If AP is available

[Galian Beast]

I'm with the 'nothing' crowd. The Cowboys are in what I would desribe as a manageable cap hell. AP makes it an unmanageable cap hell, meaning that the Cowboys would likely have to release other key players just to make room for AP. And I really don't think an aging HB is the guy you want to do that for. AP 5 to 6 years ago and maybe I'd be willing to talk, but I'm pretty sure the Vikings would not be willing talk under those circumstances.

I just made a post in regards to manageable cap hell. I don't think we're in it. I think we would be in manageable cap hell if we got AP. And the thing about winning is you can turn around some players and trade them for picks when you're winning games. Players like Cole Beasley instantly become worth 2nd or 3rd round draft picks after winning a super bowl. AP would help take us to another level. You have AP and Murray, and Romo all of a sudden has the best offense in the nfl.

 

[cowboyschmps3]

Well, I'm all for it, he's on a bad team from what I saw yesterday.

 

[erod]

Running backs are a dime a dozen in this NFL. Sadly.

You do NOT pay them. You draft them and let them go when they're contract is up, and then draft another one. Churn them and burn them.

 

[Floatyworm]

Not that we could afford it but here's another way to look at this.

We probably have a 2 to 3 year window with the current core. We have a good chance to take the division this year. AP is from a different planet but probably has that same 2 to 3 year window skill wise. Do you make the trade and buy in to win now in this window? knowing that in 3 years you're probably looking at a large turnover and rebuild? If we win the division this year look at what you face in the playoffs. A game at home maybe but an away trip to places like GB, NO, SEA, SF. Does adding AP take you to another level to win at those places this year and probably over the next 2 or 3? Not to mention enhancing your chances of winning the division consistently in that same window.

As cool as it would be to see AP on this team it is not happening but the above scenario is another angle to look at it from.

Totally agree and think we should pull the trigger.....This last injury to Murray(when he wasn't even touched)did it for me. There are always......possibilties

 

[KJJ]

AP hasn't looked that great this season he's only had a couple of 100 yard games and will be 29 in March I wouldn't even consider the price tag Minn would want for him.

 

[jterrell]

AP is not even a consideration here.
Too expensive, too coveted, too old for a RB.

We do not need another big contract. We are already FAR over the cap for next year.
Adding 2.9 at RB isn't going to happen... much less eating 30 mil over the next 3 seasons in cap costs.

And we need all our draft picks to fill roster spots as we recover from cap hell that no one seems to acknowledge.

Stephen tells the media the Cowboys get done what they want but he's talking nonsense.
Which he admits when he points to cap limitations when asked about various players.

Other goofball stuff: Beasley. We aren't trading him, we are starting him as the slot WR when Miles leaves.
His value to us versus salary is immense.

Please just stop and think before posting gibberish.

 

[jterrell]

I just made a post in regards to manageable cap hell. I don't think we're in it. I think we would be in manageable cap hell if we got AP. And the thing about winning is you can turn around some players and trade them for picks when you're winning games. Players like Cole Beasley instantly become worth 2nd or 3rd round draft picks after winning a super bowl. AP would help take us to another level. You have AP and Murray, and Romo all of a sudden has the best offense in the nfl.

Your post would be fine if it actually considered the cap situation.
Dallas is already pushing 5-7 players cap hits forward yearly.
AFTER ALL the restructures next year they'll have 6 or 7m TOTAL to play with.
You don't pay a RB half that while basically doubling his cap hit every year you keep him and eating a poison pill to cut him.
Not when you have 4 on the roster at that total 3m.

If we were in a good cap situation and had reserved the cap push for now this might make sense.
But as it is it is beyond fantasy stuff.

 

[Galian Beast]

AP is not even a consideration here.
Too expensive, too coveted, too old for a RB.

We do not need another big contract. We are already FAR over the cap for next year.
Adding 2.9 at RB isn't going to happen... much less eating 30 mil over the next 3 seasons in cap costs.

And we need all our draft picks to fill roster spots as we recover from cap hell that no one seems to acknowledge.

