I guess we weren't planning on using our 2nd round pick this year

[RS12]

Smith is already regaining nerve function. His nerve is expected to finish healing by July. I believe if the latest MRI's would have indicated if there was scar tissue forming inside the nerve preventing a full recovery.

There is no certainty because the regeneration is ongoing but I wouldn't be surprised to see him in TC.

Come on Fuzz. Didnt Stephen say something to the effect last night, good chance he doesnt play this year? I'd be shocked if he played at all, certainly not before game 11 and I doubt that happens. He only had the surgery less than 4 months ago.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Based on the uncertainty of this injury. Even you said this in another thread:



So like I said, that is extremely optimistic. Your worst case is undergoing another surgery in the fall.

You're assuming setbacks. He is already halfway through the recovery and those complications have not happened . Meanwhile he is already regaining sensation in the foot. Your concerns were much more daunting in January. Now they can track the nerves regeneration by MRI and he can feel the leg.

We're arguing from a position of ignorance because we don't get to see his medical imaging to be sure. I just don't believe they would have picked him if the MRI showed scars forming meaning he had to undergo more surgery. If the regen is clean then it makes sense to be optimistic.

 

[CyberB0b]

We're arguing from a position of ignorance because we don't get to see his medical imaging to be sure. I just don't believe they would have picked him if the MRI showed scars forming meaning he had to undergo more surgery. If the regen is clean then it makes sense to be optimistic.

Sure. I don't think we are really arguing. I am just saying seeing him in training camp is absolute best case scenario, and worst case is that he is never the same player again. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Come on Fuzz. Didnt Stephen say something to the effect last night, good chance he doesnt play this year? I'd be shocked if he played at all, certainly not before game 11 and I doubt that happens. He only had the surgery less than 4 months ago.

i'm just saying he can practice without hurting himself further. Jerry said he could see him back around the same time that the suspensions happened. I don't recall what Stephen said exactly.

Of course there could be a complication and of course him being medically cleared to play is not the same as a full recovery. They won't let him go out there unless he meets strength and range of motion benchmarks but even then the never and knee will continue to get stronger and more limber even after that point.

 

[gmoney112]

You're assuming setbacks. He is already halfway through the recovery and those complications have not happened . Meanwhile he is already regaining sensation in the foot. Your concerns were much more daunting in January. Now they can track the nerves regeneration by MRI and he can feel the leg.

We're arguing from a position of ignorance because we don't get to see his medical imaging to be sure. I just don't believe they would have picked him if the MRI showed scars forming meaning he had to undergo more surgery. If the regen is clean then it makes sense to be optimistic.

I haven't done as much research, but tracking nerve regeneration is done by EMG or NCV tests I believe, not MRI.

That's all I got.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Sure. I don't think we are really arguing. I am just saying seeing him in training camp is absolute best case scenario, and worst case is that he is never the same player again. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

It's an argument but in the socratic sense and not the mean-spirited kind. I have love and respect for all.

We will just have to wait and see. I like Smith's chances for a full recovery and he has the work ethic to quicken the pace.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I haven't done as much research, but tracking nerve regeneration is done by EMG or NCV tests I believe, not MRI.

That's all I got.

MRI is used to see the formation of scar tissue. Those other tests just see how well the axons can carry the charge and test function. I imagine all will be used but there is s specific MRI technique that tunes to the resonance of nerves. It's how you determine the where the blockage occurred.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I haven't done as much research, but tracking nerve regeneration is done by EMG or NCV tests I believe, not MRI.

That's all I got.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_resonance_neurography

That is the wiki page on the technique.

 

[conner01]

Based on the uncertainty of this injury. Even you said this in another thread:



So like I said, that is extremely optimistic. Your worst case is undergoing another surgery in the fall.

Pro bowler in 3 years and no
Long term issues unlike jack who has degenerative issues
Risky, yes. But to get one of the top players in the draft and just have to wait a year, well worth the risk

 

[SilverStarCowboy]

Planned on him not playing, Jaylon Smith guarantees he'll play this year...another FAIL, we suck.

 

[BAZ]

The draft will be remembered and ultimately graded by the outcome of Smiths recovery. I'm ok with the gamble, but I do understand the reasoning of expecting more immediate results from the 34th pick.

I respectfully disagree, this is all about how Zeke performs. If he is the next Trent Richardson it's a far bigger deal. He can be the balm on the Smith pick for years. If Myles Jack goes off this year people will still give it a bit of time. If Zeke fails this is how everyone will say they are stupid for going RB that early. I would have preferred Jack but admire the possibility of greatness. Seems they wanted Qb early and that put a bit of a spanner in the works. But nothing ventured nothing gained. Low and slow doesn't win Superbowls.

