Improving at LG

[dfense]

I've stated in previous posts that our line this season was drug down by the play at the LG and RT positions. The players we lost there were much better than the guys who filled in those positions this season. For some reason people on this board (and back on DC) have convinced themselves that Collins played well, when in reality he didn't. We don't have to rehash that debate though and I can only hope that we draft a tackle that can push him.

When it comes to LG though, I have to believe that most people realize that Cooper was trash soup in 2017. Many hoped that his play would elevate between Smith and Frederick but that simply wasn't the case....he's a bad player and we get nothing from him at that position. We could draft a Guard but we already know that we need to draft a Tackle (for depth at the very least) and really can't afford to be picking two OL players, much less hope that we can find two good ones in the draft.

So I want to throw a name out there that I'd like us to go after in free agency: Justin Pugh from the Giants. He was a first round pick of theirs in 2013; he started his career with them as a RT where he performed at an okay level before moving to LG. He was much a much better guard for them his first two years doing it (2015 and 2016) and in fact, he graded out better in 2016 as a LG than Leary did for us in 2016. The kicker is that his 2017 was bad....there could be a ton of explanations for this....he did play through injuries, the Oline talent around him regressed (particularly at Center) and the entire Giants team was a shipwreck in 2017.

I think this could benefit us however....I think his poor 2017 could simply be an anomaly and he could return to form. The Giants don't appear interested in keeping him and we could perhaps get him on a decent deal considering his play last season. I especially like his chances to perform well between Smith and Frederick; I'm at least confident that he outperforms Cooper there. He's 27 and I would certainly be interested in getting him on a 3-4 year deal. Thoughts?

I agree about guard. They need to move Collins back to guard. He's not a tackle. He gets beat by speed and he has a hard time holding his blocks. Start looking for a real RT.

 

[condoin125]

But that doesn't make Pugh the guy. The Giants OL was awful and they don't want to keep him? Does he fix the problem?

The Giants are going into next season with Eli still as the QB...why do we suddenly want to start trusting them to make our personnel decisions?

 

[Nightman]

I'm really confused...so many on this board have complained about our lack of moves in free agency and many of the same people want the team more "Dak friendly." This could be a free agency move that's not too cap heavy and will help protect Dak and create another running lane for Zeke. One of the reasons our line was the best from 2014-2016 was because we could literally run behind every position on the line. We couldn't do that in 2017....and once teams figure that out it makes your entire run game more predictable.

You are severely over-rating Leary and under-rating Cooper

Leary got beat out twice by LCollins and missed a lot time the last 3 years

 

[Nightman]

I agree about guard. They need to move Collins back to guard. He's not a tackle. He gets beat by speed and he has a hard time holding his blocks. Start looking for a real RT.

LCollins only gave up 5 sacks all year against a Murderer's Row of DEs and OLBs

He was more than capable and you don't take strong RTs and make them OGs

 

[condoin125]

You are severely over-rating Leary and under-rating Cooper

Leary got beat out twice by LCollins and missed a lot time the last 3 years

Leary was never beaten by Collins....geez some of you and your pet players kill me. Collins only got the job because Leary hurt his foot or whatever it was in 2015. He only kept the job because the coaching staff was convinced that his potential would blossom with playing time at that position. He has never once beaten Leary for the LG position and Leary's 2014 and 2016 easily out-grade Collin's 2015.

 

[NorthwestDallas40]

I've stated in previous posts that our line this season was drug down by the play at the LG and RT positions. The players we lost there were much better than the guys who filled in those positions this season. For some reason people on this board (and back on DC) have convinced themselves that Collins played well, when in reality he didn't. We don't have to rehash that debate though and I can only hope that we draft a tackle that can push him.

When it comes to LG though, I have to believe that most people realize that Cooper was trash soup in 2017. Many hoped that his play would elevate between Smith and Frederick but that simply wasn't the case....he's a bad player and we get nothing from him at that position. We could draft a Guard but we already know that we need to draft a Tackle (for depth at the very least) and really can't afford to be picking two OL players, much less hope that we can find two good ones in the draft.

So I want to throw a name out there that I'd like us to go after in free agency: Justin Pugh from the Giants. He was a first round pick of theirs in 2013; he started his career with them as a RT where he performed at an okay level before moving to LG. He was much a much better guard for them his first two years doing it (2015 and 2016) and in fact, he graded out better in 2016 as a LG than Leary did for us in 2016. The kicker is that his 2017 was bad....there could be a ton of explanations for this....he did play through injuries, the Oline talent around him regressed (particularly at Center) and the entire Giants team was a shipwreck in 2017.

