to the redbone, then pass pas pass. Though that is a bit of a stretch, meant to be a little sarcastic. Then people complained why Zeke came out for a play of two.
1. Linehan did not use him, or did not know how inside the 20.
2. Zeke was a little gassed from the plays leading up to get there.
3. Linehan tried to be cute and thought he could suit smart them.
4. all of the above.

To me it has always been more the play calling at the wrong or right times, and seems predictable from the lack of motion to disguise it at times.
Like the 90's teams, there were basically 4 running plays and that stop us mentality worked then. Now it doesn't work the same. They still have the basic plays, but it needs to be better disguised.

 

[Diehardblues]

All of what you are talking about isn't "Garrett's offense", it's how the offense is used. Two teams can have identical offenses, but if one does a better job of building a game plan, or disguising plays or making in game adjustments, the results can be very different. That's my point, and the point Kitna was making.

The talent executing it would seem to have an impact as well?

 

[G2]

Kitna said something that I have been trying to get across in some of these threads. It seems some think Garrett has created his own offense that is different than all others, and he will protect his baby at all costs. This is often used as a reason to believe Moore will be handcuffed.

Kitna's words …

”At the younger levels, the greatest thing is you have to learn how to teach and communicate really well,” Kitna said. “There’s really no new plays, it’s how you call them, how you dress them up and when you call them that’s important.”

Bottom line is it doesn't take a major overhaul, or a dramatic departure from everything the Cowboys have done in the past to make a big difference, yet it seems many fans think that it does. I remember reading after the Rams game that the majority of the plays the Rams run were also in the Cowboys playbook, but the difference was the Rams disguised them better with motion and misdirection.

Fans misunderstand that there is, for the most part, a universal route tree.
Situational play calling is a different subject. There needs to be near perfect execution regardless.

 

[Diehardblues]

Execution and talent is a critical part. Norv Turners offense never was as dominating and effective as it was with the Cowboys talent level.

 

[Arkyvarminter]

The "Timing" of the playcalling is what sucked last year.............

 

[LACowboysFan1]

No NFL team runs a totally different offense, it's all in putting in different "wrinkles". Landry had the offensive linemen do the stand up before plays, and designed the Flex defense, but he still ran sweeps, off tackles, screens, post patterns, etc.

And defenses adapt, like the "wildcat", that was all the rage. For about half a season. The Bears "46" defense was one of the most dominant ever, but is it now?

No.

I'm not a Garrett fan, but to blame "Garrett's offense" is off base, as far as the plays run. His problem is what plays he runs when, I'm hopeful Kitna and Moore will change up that part of the offense. It's not like the Cowboys' offense was dead last in the NFL, in the last 3 years it's been 22nd, 14th and 5th, an average of 14th, so it doesn't need a huge improvement to be top-10. Changing the entire offense would just set the team back a year at least, likely more.

Let's give Kitna and Moore a chance....

 

[northerncowboynation]

Kitna said something that I have been trying to get across in some of these threads. It seems some think Garrett has created his own offense that is different than all others, and he will protect his baby at all costs. This is often used as a reason to believe Moore will be handcuffed.

Kitna's words …

”At the younger levels, the greatest thing is you have to learn how to teach and communicate really well,” Kitna said. “There’s really no new plays, it’s how you call them, how you dress them up and when you call them that’s important.”

Bottom line is it doesn't take a major overhaul, or a dramatic departure from everything the Cowboys have done in the past to make a big difference, yet it seems many fans think that it does. I remember reading after the Rams game that the majority of the plays the Rams run were also in the Cowboys playbook, but the difference was the Rams disguised them better with motion and misdirection.

Most forget and actually never really knew what a HC does. What does he/she do... 1) hires other coaches and puts good people around him that he trusts and who trust him and 2) keeps the team focused through the good and the bad. It doesn't take a Lombardi to keep them focused through the good but it takes a certain skill and belief to keep them focused through the bad like losing early in the season, the Zeke affair and losing the starting and backup QB's.

 

[OmerV]

The talent executing it would seem to have an impact as well?

Sure it would. I didn't mean to suggest talent isn't a big factor as well, but that's the case regardless of the offensive scheme. The context of this discussion was simply about the offensive scheme though.

 

[OmerV]

How the offense is used is still part of the offense. It's preposterous to argue that it's not, at least in part, "Garrett's offense".

At it's core, teams all use the same plays. It's how, when and where teams use these basic plays that make all the difference. The Cowboys have never been known in recent years for their creativity or ability to mask what they are doing. I've, personally, never argued that Garrett's offense was just a gaggle of plays that Garrett developed and only we ran. My criticism of Garrett (and frankly, I think many detractors here) and this offense has always been they just were never very creative in game plans and how they deployed plays.

Everyone runs curls and comeback routes. We seemingly do it at a higher rate than most. Everyone runs off tackle run plays. But others seemingly do a better job with formations and motion to do it.

That's all part of "Garrett's offense".

The point is that Moore as OC will address some of how the offense is used, but the context of the thread was the system itself.