It's October and the division is already lost

[Sydla]

If you do not have a clue on what Elliot meant to last years Cowboy's team, I don't know what to tell you.

That's not really what is meant by moving the goal posts.

Nevertheless, I've been actually pretty clear on this for awhile. I didn't think they should have drafted Elliott. I've long held the position that Prescott's performance was more important to the team's success last year than Elliott's. Doesn't mean I think Elliott is a bad player or wasn't a key member of the team.

But I think people go overboard thinking that the 2016 season was basically all due to the drafting of Elliott. As I said, I think if you paired McFadden/Morris with Prescott last year you would have won more games than if you had paired Elliott with Kellen Moore last year.

I firmly believe QB play is the most important single player in terms of wins and losses over a full season.

 

[Them]

"It's October and the division is already lost" ...that is a possibility...but I believe it's way to early in the season to make that assumption!
You must know that things can change very quickly from game to game to game...the NYGs win over Denver is an excellent example!
Until I see more I'll stay a "Homer" and continue to hope that the Boys pull it out....even without Eze...who should be back for the playoffs....PLAYOFFS!?!

 

[jjktkk]

That's not really what is meant by moving the goal posts.

Its exactly what it means.

But I think people go overboard thinking that the 2016 season was basically all due to the drafting of Elliott.

Quit trying to make something up I never said, not once.

 

[jobberone]

Comparing schedules is fraught with problems. The Eagles will be hard to catch because they have a two game lead and historically a 5-1 start generally makes the playoffs and often that means winning the East. Winning the East should always be the first goal of the team. But we are still in the hunt. We just need to take care of business winning our East games.

 

[Sydla]

Its exactly what it means.


Quit trying to make something up I never said, not once.

Actually it doesn't mean that at all.

Moving the goalposts (or shifting the goalposts) is a metaphor, derived from association football or other games, that means to change the criterion (goal) of a process or competition while still in progress, in such a way that the new goal offers one side an intentional advantage or disadvantage.

I did none of these things. In fact, I've been consistent throughout all of this. I think Prescott's superb play was a bigger factor in the 2016 season than Elliott's running. I didn't suddenly just decide that Prescott was more valuable to win a debate in this thread.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Who? Elliott?

It's hard to quantify how many wins he gave us. I mean how many wins does he give us last year if his QB is Kellen Moore and not Dak Prescott?

Personally, I think this team would win more games with Dak + McFadden/Morris than if it were Kellen Moore + Elliott. That's not to say that Elliott isn't a fine player and that he and Dak give us the greatest chance at winning games.

It's just that I think people completely overvalue how important Elliott was to our season last year. To me, Dak was the MVP, not Elliott.

That's because Kellen Moore sucks. Zeke will win you games with a competent starter.

Teams respected Zeke. Teams will do everything they can not to let him beat you. He's a playmaker.

Now if in hindsight you want to say we should've waited a year and got Cook or the back in KC? Fair enough. But I don't know what this team would be without Zeke. I've seen what it was with him and it got us in the post season.

 

[cowboyblue22]

as I said in another thread this division was lost in the off season

 

[JoeKing]

Actually it doesn't mean that at all.

Moving the goalposts (or shifting the goalposts) is a metaphor, derived from association football or other games, that means to change the criterion (goal) of a process or competition while still in progress, in such a way that the new goal offers one side an intentional advantage or disadvantage.

I did none of these things. In fact, I've been consistent throughout all of this. I think Prescott's superb play was a bigger factor in the 2016 season than Elliott's running. I didn't suddenly just decide that Prescott was more valuable to win a debate in this thread.

So you move the goal post then you try to redefine what you just did thinking because your new definition matters you didn't really do it. You really did was give the term delusional a whole new meaning... it now has your picture next to it.

 

[jjktkk]

Actually it doesn't mean that at all.

Moving the goalposts (or shifting the goalposts) is a metaphor, derived from association football or other games, that means to change the criterion (goal) of a process or competition while still in progress, in such a way that the new goal offers one side an intentional advantage or disadvantage.

I did none of these things. In fact, I've been consistent throughout all of this. I think Prescott's superb play was a bigger factor in the 2016 season than Elliott's running. I didn't suddenly just decide that Prescott was more valuable to win a debate in this thread.

Keep clicking your heels Dorothy, whatever is in your head will magically come true.

 

[big dog cowboy]

We dumped too many players

For what they got paid, the Cowboys made the right decision.

 

[Sydla]

So you move the goal post then you try to redefine what you just did thinking because your new definition matters you didn't really do it. You really did was give the term delusional a whole new meaning... it now has your picture next to it.