I think this could benefit us however....I think his poor 2017 could simply be an anomaly and he could return to form. The Giants don't appear interested in keeping him and we could perhaps get him on a decent deal considering his play last season. I especially like his chances to perform well between Smith and Frederick; I'm at least confident that he outperforms Cooper there. He's 27 and I would certainly be interested in getting him on a 3-4 year deal. Thoughts?

I agree that the play of the OL was our primary downfall last year (and Zeke's suspension)... My preference is to take the best available OT at 19 and let him play LG for the first year. OT of that talent level would do great at G. Plus, the guy could be swing OT if necessary. It's quality OL for 5 years at rookie contract.

 

[cowboyec]

if the price is right,Andre Smith,G-Bengals would be my choice.

Id rather get 1 in the draft....Isaish Wynn,G-Georgia would be my choice.

Id be willing to bring Cooper back...whats the news on the knee???

draft is the better option...even then it depends who is on the board.

 

[Johnny23]

We need to stop flip flop ING players from position to position. Let guys settle in Collins needs to stay at RT and keep grinding so he can improve. This modern day microwave society stuff needs to stop. All we need is a swing tackle and starting LG. We have 10 picks we can afford to grab a swing in the middle rounds. Half our picks are in rounds 4 ,& 5.

 

[condoin125]

My preference is to take the best available OT at 19 and let him play LG for the first year. OT of that talent level would do great at G. Plus, the guy could be swing OT if necessary.

Decent idea but it would have to be the right kind of guy to do both....not all tackles make good guards. It would need to be a guy who has the finesse/footwork to play tackle and the strength to play the guard position. And I gotta say that guys who fill out that profile usually go top ten.

 

[Fletch]

I've stated in previous posts that our line this season was drug down by the play at the LG and RT positions. The players we lost there were much better than the guys who filled in those positions this season. For some reason people on this board (and back on DC) have convinced themselves that Collins played well, when in reality he didn't. We don't have to rehash that debate though and I can only hope that we draft a tackle that can push him.

When it comes to LG though, I have to believe that most people realize that Cooper was trash soup in 2017. Many hoped that his play would elevate between Smith and Frederick but that simply wasn't the case....he's a bad player and we get nothing from him at that position. We could draft a Guard but we already know that we need to draft a Tackle (for depth at the very least) and really can't afford to be picking two OL players, much less hope that we can find two good ones in the draft.

So I want to throw a name out there that I'd like us to go after in free agency: Justin Pugh from the Giants. He was a first round pick of theirs in 2013; he started his career with them as a RT where he performed at an okay level before moving to LG. He was much a much better guard for them his first two years doing it (2015 and 2016) and in fact, he graded out better in 2016 as a LG than Leary did for us in 2016. The kicker is that his 2017 was bad....there could be a ton of explanations for this....he did play through injuries, the Oline talent around him regressed (particularly at Center) and the entire Giants team was a shipwreck in 2017.

I think this could benefit us however....I think his poor 2017 could simply be an anomaly and he could return to form. The Giants don't appear interested in keeping him and we could perhaps get him on a decent deal considering his play last season. I especially like his chances to perform well between Smith and Frederick; I'm at least confident that he outperforms Cooper there. He's 27 and I would certainly be interested in getting him on a 3-4 year deal. Thoughts?

Will Hernandez if he’s there at 19. Yep!

 

[John813]

Draft.
If Cooper wants too much find another vet for a cheapish deal

 

[WillieBeamen]

Draft a Guard


Cooper is unreliable and Pugh will be too expensive.


Id really consider Wynn or Hernandez

 

[Nightman]

Leary was never beaten by Collins....geez some of you and your pet players kill me. Collins only got the job because Leary hurt his foot or whatever it was in 2015. He only kept the job because the coaching staff was convinced that his potential would blossom with playing time at that position. He has never once beaten Leary for the LG position and Leary's 2014 and 2016 easily out-grade Collin's 2015.

Twice

 

[Verdict]

I've stated in previous posts that our line this season was drug down by the play at the LG and RT positions. The players we lost there were much better than the guys who filled in those positions this season. For some reason people on this board (and back on DC) have convinced themselves that Collins played well, when in reality he didn't. We don't have to rehash that debate though and I can only hope that we draft a tackle that can push him.