Stephen tells the media the Cowboys get done what they want but he's talking nonsense.
Which he admits when he points to cap limitations when asked about various players.

Other goofball stuff: Beasley. We aren't trading him, we are starting him as the slot WR when Miles leaves.
His value to us versus salary is immense.

Please just stop and think before posting gibberish.

You seem to have a hard time comprehending things.

#1 please see my topic in regards to the cap situation for next year.
#2 please see my post about how much AP would cost over the next 3 years.
#3 We're not in cap hell. See #1
#4 He isn't talking nonsense, please point to the last player that we wanted to keep but couldn't afford. Please do not include players who were overpaid.
#5 I wasn't suggesting trading beasley right now. My point was that if we won a super bowl or two, players LIKE him shoot up in value in future years, and are more easily traded, which helps build your team through the draft.

 

[Galian Beast]

Your post would be fine if it actually considered the cap situation.
Dallas is already pushing 5-7 players cap hits forward yearly.
AFTER ALL the restructures next year they'll have 6 or 7m TOTAL to play with.
You don't pay a RB half that while basically doubling his cap hit every year you keep him and eating a poison pill to cut him.
Not when you have 4 on the roster at that total 3m.

If we were in a good cap situation and had reserved the cap push for now this might make sense.
But as it is it is beyond fantasy stuff.

We actually had quite a bit more than 6 or 7 million to play with. Please read my topic on the salary cap.

There is a poison pill, but the question is, is that poison pill worth it to be a devastating offense for the next 3 years. I'd say it is. And that it would be manageable.

Many of the contracts you're referring to don't have longevity. You're looking at a reset in about 2015 going forward into 2017.

 

[jterrell]

You seem to have a hard time comprehending things.

#1 please see my topic in regards to the cap situation for next year.
#2 please see my post about how much AP would cost over the next 3 years.
#3 We're not in cap hell. See #1
#4 He isn't talking nonsense, please point to the last player that we wanted to keep but couldn't afford. Please do not include players who were overpaid.
#5 I wasn't suggesting trading beasley right now. My point was that if we won a super bowl or two, players LIKE him shoot up in value in future years, and are more easily traded, which helps build your team through the draft.

1. Saw your post and it was clueless of our current cap.
2. see number 1.
3. see number 1.
4. Yes, he is. Which is why he contradicts his self. He's complained about that 5m cap penalty 100 times.
5. What all players have won SBs then shot up in value to be traded for 2nd/3rd round picks? That was a complete fantasy post with emphasis on the fantasy.

 

[Galian Beast]

1. Saw your post and it was clueless of our current cap.
2. see number 1.
3. see number 1.
4. Yes, he is. Which is why he contradicts his self. He's complained about that 5m cap penalty 100 times.
5. What all players have won SBs then shot up in value to be traded for 2nd/3rd round picks? That was a complete fantasy post with emphasis on the fantasy.

It doesn't sound like you read the topic in which I discuss the current cap situation for 2014.

He hasn't contradicted himself, that 5 million dollar cap obviously hurt us, and made it more difficult to do things. You have to realize losing 5 million in a year is like losing a pro bowl player, or 2 or 3 solid contributors. Doesn't mean you can't work the cap, but it isn't a good thing.

Please look at New England and the players they've been able to trade like Deon Branch.

 

[jterrell]

We actually had quite a bit more than 6 or 7 million to play with. Please read my topic on the salary cap.

There is a poison pill, but the question is, is that poison pill worth it to be a devastating offense for the next 3 years. I'd say it is. And that it would be manageable.

Many of the contracts you're referring to don't have longevity. You're looking at a reset in about 2015 going forward into 2017.

No we do not have more than 6 or 7 m to play with.
The cap starts 31m OVER.
We cut 37 or 38M via restructures AT MOST. ---this would include insane restructures for 30+ year old guys beyond Romo.

We can create another 6-8M max with realistic options(Cut Bern/Miles) but then have to replace Waters, Spencer, Miles.
And we have a draft class to sign.
The 6-7M is really the cap we have to play with after rookie signings.
That's it.

