Greg Williams vs. Mike Zimmer

[Bob Sacamano]

btw guys, look at the facts

the Skin's total D, and scoring D rankings, dropped from a year ago, while Zimmer ran a D that improved all of it's rankings from a year ago, in the 1st year in a totally, foreign scheme for him and his players...

 

[blindzebra]

Williams also was not putting in a new scheme, depending heavily on 5 rookies and 4 first year starters at LB.

But hey, facts bounce off them like super balls off a brick wall.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Williams also was not putting in a new scheme, depending heavily on 5 rookies and 4 first year starters at LB.

But hey, facts bounce off them like super balls off a brick wall.

:shoot2:

that's more holes in their argument shot up

 

[Rack]

I keep hearing how aggressive Greg Williams would make our D be if he were our D-coordinator ...

EXCELLENT post, Summerisfunner.


You didn't even mention how Zimmer was coaching a new scheme for the first time in his life while also employing at least 3 key rookies into the lineup.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

EXCELLENT post, Summerisfunner.

:thankyou:

btw, I've mentioned the 3-4 being totally foreign to Zimmer, and the rookies, in countless other threads, but you know who brushed them off as "excuses"

 

[BigWillie]

I think it's hilarious that most Zimmer threads would have turned into 5-6 page debates where most would argue that Zimmer is nowhere close to the likes of Williams or even Dom Capers. But in this thread, it is so eerily quite by them.

Major props!

 

[Bob Sacamano]

I think it's hilarious that most Zimmer threads would have turned into 5-6 page debates where most would argue that Zimmer is nowhere close to the likes of Williams or even Dom Capers. But in this thread, it is so eerily quite by them.

yes, I've noticed this too, but they'll be on here trying to save face with the same 'ole, same 'ole, *best TO impersonation* it's only a matta' of time

Major props!

Thank ye

 

[KINGBRICE_28]

defensively they didn't play much different scoring wise but sacks, fumble recoveres and INTS finally showed up......about 1 point avg difference between w1-8 & w-10-17

by week 9 they were like (-12 ) and brunell had only throw a couple ints so it wasn't the offense turning over the ball it was simply the defense not getting the ball on fumbles or the db's not being able to catch ints ( like the dropped TD against seattle ) everyone saw the stat on the seattle game about the sacks , like 4-5 a game......

then karma made the ball bounce their way.....hence all the "washington is the luckiest team ever" posts during the TB & SEA playoff games.....

I have to give him credit though.....too many ppl gauge defense by yardage when points is all that matters......both defenses will be better but I see both offenses taking a slight drop.....

edit: IMHO williams gets his media attention b/c he does it with only 1 DL-man.....While dallas doesn't have HOF guys upfront they are better.....Dallas won't have to blitz much to get pressure.....

edit#2: Keep in mind the Williams' calls are very aggressive and we do get burned often ( look at the AFC WEST games.....all of them....0-4.....but when he makes a call and it works, he is a hero.....he it doesn't well...he's an idiot and shoulda never been hired......ahhh the irony of the nfl......you guys know how that goes......

 

[Bob Sacamano]

defensively they didn't play much different scoring wise but sacks, fumble recoveres and INTS finally showed up......about 1 point avg difference between w1-8 & w-10-17

by week 9 they were like (-12 ) and brunell had only throw a couple ints so it wasn't the offense turning over the ball it was simply the defense not getting the ball on fumbles or the db's not being able to catch ints ( like the dropped TD against seattle ) everyone saw the stat on the seattle game about the sacks , like 4-5 a game......

then karma made the ball bounce their way.....hence all the "washington is the luckiest team ever" posts during the TB & SEA playoff games.....

I have to give him credit though.....too many ppl gauge defense by yardage when points is all that matters......both defenses will be better but I see both offenses taking a slight drop.....

that wasn't quite what my post was getting at, but the major lack of respect Zimmer is getting as a D-coordinator on here by some, and if it's true, most of the things I hear on here when Zimmer is bashed, is that Zimmer sucks, Greg WIlliams could do so much better, that he is so much better than Zimmer, blah blah blah

so I decided to look at Greg William's D and Mike Zimmer's D, and compared the 2, to see if that claim had any factual basis, and from the stats I pulled up and have before you, that is clearly not the case

but is Greg Williams a great D-coordinator? yes, is he better than Zimmer? probably, probably not, but Zimmer more than holds his own when you pit the success of these 2 Ds, head-to-head, and which proves that Zimmer isn't as bad as the bashers ignorantly claim he is

and don't forget, this was Zimmer's 1st year, ever, calling the 3-4, as well as the 1st year many of his players executed within the scheme, 4 of those key players being rookies, while Greg Williams and his veterans have had the luxury of a year already in the 4-3, plus Greg Williams calling the 4-3 for a long time...