When it comes to LG though, I have to believe that most people realize that Cooper was trash soup in 2017. Many hoped that his play would elevate between Smith and Frederick but that simply wasn't the case....he's a bad player and we get nothing from him at that position. We could draft a Guard but we already know that we need to draft a Tackle (for depth at the very least) and really can't afford to be picking two OL players, much less hope that we can find two good ones in the draft.

So I want to throw a name out there that I'd like us to go after in free agency: Justin Pugh from the Giants. He was a first round pick of theirs in 2013; he started his career with them as a RT where he performed at an okay level before moving to LG. He was much a much better guard for them his first two years doing it (2015 and 2016) and in fact, he graded out better in 2016 as a LG than Leary did for us in 2016. The kicker is that his 2017 was bad....there could be a ton of explanations for this....he did play through injuries, the Oline talent around him regressed (particularly at Center) and the entire Giants team was a shipwreck in 2017.

I think this could benefit us however....I think his poor 2017 could simply be an anomaly and he could return to form. The Giants don't appear interested in keeping him and we could perhaps get him on a decent deal considering his play last season. I especially like his chances to perform well between Smith and Frederick; I'm at least confident that he outperforms Cooper there. He's 27 and I would certainly be interested in getting him on a 3-4 year deal. Thoughts?

Pugh was a guy we targeted in the draft but he was drafted before we could draft him. I think that was a blessing in disguise.

He was pretty bad as an OT, and he really wasn't a very good guard either. Since the OL functions as a unit it is possible he would play better with our line than he did with the Giants.

Having said that I hope he is not someone who we would spend real free agency dollars to acquire. It should be some sort of show me deal with a cheap exit if it turns out he sucks as bad as his prior play suggests he does. Maybe an incentive laden deal. One year prove it deal with a team option for. Second year might be a good deal if he pans out.

 

[phildadon86]

I guess if you want to go with a guy who gives up regular pressure every game and who we are completely unable to run behind.

I don't know what you were watching this season, but there were times when Cooper was the PFF highest graded player on the field.

 

[Gameover]

I’m not a fan of Collins

Cowboys actually lost when they won the Collins sweepstakes

 

[CyberB0b]

We need depth on the o-line. I think the starters are fine.

 

[Kaiser]

Cooper is fine for another cheap year

Draft an OG/C and groom him for 2019

Agree, plus you keep your eyes open for an OG that is cut for cap room. Cooper wasn't trash like the OP claims but I would definitely upgrade from him if the opportunity presented itself.

Also I think Kadeem Edwards could be a sleeper that is on the 53 in 2018 and starts in 2019. Leary was a practice squad guy his first year, OL take time to develop unless you are a physical monster like Tyron or Fred.

 

[dwreck27]

There has to be someone in FA that will look a hell of a lot better next to Tyron and Fred...


Im sorry we have enough money invested on offense... We need to start putting premium dollars into defesive difference makers

Offense sales jerseys... defense will win championships

 

[Stash]

I've stated in previous posts that our line this season was drug down by the play at the LG and RT positions. The players we lost there were much better than the guys who filled in those positions this season. For some reason people on this board (and back on DC) have convinced themselves that Collins played well, when in reality he didn't. We don't have to rehash that debate though and I can only hope that we draft a tackle that can push him.

When it comes to LG though, I have to believe that most people realize that Cooper was trash soup in 2017. Many hoped that his play would elevate between Smith and Frederick but that simply wasn't the case....he's a bad player and we get nothing from him at that position. We could draft a Guard but we already know that we need to draft a Tackle (for depth at the very least) and really can't afford to be picking two OL players, much less hope that we can find two good ones in the draft.

So I want to throw a name out there that I'd like us to go after in free agency: Justin Pugh from the Giants. He was a first round pick of theirs in 2013; he started his career with them as a RT where he performed at an okay level before moving to LG. He was much a much better guard for them his first two years doing it (2015 and 2016) and in fact, he graded out better in 2016 as a LG than Leary did for us in 2016. The kicker is that his 2017 was bad....there could be a ton of explanations for this....he did play through injuries, the Oline talent around him regressed (particularly at Center) and the entire Giants team was a shipwreck in 2017.

I think this could benefit us however....I think his poor 2017 could simply be an anomaly and he could return to form. The Giants don't appear interested in keeping him and we could perhaps get him on a decent deal considering his play last season. I especially like his chances to perform well between Smith and Frederick; I'm at least confident that he outperforms Cooper there. He's 27 and I would certainly be interested in getting him on a 3-4 year deal. Thoughts?

I completely disagree with everything being said here.