We also have Dez Bryant to pay very soon.

And no the contracts aren't short term that are causing problems.
The biggest money guys are signed long-term. Romo/Ware/Carr/Lee/Witten.

What you are struggling to grasp is we have ALREADY used up our future cash.

 

[Galian Beast]

No we do not have more than 6 or 7 m to play with.
The cap starts 31m OVER.
We cut 37 or 38M via restructures AT MOST. ---this would include insane restructures for 30+ year old guys beyond Romo.

We can create another 6-8M max with realistic options(Cut Bern/Miles) but then have to replace Waters, Spencer, Miles.
And we have a draft class to sign.
The 6-7M is really the cap we have to play with after rookie signings.
That's it.

We also have Dez Bryant to pay very soon.

And no the contracts aren't short term that are causing problems.
The biggest money guys are signed long-term. Romo/Ware/Carr/Lee/Witten.

What you are struggling to grasp is we have ALREADY used up our future cash.

Do the math properly, you're way off base.

You can get up to nearly 20 million with cap restructures and releases.

The cost of replacing these players isn't as high as you think either. Especially if you draft their replacements. Paying Dez Bryant isn't going to hurt us in 2015. It might even reduce his base salary. We save money by releasing Ware. And a lot of it. I don't think you know how the salary cap works or have any familiarity with how our salary situation looks. Like I said, I made a topic on it. Please use it for your reference.

 

[jterrell]

It doesn't sound like you read the topic in which I discuss the current cap situation for 2014.

He hasn't contradicted himself, that 5 million dollar cap obviously hurt us, and made it more difficult to do things. You have to realize losing 5 million in a year is like losing a pro bowl player, or 2 or 3 solid contributors. Doesn't mean you can't work the cap, but it isn't a good thing.

Please look at New England and the players they've been able to trade like Deon Branch.

I respect that you are "trying" to talk football here but you really are not making any salient, logical points.

If 5m in cap penalty hurts then you can't say we can do whatever we want. Doing whatever we want means the exact opposite of hurt.
Hurt does not equal unaffected. Those are actually pretty good antonyms.

Stephen Jones is like a guy whose girl broke up with him saying he's unaffected and life goes on.
Then he goes home and cries in his beer every night.

There have obviously been players we would have went after had we had 10m in free cap space that we did not.
So to say we do whatever we want is basically a bold-faced lie.
There's a reason we have added Brodney Pool and Will Allen as potential starting safeties the past two seasons.
And it isn't because we loved them on tape.

That's readily apparent.

As is the cap situation.
We are in cap hell in 2014 and 2015 ALREADY.
We will dig out but not by "doing whatever we want".
We'll do it by playing young kids as Stephen alludes to.

As to the Deion Branch thing ... Branch was Tom Brady's favorite WR and top target.
He was a Super Bowl MVP.
He wasn't traded because his value rose, He was traded because the Pats didn't wanna pay him 7m a year.
He came into the league as a 2nd round pick.

Beasley is a 3rd WR not Romo's top target.

The closest example of a guy rising would be in reverse for the Pats. They traded FOR Wes Welker after good production on losing Miami teams.

 

[03EBZ06]

I don't mind seeing some restructuring to keep it under the cap but when I see so many restructures (8+) to get under the cap and to get few free agents, I don't like it.

 

[Zimmy Lives]

If AP is available the Cowboys should trade DM for AP and Minny's 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round picks along with two defensive starters.

 

[KJJ]

Running backs are a dime a dozen in this NFL. Sadly.

You do NOT pay them. You draft them and let them go when they're contract is up, and then draft another one. Churn them and burn them.

With the NFL geared toward passing RB's aren't near as coveted as they once were which is why teams are willing to move good RB's to position themselves for an elite QB in the draft. They figure they can find a solid RB later in the draft.

 

[Galian Beast]

I respect that you are "trying" to talk football here but you really are not making any salient, logical points.