 

[Section446]

Lattimore's was the result of a helmet to the knee. It compressed and twisted violently. He tore his ACL, PCL, and LCL as well as severe damage -although not completely severed- to a major artery and his peroneal nerve.

Smith just planted his similar to what Lee did and his knee popped. The complication came when he was pushed and he planted on that left foot briefly before limping off it immediately unable to bear weight. When he did that he stretched the peroneal briefly. He ended with damage to his ACL, PCL, and peroneal.

So Lattimore's knee suffered the trauma of a helmet striking the knee and then getting compressed and twisted in a pile. Smith's popped and then he stepped on the knee for half a second.

Ultimately Lattimore had a degenerative circumstance. He said his knee never felt structurally sound after the reconstruction and he had progressively worsening pain. There is no indication that is the case with Smith.

If you are into qualitative generalizations then Dr. Andrews said that Lattimore's injury was "as bad as you will see in football" whereas, Dr. Cooper said the Smith's nerve was not damaged like you see in severe knee injuries.

No clue what your qualifications are, but you sure as hell sound like you know what you're talking about.

 

[BigStar]

I respectfully disagree, this is all about how Zeke performs. If he is the next Trent Richardson it's a far bigger deal. He can be the balm on the Smith pick for years. If Myles Jack goes off this year people will still give it a bit of time. If Zeke fails this is how everyone will say they are stupid for going RB that early. I would have preferred Jack but admire the possibility of greatness. Seems they wanted Qb early and that put a bit of a spanner in the works. But nothing ventured nothing gained. Low and slow doesn't win Superbowls.

Spot on.
Once we were to slow to get into the QB game for Wentz/Goff; they went for immediate impact. We're kind of used to not relying on 2nds in these parts. Our hits are generally in the 1st. Cool to have Fuzzy on here to answer medical questions. Good look there Fuzz. Actually warming up to the Jaylon pick a bit more even w/disagreeing with the selection in theory, etc. Tbh both picks aren't "GM smart" but may turn out great due to the circumstances.

Really thought we would take Ramsey there tbh and Spence could be suspended next year, and going w/Spriggs over Free, Ragland this year had question marks. Bell probably could have supplanted Church but would have been a reach @ 34.

Gimme that 1500 Zeke!

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

No clue what your qualifications are, but you sure as hell sound like you know what you're talking about.

I am not a doctor but an engineer so I have no specialty here. I've just been studying Smith injury with people here and there ever since we picked him. Thanks though as I try hard to be fact based.

 

[BigStar]

I am not a doctor but an engineer so I have no specialty here. I've just been studying Smith injury with people here and there ever since we picked him. Thanks though as I try hard to be fact based.

Coulda fooled me into showing up for a visit Impressive tbh

 

[bsbellomy]

I'm not sure he was the most talented player in the draft. He had a severe injury very late in the year and will not contribute much, if at all, this year. This is assuming he makes it back to becoming the player he was. It isn't that hard to understand that we need contributors.

Didn't the safety from WV that got drafted like 14th have the same injury like year earlier? Seems to me like the medical technology has come a long way when it comes to these surgeries.

 

[CyberB0b]

Didn't the safety from WV that got drafted like 14th have the same injury like year earlier? Seems to me like the medical technology has come a long way when it comes to these surgeries.

Less severe injury and happened a few months before Smith's.

 

[BAZ]

Spot on.
Once we were to slow to get into the QB game for Wentz/Goff; they went for immediate impact. We're kind of used to not relying on 2nds in these parts. Our hits are generally in the 1st. Cool to have Fuzzy on here to answer medical questions. Good look there Fuzz. Actually warming up to the Jaylon pick a bit more even w/disagreeing with the selection in theory, etc. Tbh both picks aren't "GM smart" but may turn out great due to the circumstances.

Really thought we would take Ramsey there tbh and Spence could be suspended next year, and going w/Spriggs over Free, Ragland this year had question marks. Bell probably could have supplanted Church but would have been a reach @ 34.

Gimme that 1500 Zeke!

I think everyone knows Jacksonville is a talent vacuum. If Jack and Ramsey succeed there.... Ouch

 

[BigStar]

I think everyone knows Jacksonville is a talent vacuum. If Jack and Ramsey succeed there.... Ouch

Yeah they can make us look pretty stupid very easily in 1-2 years.

 

[DTown214]

I don't understand how anyone can't like the Jaylon Smith pick. The argument seems to be that we need immediate production. So you're telling me you'd rather have some second tier pass rusher that'll probably get 2 sacks next season or would you want a potential perennial pro bowler, top 5 talent in the draft that has to take a season to heal? Seems like a no-brainer to me.