I guess we weren't planning on using our 2nd round pick this year

[65fastback2plus2]

We usually use our 2nd on a TE...who suits up but "won't play this year"... So I'm used to it

 

[TrailBlazer]

Based on what? He is 16 weeks post op from the reconstruction and is already squatting and cutting on the knee. He claims it is pain free.

The nerve regeneration is happening on schedule and should be done around July. It could take longer but MRI can see the progression.

Now granted he needs to continue and complete his rehab but all indications are that he is ahead of schedule not behind.

Of course he claims it is pain free. He was trying to get drafted.
I don't see how anyone can be so optimistic without seeing any of the MRI's/scans/whatever. Especially when all we have heard is that this guy won't play this year and might not be completely ready in 2017. But Fuzzy says otherwise..

Would you be this optimistic about this injury if it were a different team that selected him?

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Of course he claims it is pain free. He was trying to get drafted.
I don't see how anyone can be so optimistic without seeing any of the MRI's/scans/whatever. Especially when all we have heard is that this guy won't play this year and might not be completely ready in 2017. But Fuzzy says otherwise..

Would you be this optimistic about this injury if it were a different team that selected him?

My outlook is factual, logical and not incredulity based on bias and cynicism.

I say he is pain free because he says he is and all of the training he is already undergoing. You say he's not because of incredulity.

I say the nerve recovery is going well because he is regaining sensation in the extremity indicating that the regeneration has begun.

It's funny that you bring up MRI because a standard technique called magnetic resonance neurography allows doctors see inside the nerve to see whether or not scar tissue was forming. While we are not privy to such images his doctor Cooper is. BTW scar tissue is what would prevent a full recovery. Dr. Cooper looked at those images and determined that his prognosis still was for a full recovery.

Your dark wishful thinking would have him a liar as well?

 

[Corso]

It makes things so easy to judge since drafted players can only play the very next year and that's it. Done.
Thank goodness for simplicity.

 

[Blast From The Past]

You don't draft for this year.

anything you get this year is a big bonus from your draft class

 

[Redball Express]

Smith will recover and be the steal of this draft.

A gamble worth taking.

The way I look at it..

the pick for Smith is like a #1 pick in 2017 as if he was graduating next year instead of this.

I could care less if he plays this year..

just heal.

If we improve and if we win the East..

no way we would be able to get somebody like Smith next year..we will be picking at 25+ again.

So its worth the gamble.

Besides..there were no sure things defensively where we were picking in rd #2.

So I think it will be fine but its a risk-rewards thing we have to live with.

 

[TrailBlazer]

My outlook is factual, logical and not incredulity based on bias and cynicism.

I say he is pain free because he says he is and all of the training he is already undergoing. You say he's not because of incredulity.

I say the nerve recovery is going well because he is regaining sensation in the extremity indicating that the regeneration has begun.

It's funny that you bring up MRI because a standard technique called magnetic resonance neurography allows doctors see inside the nerve to see whether or not scar tissue was forming. While we are not privy to such images his doctor Cooper is. BTW scar tissue is what would prevent a full recovery. Dr. Cooper looked at those images and determined that his prognosis still was for a full recovery.

Your dark wishful thinking would have him a liar as well?

Your outlook is based on hope. That's it. I hope the best for the player but everything we've heard about this injury has been negative. I'm simply asking why you are so optimistic without knowing anything specific. Is it because Dallas is so much smarter than everyone else? At least acknowledge there's a chance he won't play again or reach his full potential bc of it. I think Dallas understands this but was willing to take the risk.

 

[seamus18]

Sorry, but I love, love, Love the Jaylon a Smith pick! It's one pick in one draft. No guarantees with any player, ever. Very happy.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Your outlook is based on hope. That's it. I hope the best for the player but everything we've heard about this injury has been negative. I'm simply asking why you are so optimistic without knowing anything specific. Is it because Dallas is so much smarter than everyone else? At least acknowledge there's a chance he won't play again or reach his full potential bc of it. I think Dallas understands this but was willing to take the risk.

I just listed several facts which you don't dispute. If you want to be pigheaded then go ahead but he is regaining sensation already, those MRN tests do exist, and Dr. Cooper could tell whether or not scar tissue is forming from those scans. Those are all specific facts to the principal agents involved.

Your wishful thinking is for failure. How droll.

 

[Beast_from_East]

Lattimore's was the result of a helmet to the knee. It compressed and twisted violently. He tore his ACL, PCL, and LCL as well as severe damage -although not completely severed- to a major artery and his peroneal nerve.

Smith just planted his similar to what Lee did and his knee popped. The complication came when he was pushed and he planted on that left foot briefly before limping off it immediately unable to bear weight. When he did that he stretched the peroneal briefly. He ended with damage to his ACL, PCL, and peroneal.

