Interesting stat

[Typhus]

Last year the LOS did not get stuffed like it is this year.

True, but last year we weren't implementing two new pieces.
Leary and Free while very consistent had low floors.
Green, Collins.. maybe Cooper high ceilings.
In this league you cant ever keep it all together, always change, every year.
Yes I would have loved to have retained Leary, but good teams roll with the upside "ceiling" talent in this NFL.
I like the "ceiling" in Green, Collins.. maybe Cooper.
Free was done, and Leary is on his last year probably, already had issues with his degenerative knee condition in Denver.

 

[Stash]

I'm assuming Chaz Green isn't yet clicking between Fredrick and TSmith.

He's not. The tape is out there to see.

And he's gonna be hated when Aaron Donald roughs him up this week.

 

[Stash]

I don't get this urban legend that has formed here on CZ that Collins did great against Von Miller.

Von Miller had registered a grand total of 0 sacks in his previous 5 games before the Dallas game.

Von Miller beat Collins for 2 sacks in that game.

I get that both of them happened in the latter stages of the game when Denver was pinning their ears back... having said that, I just don't know on what planet anybody can reasonable say Collins dominated Miller or was awesome against Miller.

Who's ever said what you're claiming?

I've never seen anyone say that. Not once.

Unless you can provide some proof and some quotes, that's a strawman argument.

 

[perrykemp]

Who's ever said what you're claiming?

I've never seen anyone say that. Not once.

Unless you can provide some proof and some quotes, that's a strawman argument.

My post included a quote where the previous poster had said Collins was awesome vs Miller.

 

[Idgit]

Not accurate.

They were pass happy from beginning to end, no matter the score.

We actually started that game run-run-pass, then gave up the quick touchdown.

Second series we converted one first down passing on two plays, then ran it, got a penalty, and were forced into a passing situation again.

8 yards on 9 attempts tells you all you really need to know about the efficiency of running the ball in that DEN game. Rushing another 10 times, if we'd somehow managed to earn the extra snaps needed to do so, was never going to break that game open.

 

[Idgit]

My post included a quote where the previous poster had said Collins was awesome vs Miller.

No, you're definitely right. People understandably loved him from the start for coming to Dallas. They loved him at LG and thought he'd be even better at RT. The reality is, he's very talented physically and fairly inconsistent with his play.

Part of it is loyalty to the guy because he picked us. Part of it is a desire to validate how much of an improvement he was going to be to Doug Free. It's weird, though, that he gets such a pass from fans where a guy who was similarly loyal and who we were similarly lucky to get on the roster in Terrence Williams is either ignored or has become a target when he's actually a significantly more consistent player at his position.

 

[robjay04]

Not accurate.

They were pass happy from beginning to end, no matter the score.

Irrelevant. I’m not sure what you’re trying to prove. We passed some early to keep the Broncos from stacking the box...we failed to make them pay and before we knew it, it was 35-10 which essentially eliminated running the ball.

Obviously our game plan did not consist of Dak passing 50 times. The Broncos dictated that. Obviously you can’t take 3 games worth of stats and compare them to 16 games.

 

[Stash]

My post included a quote where the previous poster had said Collins was awesome vs Miller.

Ugh! My bad.

 

[Stash]

We actually started that game run-run-pass, then gave up the quick touchdown.

Second series we converted one first down passing on two plays, then ran it, got a penalty, and were forced into a passing situation again.

8 yards on 9 attempts tells you all you really need to know about the efficiency of running the ball in that DEN game. Rushing another 10 times, if we'd somehow managed to earn the extra snaps needed to do so, was never going to break that game open.

9 attempts for the NFL's leading rusher tells me all I need to know. I've watched the game and gone over the play by play. The fact is that it's inexcusable to run so few times, especially against the best corners in the league.

 

[Stash]

Irrelevant. I’m not sure what you’re trying to prove. We passed some early to keep the Broncos from stacking the box...we failed to make them pay and before we knew it, it was 35-10 which essentially eliminated running the ball.

Obviously our game plan did not consist of Dak passing 50 times. The Broncos dictated that. Obviously you can’t take 3 games worth of stats and compare them to 16 games.

Completely "relevant". You want to magically make the game "35-10" nothing right off the bat when that's not close to what happened. You're searching in your head to excuse the inexcusable.

And "obviously" you can't misrepresent what happened to cover for abysmal playcalling and abandoning your strengths.

 

[Typhus]

9 attempts for the NFL's leading rusher tells me all I need to know. I've watched the game and gone over the play by play. The fact is that it's inexcusable to run so few times, especially against the best corners in the league.

I agree with you, its was just a bad game altogether, bad game plan.
Just plowing it up into the log jam wasn't effective, but we kept trying to run right there.
Would have loved to have seen a heavy dose of screen heavy...
Don't care if it would have been slip screens
Bubble Screens,
Just get some speed in space, against a heavy contain blitz all day.
How do you not recognize and adjust to a containment defensive game plan,,,

 

[Idgit]

9 attempts for the NFL's leading rusher tells me all I need to know. I've watched the game and gone over the play by play. The fact is that it's inexcusable to run so few times, especially against the best corners in the league.

It doesn't tell you all you need to know, though. You're missing the '8 yards' part. It tells you all you want to know, sure.