If 5m in cap penalty hurts then you can't say we can do whatever we want. Doing whatever we want means the exact opposite of hurt.
Hurt does not equal unaffected. Those are actually pretty good antonyms.

Stephen Jones is like a guy whose girl broke up with him saying he's unaffected and life goes on.
Then he goes home and cries in his beer every night.

There have obviously been players we would have went after had we had 10m in free cap space that we did not.
So to say we do whatever we want is basically a bold-faced lie.
There's a reason we have added Brodney Pool and Will Allen as potential starting safeties the past two seasons.
And it isn't because we loved them on tape.

That's readily apparent.

As is the cap situation.
We are in cap hell in 2014 and 2015 ALREADY.
We will dig out but not by "doing whatever we want".
We'll do it by playing young kids as Stephen alludes to.

As to the Deion Branch thing ... Branch was Tom Brady's favorite WR and top target.
He was a Super Bowl MVP.
He wasn't traded because his value rose, He was traded because the Pats didn't wanna pay him 7m a year.
He came into the league as a 2nd round pick.

Beasley is a 3rd WR not Romo's top target.

The closest example of a guy rising would be in reverse for the Pats. They traded FOR Wes Welker after good production on losing Miami teams.

Hurt =/= debilitating.

Again, please read the topic. You keep calling it cap hell, yet you have no idea what you're talking about.

Branch got a 2nd round draft pick, and he was a player who did not have any significant production. Beasley is Romo's 3rd target, but we've yet to see his complete upside. I wouldn't be surprised if we won a super bowl if his value would be as high as a 3rd, more to the point, he was merely an example.

And that is the exact point, certain players you don't want to pay big money to, and that is the same situation we will be in with players like Murray. Yet we're forced to overpay these players or release them because we cant get value out of them in trades. Bennett, Burnett, Canty, Bowen, e.t.c.

 

[jterrell]

Do the math properly, you're way off base.

You can get up to nearly 20 million with cap restructures and releases.

The cost of replacing these players isn't as high as you think either. Especially if you draft their replacements. Paying Dez Bryant isn't going to hurt us in 2015. It might even reduce his base salary. We save money by releasing Ware. And a lot of it. I don't think you know how the salary cap works or have any familiarity with how our salary situation looks. Like I said, I made a topic on it. Please use it for your reference.

ROFL. You are hopelessly without a clue.

Dez Bryant makes 1.8M in base salary in 2014.
To lower his cap hit with extension is mathematically impossible.
In fact he will almost certainly count a minimum of double in 2014 if extended early.
OR you wait til 2015 and then you have to franchise tag him while you negotiate.
That's about 13m on books until we get him resigned.
And even if his base in 2015 is 800k he'll still cost us more than his 1.8 base in 2014 because he's not signing a deal for 5m or less SB plus base in 2014.
That's so far below his value the NFLPA would file suit if he tried to sign that.
He's getting top 5 WR money.
In case you're curious. CJ and Fitz both got ~115m.... and 16m yearly averages.

As to Ware.
NO! We do not get money back anytime soon. If we cut Ware today he still costs us 8.5m in 2014.
Yes, his base would be reduced but he is ALREADY part of your restructure-fest and without that restructure you don't clear the cap space you describe at all.
So the base money you think you reclaim isn't even real because it is already spent.
After we restructure Ware again for the 4th year in a row he will cost us about 500k more on the roster than if we had simply cut him.
Restructuring him is the only way to save money in 2014 and it means pushing even more money to 2015.
We are as tied to him as we were Jay Ratliff.

Miles saves us all of 400k if we cut him next year. We eat 7.85m for cutting him.
So he likely gets asked to take a moderate pay cut which turns into cap savings or he gets released June 2nd.

You really should do less writing and more reading on this subject.
Overthecap and spotrac have good numbers.
heres a link to the CBA: https://www.nflplayers.com/about-us/CBA-Download/

 

[rynochop]

He looked dinged up last night, certainly wasn't impressive at all.

I wonder how the Colts feel about giving up that 1 for Richardson? I know its early, but that's looking pretty bad so far.