So Lattimore's knee suffered the trauma of a helmet striking the knee and then getting compressed and twisted in a pile. Smith's popped and then he stepped on the knee for half a second.

Ultimately Lattimore had a degenerative circumstance. He said his knee never felt structurally sound after the reconstruction and he had progressively worsening pain. There is no indication that is the case with Smith.

If you are into qualitative generalizations then Dr. Andrews said that Lattimore's injury was "as bad as you will see in football" whereas, Dr. Cooper said the Smith's nerve was not damaged like you see in severe knee injuries.

Thanks for the info bro, I feel better about the pick now...............if this guy can return to anything close to what he was, it will be a freaking steal at 34!!!

 

[Beast_from_East]

I don't understand how anyone can't like the Jaylon Smith pick. The argument seems to be that we need immediate production. So you're telling me you'd rather have some second tier pass rusher that'll probably get 2 sacks next season or would you want a potential perennial pro bowler, top 5 talent in the draft that has to take a season to heal? Seems like a no-brainer to me.

Exactly.........you draft for what the player will be over the next 10 years, not what he will be this year.

 

[Beast_from_East]

We typically draft TEs in the second round that spend their rookie year guarding the water bucket while Witten takes every snap, so why the complaining?

And its not like we are drafting studs in the 2nd round anyways, just look at our 2nd round picks over the last decade. Only 1 player drafted in the second round in the past 10 years received a second contract, that was Sean Lee.

So we have a 10% success rate on our 2nd round picks over the last decade and people are complaining we drafted Jaylon? Seriously?

 

[T-RO]

Based on what? He is 16 weeks post op from the reconstruction and is already squatting and cutting on the knee. He claims it is pain free.

The nerve regeneration is happening on schedule and should be done around July. It could take longer but MRI can see the progression.

Now granted he needs to continue and complete his rehab but all indications are that he is ahead of schedule not behind.

This kind of nerve damage sometimes NEVER fully heals. I suspect most of you saw him in recent footage doing drills...is everyone clear that while doing those drills he was wearing an AFO.

More importantly... is everyone clear on what that AFO does?

An ankle foot orthosis (AFO) device is used to help a person pick up their foot when can't do it on their own. The man cannot properly pick up his own foot right now without help...or swing it out to the side.

In other words....on draft day the man was partly paralyzed!

To speak of this healing inexorably...inevitably like a broken bone... or even like something where there is a known timeframe like an ACL....this isn't like that at all.

Obviously the doctor believes it will *probably* heal completely or heal up 95%...but we are still talking about probabilities...not certainties. And any residual damage for an athlete who relies on his wheels...is a very big deal.

Edit: Fuzzy...I see you added more clarity in your later posts...perhaps after doing some more reading.

 

[waving monkey]

I like the long view. I think short sightedness is problematic in American culture

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

This kind of nerve damage sometimes NEVER fully heals. I suspect most of you saw him in recent footage doing drills...is everyone clear that while doing those drills he was wearing an AFO.

More importantly... is everyone clear on what that AFO does?

An ankle foot orthosis (AFO) device is used to help a person pick up their foot when can't do it on their own. The man cannot properly pick up his own foot right now without help...or swing it out to the side.

In other words....on draft day the man was partly paralyzed!

To speak of this healing inexorably...inevitably like a broken bone... or even like something where there is a known timeframe like an ACL....this isn't like that at all.

Obviously the doctor believes it will *probably* heal completely or heal up 95%...but we are still talking about probabilities...not certainties. And any residual damage for an athlete who relies on his wheels...is a very big deal.

Edit: Fuzzy...I see you added more clarity in your later posts...perhaps after doing some more reading.

Yes they do not always heal because scar tissue forms and blocks the channel or if there is damage to the exterior of the nerve causing a blood supply issue else the nerve will try to regen spontaneously. MRN can track nerve regeneration and scar tissue formation. The doctor is making an extremely informed opinion.

The exterior of the nerve was intact and he has already started regenening.

 

[alicetooljam]

You can hate the gamble all you want but if it works, we came away with arguably 2 top 5 guys from this draft. Its over, let it go. Theres nothing left to do but hope they both become great.

 

[Redball Express]

Exactly.........you draft for what the player will be over the next 10 years, not what he will be this year.

The difference here is this doctor.

His relation to the team elevates the decision.

It isn't like we need him this year anyway at the position.

The opposite here is the fact the team tried to trade for Paxton Lynch and would have surely used their 2nd rd. pick to do that.

And Lynch would probably sit for 2-3 years waiting for his chance and holding for extra points.

But no problem there.

We didn't waste that pick, right?

Some would say yes we did.

So its all in how you see it.