66 offensive snaps, 12 real possessions. 5 offensive penalties. Just how many downs you going to give to a rushing game that's netting you one yard/carry? How many 2nd and 3rd and longs you want to put your passing game in?

 

[Stash]

I agree with you, its was just a bad game altogether, bad game plan.
Just plowing it up into the log jam wasn't effective, but we kept trying to run right there.
Would have loved to have seen a heavy dose of screen heavy...
Don't care if it would have been slip screens
Bubble Screens,
Just get some speed in space, against a heavy contain blitz all day.
How do you not recognize and adjust to a containment defensive game plan,,,

The playcalling in that game was sickening. But it's the same issue I've had with Leinehan since he's been here, and Garrett's playcalling before that.

Both have an awful tendency of losing patience with their running game and abandoning it. And, given the parts here, the investments made, and the track record of success, there's zero excuse for it.

And I'm not going to listen to revisionist history from fans trying to make excuses for it. It's embarrassing.

 

[Stash]

It doesn't tell you all you need to know, though. You're missing the '8 yards' part. It tells you all you want to know, sure.

66 offensive snaps, 12 real possessions. 5 offensive penalties. Just how many downs you going to give to a rushing game that's netting you one yard/carry? How many 2nd and 3rd and longs you want to put your passing game in?

I'll pull up the play by play for you if you need a refresher. They never made an honest effort to run the ball. You, me, and everyone else knows how a running game works. Small run, small run, big run. It requires patience sometimes. Patience Linehan lacks.

 

[Outlaw Heroes]

No, you're definitely right. People understandably loved him from the start for coming to Dallas. They loved him at LG and thought he'd be even better at RT. The reality is, he's very talented physically and fairly inconsistent with his play.

Part of it is loyalty to the guy because he picked us. Part of it is a desire to validate how much of an improvement he was going to be to Doug Free. It's weird, though, that he gets such a pass from fans where a guy who was similarly loyal and who we were similarly lucky to get on the roster in Terrence Williams is either ignored or has become a target when he's actually a significantly more consistent player at his position.

A big part of it is that Collins has flashed (though only flashed) the ability to dominate. His YouTube highlights consisting of a number of pancake blocks are impressive.

Williams has been a useful piece but has never shown hints of dominant ability that would get fans salivating and overrating his play generally.

In what sense were we lucky to get Williams on the roster, btw?

 

[Typhus]

The playcalling in that game was sickening. But it's the same issue I've had with Leinehan since he's been here, and Garrett's playcalling before that.

Both have an awful tendency of losing patience with their running game and abandoning it. And, given the parts here, the investments made, and the track record of success, there's zero excuse for it.

And I'm not going to listen to revisionist history from fans trying to make excuses for it. It's embarrassing.

IMO Stash its been an inability to "adjust" the game plan when the original game plan fails.
Its been this teams enigma for a while now.
It just seems from a casual viewer that we are getting it handed to us, but for those that study this team and know the talent,,
adjustments can counter what teams like Denver throw at us..
The Bills just handed the Donks a beat down...

 

[Stash]

IMO Stash its been an inability to "adjust" the game plan when the original game plan fails.
Its been this teams enigma for a while now.
It just seems from a casual viewer that we are getting it handed to us, but for those that study this team and know the talent,,
adjustments can counter what teams like Denver throw at us..
The Bills just handed the Donks a beat down...

And I'll say it again, given the investment made there and the overall talent. There's no excuse for it whatsoever.

Exactly how much better do you need to be talent-wise for you to outperform the other team?

Name me one area offensively where the Bills are better than the Cowboys?

Inexcusable.

 

[Typhus]

And I'll say it again, given the investment made there and the overall talent. There's no excuse for it whatsoever.

Exactly how much better do you need to be talent-wise for you to outperform the other team?

Name me one area offensively where the Bills are better than the Cowboys?

Inexcusable.

I don't know Stash

Maybe 5280...

 

[Idgit]

A big part of it is that Collins has flashed (though only flashed) the ability to dominate. His YouTube highlights consisting of a number of pancake blocks are impressive.

Williams has been a useful piece but has never shown hints of dominant ability that would get fans salivating and overrating his play generally.

In what sense were we lucky to get Williams on the roster, btw?

Collins definitely has had his share of impressive plays. But then, so has Williams, with this toe-tap catches (see the SEA game in 2014) and the big plays he's delivered on crossing routes.

We weren't nearly as lucky to get him on the roster as we were with Collins, but I was referencing that we essentially got him for 'free' when we moved down to net Frederick and a 3rd rounder. He was an extra draft pick that year. And then he did sign the extension early and under market because he just wanted to be here, similar to the gesture Collins made when he came in. So, he's put his money where his mouth is, at least.

 

[Idgit]

I'll pull up the play by play for you if you need a refresher. They never made an honest effort to run the ball. You, me, and everyone else knows how a running game works. Small run, small run, big run. It requires patience sometimes. Patience Linehan lacks.

I pulled the play by play already when illustrating what the problems actually were, but knock yourself out if you want to point out where we should have run instead of thrown it.

The problem with your assumption about how a running game works is that it ignores all the times when the running game doesn't actually work. Like when your'e playing a team that can essentially lock down your three best WRs with their 3 best CBs and then make you beat them running the ball against everybody else when you're spotting them 9 plays that go nowhere and 5 that go backwards and 2 turnovers in your 12 legitimate possessions.