I didn't "redefine" anything. I just defined it.

But since you want to jump into the fray, explain exactly how I "moved the goal posts" here. Don't run and hide. Explain what goal posts I moved here.

 

[Sydla]

Keep clicking your heels Dorothy, whatever is in your head will magically come true.

I'll ask the same question. What goal posts did I move?

 

[cml750]

I should have simply expected us to be as good or better than last year. That should always be the goal. With our coach I knew better. I expected 8 - 8 or worse based on history. So far I look like a genius.

 

[JoeKing]

I didn't "redefine" anything. I just defined it.

But since you want to jump into the fray, explain exactly how I "moved the goal posts" here. Don't run and hide. Explain what goal posts I moved here.

How many wins Elliott is good for was clearly the topic being discussed and you dodged answering the question by trying to change the topic to how many wins Dak is good for.

 

[drawandstrike]

It's not how a team starts. It's how a team finishes.

The final 8 games will tell us a lot about who goes in the playoffs and who doesn't.

We dropped 2 close, winnable games by a total of 9 points, and everybody writes this season off.

I've been following the NFL since 1979. It ain't over yet by a long shot.

 

[Sydla]

How many wins Elliott is good for was clearly the topic being discussed and you dodged answering the question by trying to change the topic to how many wins Dak is good for.

LOL. Geezus.

 

[Stash]

For what they got paid, the Cowboys made the right decision.

In some cases maybe, not all.

They could have kept Terell McClain for close to or less than what they decided to pay for Cedric Thornton and Stephen Paea, neither of whom isn't here anymore contributing anything.

They also could have retained either Carr or Claiborne for one to two million more than what they wasted on Nolan Carroll, who also isn't here anymore contributing anything.

Those aren't simply diminishing returns, they're no returns.

Some decisions, like Ron Leary simply weren't manageable. Others, like I mentioned, were simply awful decisions and complete busts.

 

[jjktkk]

In some cases maybe, not all.

They could have kept Terell McClain for close to or less than what they decided to pay for Cedric Thornton and Stephen Paea, neither of whom isn't here anymore contributing anything.

They also could have retained either Carr or Claiborne for one to two million more than what they wasted on Nolan Carroll, who also isn't here anymore contributing anything.

Those aren't simply diminishing returns, they're no returns.

Some decisions, like Ron Leary simply weren't manageable. Others, like I mentioned, were simply awful decisions and complete busts.

Your hindsight analysis is way off. McClain could not stay healthy enough to be relied upon, neither could Claiborne. Carr while solid, could not produce enough take aways. You're lamenting the loss of 3 mediocre players who are now playing well for their new teams, but for various reasons, could not produce enough while they were with the Cowboys. C'mon Stash, you're better than that.

 

[Stash]

Your hindsight analysis is way off.

No, it actually completely accurate.

McClain could not stay healthy enough to be relied upon, neither could Claiborne.

And yet, here's McClain, still playing, and the not one, but two guys brought in to replace him are gone. One to another team, and the other whose health forced him to stop playing. Both options worse than McClain possibly missing time. Worse, not better.

And say what you will about Claiborne's awful injury history (all true), the team got one game out of Carroll before he was done. One. Claiborne is still playing for the Jets.

Carr while solid, could not produce enough take aways.

How many did Carroll produce?

This is about going from disappointing results to absolutely nothing. And another question to ask yourself, how is it that Carr has more takeaways in three weeks in Baltimore than he did in three years in Dallas?

You're lamenting the loss of 3 mediocre players who are now playing well for their new teams, but for various reasons, could not produce enough while they were with the Cowboys. C'mon Stash, you're better than that.

Nothing "better" about it. It's all worse. Much worse. Every move they had to make was botched. And the team now pays the price.

Keep McClain? No, they chose to get nothing from Thornton and Paea instead. And now have a gaping hole at the 1-tech.

Keep Carr or Claiborne? No, they chose Carroll instead. And got nothing to show for it.

Draft TJ Watt or Taco Charlton? We all know how that decision looks.

Virtually every change they've made to this team has been markedly worse, not better.

That's the painful reality of the situation and people should be held accountable.

 

[Prossman]

Nothing "realistic" about thinking this sorry Cowboys team will suddenly turn things around and compete, simply because fans want them to either.

"Any objective, unemotional observer would agree."

You are such a wimp. My God stop with the sniffling dribble. Washington beats Philly and we beat the 49ers we are one game out of first.... Go be a eagle fans since they are so wonderful. Plus we still have to play them twice...