I do not see any difference between that play and the Dez play in 2014 *merged*

[blindzebra]

The plays that have been ruled incorrectly were confirmed by the league to be incorrect. The league admits officiating mistakes.

Sure they do.

 

[KJJ]

Confirmed by the guy who got it wrong, yeah that is a shock.

The guy wasn’t wrong and the league confirmed it.

 

[KJJ]

Sure they do.

They absolutely do. They’ve been scrutinizing calls on NFL Network for years and any call that was incorrect was confirmed to be incorrect.

 

[nathanlt]

For all who might be confused by all of the misleading posts on here by a few of the posters who have NO CLUE how to read and interpret rules. I have officiated multiple sports for 25 plus years...explains the username...and I actually TAUGHT CLASSES for beginning officials. I know what I am talking about when it comes to rules and how case book plays work. I would not be bragging to say I would have been 1000 times more qualified to have held Blandino's position being he was an ex comedian who NEVER OFFICIATED A GAME IN HIS LIFE.
Here are the facts:
On the 4th and 2 play, Romo threw deep left to Dez. Dez high pointed it and brought it in gaining full control with both hands when his second foot lands. His body turns to his left, he takes a step and during this step, he becomes tangled up with Shields. As he starts to go down he moves the ball into his left hand...which is his dominate hand, and the one nearest the goalline...with his right hand he braces and simultaneously pushes off his left leg which goes from bent to fully extended, and this tosses up turf as he propels himself toward the endzone. As he lands just short of the goalline his control of the ball is temporarily lost.

In 2014 the rules for a catch read that a player needed to have control, have two feet down in bounds, and make or have the time to make a move common to the game.

The 2014 Case Book had the following play:

A.R. 8.12 GOING TO THE GROUND—COMPLETE PASS First-and-10-on B25. A1 throws a pass to A2 who controls the ball and gets one foot down before he is contacted by B1. He goes to the ground as a result of the contact, gets his second foot down, and with the ball in his right arm, he braces himself at the three-yard line with his left hand and simultaneously lunges forward toward the goal line. When he lands in the end zone, the ball comes out.
Ruling: Touchdown Team A. Kickoff A35. The pass is complete. When the receiver hits the ground in the end zone, it is the result of lunging forward after bracing himself at the three-yard line and is not part of the process of the catch. Since the ball crossed the goal line, it is a touchdown. If the ball is short of the goal line, it is a catch, and A2 is down by contact.

For those who don't know what a case book is, it is a supplement to the rule book that presents possible scenarios of plays that could happen under certain rules to show how the rule should be applied correctly. I will also mention that a major part of officiating is understanding how different rules line up to cover a play.

The case play presented above mixes two rules and a subsection of one of them. The first part is the catch rule, and under that rule is an item about going to the ground, which states a RECEIVER going to the ground with or without contact, must maintain control of the ball through contact with the ground. Now back to that earlier catch rule: control, two feet, and time to or an act common to the game. Why is this important? Because completing the act of a catch turns a RECEIVER to a RUNNER. Now that rule comes into play in terms of fumbles or down by contact.

Now let's review both what Dez did and the case play presented above. In both the receiver controlled the ball and was contacted by a defender causing them to go to the ground. The case play receiver landed on one foot, Dez landed on two. So going back to the catch rule Dez has completed 1. Control 2. Two feet down in bounds. In the case play the receiver takes a second step after contact, so now both have completed two of the three steps required to go from a RECEIVER to a RUNNER. At this point the case play RECEIVER braces and lunges to complete the third step of the catch process and is now considered a RUNNER. Dez meanwhile turns his body from the opposite sideline toward the goalline, steps with his left foot and his left leg bends at the knee as he continues down to the ground, Dez takes his right hand off the ball, with his left hand he starts to extend the ball while his right arm braces to keep his body up, with his left leg he pushes off, throws up turf, and his leg goes from bent to fully extended, he extends the ball even farther just before he hits the ground. Now the question to ask yourself here is, if the case play RECEIVER just braced and lunged to become a RUNNER, under the catch rule what did Dez do? By my count, he turned, took a step, moved the ball, braced, pushed off his left leg, and extended the ball. If the two acts the case play player did made him a RUNNER, what does the SIX ACTS DEZ DID make him?

All involved with the overturn talked post game about football moves, so regardless of what some want you to believe, in 2014 an act common to the game (football move) mattered when going to the ground, just as the case book play clearly states. In 2015 the NFL altered the rule and changed part three of the process to upright long enough to become a runner. Why is this so-called clarification crucial? Because it negates the catch process during going to the ground. In other words, the RECEIVER must become a RUNNER before they start the going to the ground process. Yes, I am aware that the case play above stuck around for the 2015 rule and case book, however it has not existed since 2015 and it contradicts the new wording of the rule. Let's just assume 2015 was bad editing for the case book.