 

[Bob Sacamano]

btw, how many players with a year or less of starting experience started all 16 games for you on D? just want to be clear

if my memory serves correct, I count 1, 1st year starter, LeMar Marshall taking over for Antonio Pierce at MLB

 

[mr.jameswoods]

Zimmer is not the root of our problems. Yes, he could be more aggressive but if our offense performed to the same level as our defense, we wouldn't be having this conversation. Our offense has been the bane of our problems yet we keep blaming the defense for our problems and focus on our defense in the draft and free agency. Yes, I know defense wins games but so does a strong offensive line and a running game.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Zimmer is not the root of our problems. Yes, he could be more aggressive but if our offense performed to the same level as our defense, we wouldn't be having this conversation. Our offense has been the bane of our problems yet we keep blaming the defense for our problems and focus on our defense in the draft and free agency. Yes, I know defense wins games but so does a strong offensive line and a running game.

while true, I don't like playing the blame game, the D could have done more, but unfortunately, the circumstances didn't warrant it, we're just not that far along on D, but we will be with that year of experience under our belts, and more pass-rushing talent added to the LBer corp

but you are correct, our O could have helped out the D more than they did, esp. during the 2nd half of the season, but our line prohibited it

 

[mr.jameswoods]

while true, I don't like playing the blame game, the D could have done more, but unfortunately, the circumstances didn't warrant it, we're just not that far along on D, but we will be with that year of experience under our belts, and more pass-rushing talent added to the LBer corp

but you are correct, our O could have helped out the D more than they did, esp. during the 2nd half of the season, but our line prohibited it

I just have a difficult time believing that Zimmer doesn't like to blitz or put pressure on the QB.

Coaches work with what they have. People were complaining about Parcells not opening up our offense but we couldn't open up our offense because we didn't have the right personnel on our OL. There is a reason Parcells used max protect schemes and it's not because he is a borning person who doesn't crave excitment. Likewise, I'm sure Zimmer would like to blitz if he had the proper personnel to pull it off. We need a free safety so Roy can play his natural position. We also need a strong and consistent #2 cornerback so that we can play more man coverage.

 

[superpunk]

summer.....

:worthy2: great post.

 

[BigDFan5]

bump.

 

[neosapien23]

I just have a difficult time believing that Zimmer doesn't like to blitz or put pressure on the QB.

Coaches work with what they have. People were complaining about Parcells not opening up our offense but we couldn't open up our offense because we didn't have the right personnel on our OL. There is a reason Parcells used max protect schemes and it's not because he is a borning person who doesn't crave excitment. Likewise, I'm sure Zimmer would like to blitz if he had the proper personnel to pull it off. We need a free safety so Roy can play his natural position. We also need a strong and consistent #2 cornerback so that we can play more man coverage.

We difinitely need another OLB that can rush the passer. The 3-4 doesn't do any good if everyone knows Ware is the 4th rusher.

 

[Rush 2112]

Cowboys/Skins:

20+Pass Plays 41/44 advantage Cowboys.

40+Pass Plays 9/7 advantage Skins.

Passing FD's 150/158 advantage Cowboys.

20+Run Plays 7/11 advantage Cowboys.

Henry is hobbled or out for half the season.

Put 5 LB's on IR.

Losing Flo crippled the O but also effected the D (lack of points, field position).

There's your 2nd half of season collapse in a nutshell.

 

[BigDFan5]

Cowboys/Skins:

20+Pass Plays 41/44 advantage Cowboys.

40+Pass Plays 9/7 advantage Skins.

Passing FD's 150/158 advantage Cowboys.

20+Run Plays 7/11 advantage Cowboys.

Henry is hobbled or out for half the season.

Put 5 LB's on IR.

Losing Flo crippled the O but also effected the D (lack of points, field position).

There's your 2nd half of season collapse in a nutshell.

 

[KINGBRICE_28]

lmao.....I just noticed "troll slayer" by your name......:laugh2:

 

[BigDFan5]

lmao.....I just noticed "troll slayer" by your name......:laugh2:

Just a hobby of mine, so don;t get on my bad side