Honestly who's upset with the NT and Safety position

[SixFiveCowboy]

Yeah I think people are more heartbroken that the Cowboys didn't get a "name" in the 2nd they knew or heard of because next season I see no reason why Kazee wouldn't be better than him.

Dan Quinn already said he needed his guys to be able to relay his message about the defense and how he wanted it played. Neal and Kazee were going to be starters on the defense no matter who we picked that's why I'm glad we didn't give away draft capital to have a 2nd string safety, 1st string special teamer.

 

[G2]

In reality, the only thing we needed was a FS. Wilson is good at SS. So I'm going to wait and see what they do.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Dan Quinn already said he needed his guys to be able to relay his message about the defense and how he wanted it played. Neal and Kazee were going to be starters on the defense no matter who we picked that's why I'm glad we didn't give away draft capital to have a 2nd string safety, 1st string special teamer.

Basically. We would be drafting a backup in the 2nd round. It would be silly.

 

[charron]

We got a NT. And we will just have to see about free safety I think that six round cornerback is moving to safety so maybe he'll work out starting next year I don't know.

 

[Doomsdayblitz]

Just a few of either safeties or big corners who could move there who were available at #99 in this draft:
I. Melifonwu, Sterns, Wade, J. Johnson, LeCounte, Nasirildeen.

DT1s who were there:
J. Tufele, B. Brown III, T. Shelvin, T. Slaten, M. Tuipolotu, M. Wilson.

Take your pick, but I think any one of them would be an upgrade to the player we did take.

 

[KingintheNorth]

Go find us a rangy S that we can trade for please

from https://bleacherreport.com/articles...2018-scouting-report-san-francisco-49ers-pick

POSITIVES

—Fast and fluid athlete who’s burst jumps off the tape.

—Smooth operator who easily handles transitions and flies his hips open with no hesitation. Has the speed to run down fast receivers.

—Can match-up over the top as a true free safety but also has the athleticism to jump down into the slot and cover up targets.

—Can come downhill with bad intentions and will strike ball-carriers.

—Long-armed player who uses that length well to challenge 50/50 balls and take away receptions.

NEGATIVES

—One-year starter who has to continue proving himself.

—Thin framed dude who looks like he needs the weight room.

Pro Day Scores
Pro Day Date: 3/29/2018
40 Yard Dash: 4.32 seconds
40 Yard (MPH): 18.94 (MPH)
20 Yard Split: 2.50 seconds
10 Yard Split: 1.51 seconds
Bench Press: (N/A) reps (225 lb)
Vertical Leap: 38.5 inches
Height: 73.13 inches
Weight: 199 lbs
Broad Jump: 133 inches
Hand Size: 9 inches
Arm Length: 33.13 inches
20 Yd Shuttle: 4.20 seconds
Three Cone: 6.95 seconds

 

[quickccc]

I've seen that kid in person quite a few times even though he played for my rival this kid is a stud make no mistake about it. He dropped because he was constantly being swapped around that defense by Muschamp to fill other holes. I honestly think his best position is safety because he is lethal when facing the ball in zone coverage. It's funny his draft profile reads almost identical to Kazee's coming out of college I honestly think Quinn is going to get the most out that kid.

Good points.

Kazee was seen as a slow but a very INT productive college CB, but those interested in him at the NFL level saw him as a safety that could be extremely
productive in the centerfield role.

In terms of producing INTs, Kazee picked up where he left off from college as far as INTs at the NFL level.
Hopefully Israel M becomes the same way.

I already like that the Cowboys are switching Israel from CB to safety in the same manner as Kazee was.
Already trying to put him the best position to have success.

 

[darthseinfeld]

from https://bleacherreport.com/articles...2018-scouting-report-san-francisco-49ers-pick

POSITIVES

—Fast and fluid athlete who’s burst jumps off the tape.

—Smooth operator who easily handles transitions and flies his hips open with no hesitation. Has the speed to run down fast receivers.

—Can match-up over the top as a true free safety but also has the athleticism to jump down into the slot and cover up targets.

—Can come downhill with bad intentions and will strike ball-carriers.

—Long-armed player who uses that length well to challenge 50/50 balls and take away receptions.

NEGATIVES

—One-year starter who has to continue proving himself.

—Thin framed dude who looks like he needs the weight room.

Pro Day Scores
Pro Day Date: 3/29/2018
40 Yard Dash: 4.32 seconds
40 Yard (MPH): 18.94 (MPH)
20 Yard Split: 2.50 seconds
10 Yard Split: 1.51 seconds
Bench Press: (N/A) reps (225 lb)
Vertical Leap: 38.5 inches
Height: 73.13 inches
Weight: 199 lbs
Broad Jump: 133 inches
Hand Size: 9 inches
Arm Length: 33.13 inches
20 Yd Shuttle: 4.20 seconds
Three Cone: 6.95 seconds

Are they shopping him?

 

[KingintheNorth]

Are they shopping him?

He's in the last year of his deal and he backs up Jimmie Ward who is signed through 2023.

 

[buybuydandavis]

Muka is the S. He doesn't have the skills to hold up in coverage and has played S in college.

Yeah, Muka looks like S material.

But Joseph looks like an excellent FS candidate. Excellent speed and ball skills. Relatively poor agility scores. Also, bit on double moves. Better suited for keeping plays in front of him and breaking on them.

https://www.si.com/nfl/draft/scouting-reports/kelvinjoseph

 

[eromeopolk]

Jesse Williams 325
Bryant 323
Mebane 311

I'm really not understanding your obsession w/ the exact weight of 320.

I am not obsessed. You are the one obsessed with big 320lb NT. Tuna and Son of a Bum played with Ratliff at the nose and had the 300lb Spears, and Canty at DE. Before that Tuna played with 260lb Jim Burt at NT on the Giants Super Bowl teams.