If it were possible to end this discussion, you just did. Excellent. The NFL shills will continue to chirp, but all will sound more desperate after this post. Have a great night!

 

[blindzebra]

The guy wasn’t wrong and the league confirmed it.

The guy who overturned it was Blandino with Steretore. In 2014 NY worked with the ref, so again, just what do you know about this?

 

[nathanlt]

If you knew what you were talking about it would have been ruled a catch. I rest my case!

You never rest your case. C'mon!!!

 

[KJJ]

The league has admitted numerous officiating mistakes over the years. An entire officiating crew got fired several years ago for making a mistake.

 

[blindzebra]

They absolutely do. They’ve been scrutinizing calls on NFL Network for years and any call that was incorrect was confirmed to be incorrect.

The average game has probably has 5 to 10 questionable calls/no calls. If they admitted to every missed call the NFL network would be spending an hour reviewing missed calls.

 

[KJJ]

The guy who overturned it was Blandino with Steretore. In 2014 NY worked with the ref, so again, just what do you know about this?

Steratore and his crew were involved in the Calvin Johnson play, Dez play and Ertz play. No one knows the rule like Steratore. He was the one who alerted his crew during the Johnson play.

 

[KJJ]

The average game has probably has 5 to 10 questionable calls/no calls. If they admitted to every missed call the NFL network would be spending an hour reviewing missed calls.

The glaring mistakes are the ones that are brought to their attention. If the call was incorrect they admit it.

 

[KJJ]

You never rest your case. C'mon!!!

It’s difficult to rest it with as much ammo as I have. This is like target practice.

 

[Gator88]

The glaring mistakes are the ones that are brought to their attention. If the call was incorrect they admit it.

This is awfully naive of you to believe that they always admit when they got it wrong. They haven't admitted they got anything wrong on any call that even got close to the level of outrage that blown call generated. They only admit blown calls on pretty much meaningless plays.

 

[blindzebra]

Steratore and his crew were involved in the Calvin Johnson play, Dez play and Ertz play. No one knows the rule like Steratore. He was the one who alerted his crew during the Johnson play.

Once again, Johnson play was in the endzone, different criteria for a catch because he would not become a runner. Dez play was 100% wrong based on the existing case play. He did get the Ertz one correct.

 

[KJJ]

Once again, Johnson play was in the endzone, different criteria for a catch because he would not become a runner. Dez play was 100% wrong based on the existing case play. He did get the Ertz one correct.

CJ still had to complete the process because he was going to the ground.

 

[nathanlt]

It’s difficult to rest it with as much ammo as I have. This is like target practice.

Except all you do is shoot yourself in the foot.

 

[blindzebra]

CJ still had to complete the process because he was going to the ground.

Different rule. Catch rule versus item 1 of the catch rule. Someone who knows about rules would understand this simple distinction.

In the field of play in 2014 the 3 step process completed ends going to the ground because the receiver becomes a runner. In the endzone or a player going OOB they can't become a runner so they must maintain control...like I have been saying all along Dez and Johnson are apples and oranges.

 

[blindzebra]

Except all you do is shoot yourself in the foot.

If this were a boxing match the ref would have stopped it about 40 pages ago.

 

[KJJ]

This is awfully naive of you to believe that they always admit when they got it wrong. They haven't admitted they got anything wrong on any call that even got close to the level of outrage that blown call generated. They only admit blown calls on pretty much meaningless plays.

It’s awfully naïve for you to believe the league doesn’t admit obvious bad calls when everyone can see them on replay. What’s caused the level of outrage with the Dez play is the fact he caught the ball, changed hands with it and reached for the endzone. But because of a stupid rule the ball had to survive the ground. It’s mostly the rule that’s caused all the outrage.

 

[KJJ]

Except all you do is shoot yourself in the foot.

It’s those of you who keep arguing that the call was incorrect who are shooting yourselves in the foot. It’s making all of you look foolish. Three years and counting and you guys are still crying over it.

 

[KJJ]

Different rule. Catch rule versus item 1 of the catch rule. Someone who knows about rules would understand this simple distinction.

In the field of play in 2014 the 3 step process completed ends going to the ground because the receiver becomes a runner. In the endzone or a player going OOB they can't become a runner so they must maintain control...like I have been saying all along Dez and Johnson are apples and oranges.

Give it a rest!