So my point again is when you run a 4-3 D. The Big NT is not a Big need. It is just a situational player. Size does not matter until the situation matters.

Also again, drafting a pure Safety with 1st round pick does not make sense unless it is a game changing player with game changing play making athleticism. Even Darren Woodson, who fit both game changer with play making athleticism, was a 2nd round linebacker conversion. Cornell Green (the greatest overall DB in Cowboys history in my opinion), and Charlie Waters were converted from CB. Cliff Harris, Mike Downs, Barry Church, and others were UDFA. CB is the most important position in a secondary.

Finally Red Bryant was not 323 pounds out of college which supports my other point is to add weight room weight on an athletic +300lb football player versus drafting a +320lb NT. Scroll down to his combine numbers.

NT and S are not the foundation of a Defense 4-3 or 3-4. I am not worried and neither should anyone else be worried about NT or Safety. Worry about the Jerry Dumbo GM Jones playing Awuzie and other players out of position at CB. Auwzie was NB/S/Rover for Colorado finishing as the all time sack leader by a DB at CU. Worry about Donovan Wilson not seeing the football field. Worry about Jabril Cox.

Jabril Cox should be a SS conversion like Kam Chancellor was a rover convert to FS conversion at VTech. You play Donovan Wilson at FS and Jabril Cox at SS ie. Kam Chancellor role for the Legion of Boom and your Safety problems are solved. Worry about Jerry Dumbo GM Jones, Quinn, and the Big Blue M&M.

 

[Shane612]

Woodson was a much better LB than Cox in college and transitioned a lot easier because he could play off blocks. Cox is more one dimensional and does not play the run nearly was well as Woodson did.

But you are probably right about them trying to play him there. He's light for a LB and more of a tweener.

One thing about him, as I watched a lot of Tigers ball, he is a play maker and at opportune times. They did not have their typically good D this past season but he was not the reason why.

If he can hold his own against big fast NFL TEs, and make some plays against the run, cowboys will be happy.
Maybe he'll grow into a HOFer....maybe....

 

[Shane612]

Someone else brought this up as well. I think it's a great idea. Not expecting a Woodson but a very competent SS would be a nice change.
He can play the spy position well against some option QBs.

For the record, it's the first thing I said when Cox was picked.

 

[jnday]

Let's not forget Donovan Wilson could be an answer for a long, long time and the Cowboys picked up a short term solution at free safety in Damontae Kazee. This wan't a great class at either safety or DT so Dallas could just be looking at stopgaps until the 2022 draft.

It wasn’t a great class for safeties, but there was a couple that they should have moved up for and drafted. It is inexcusable to ignore the safety position year after year. Those 3rd and 4th round picks that could have been used to trade up and draft a decent safety would have been much better spent than drafting some players that won’t be on the roster in two years. It is rare for any of the picks drafted after the second or third round to ever become good players anyway, especially the defensive that they tend to draft.

 

[jnday]

I am not obsessed. You are the one obsessed with big 320lb NT. Tuna and Son of a Bum played with Ratliff at the nose and had the 300lb Spears, and Canty at DE. Before that Tuna played with 260lb Jim Burt at NT on the Giants Super Bowl teams.

So my point again is when you run a 4-3 D. The Big NT is not a Big need. It is just a situational player. Size does not matter until the situation matters.

Also again, drafting a pure Safety with 1st round pick does not make sense unless it is a game changing player with game changing play making athleticism. Even Darren Woodson, who fit both game changer with play making athleticism, was a 2nd round linebacker conversion. Cornell Green (the greatest overall DB in Cowboys history in my opinion), and Charlie Waters were converted from CB. Cliff Harris, Mike Downs, Barry Church, and others were UDFA. CB is the most important position in a secondary.

Finally Red Bryant was not 323 pounds out of college which supports my other point is to add weight room weight on an athletic +300lb football player versus drafting a +320lb NT. Scroll down to his combine numbers.

NT and S are not the foundation of a Defense 4-3 or 3-4. I am not worried and neither should anyone else be worried about NT or Safety. Worry about the Jerry Dumbo GM Jones playing Awuzie and other players out of position at CB. Auwzie was NB/S/Rover for Colorado finishing as the all time sack leader by a DB at CU. Worry about Donovan Wilson not seeing the football field. Worry about Jabril Cox.

Jabril Cox should be a SS conversion like Kam Chancellor was a rover convert to FS conversion at VTech. You play Donovan Wilson at FS and Jabril Cox at SS ie. Kam Chancellor role for the Legion of Boom and your Safety problems are solved. Worry about Jerry Dumbo GM Jones, Quinn, and the Big Blue M&M.

There is a reason why FS and NT we not the foundation of the defense’s in Dallas. They refuse to spend the resources to get decent starters at either position. They ignore both positions instead of bringing in real talent . Maybe having good players at those positions would become foundation players. We know how bad the defense is without those positions being filled with talent. What can it hurt to use the resources on players that could make the positions much better. The approach they have made in the last decade to improve damn sure has failed.

 

[CT Dal Fan]

It wasn’t a great class for safeties, but there was a couple that they should have moved up for and drafted. It is inexcusable to ignore the safety position year after year. Those 3rd and 4th round picks that could have been used to trade up and draft a decent safety would have been much better spent than drafting some players that won’t be on the roster in two years. It is rare for any of the picks drafted after the second or third round to ever become good players anyway, especially the defensive that they tend to draft.

Trading up and sacrificing picks for a mediocre safety (we agree it wasn't a great class) wasn't going to fix anything. In Wilson, Kazee, etc. the Cowboys already have "decent" safeties.

I agree they've neglected the position for too long, but as far as this draft, the neglect can be justified.